[frozenOx]

Not sure I agree about the 6XX vs R70x soundstage comparison that was written up above. Neither are particularly wide, with the 6xx being slightly more intimate and definitely have the Sennheiser 3 blob (L/R/Center). The mids on the 6XX are more detailed. Both benefit from an amp. Not that they can't be driven from lower powered sources, but if you look at the impedance graphs you'll see there are spikes at certain frequencies (basically need more power for the lowest and highest extremities). I.e. it's subtle but you'll get a fuller sound with adequate power. JDS Atom works well for both with me.

I too did not keep the 6XX as I wanted an all rounder, and the 6XX just doesn't play well with some genres or mixes. But when it does, it's a small step above the R70x in my opinion. For example, Fleetwood Mac on the 6XX is incredible. Anything with sub bass is not. I did not care for classical music on the 6XX either.

Right now I swap between the Grado 325X and the R70X. Grado hits that live acoustic feel out of the park for jazz and classical, and often on classic rock. The R70X covers everything else and is just a phenomenal wear all day, listen to anything, with no fatigue, headphone. I have Shure Alcantara pads on mine right now. There are a few pads you can swap on the R70X that sound good, mostly need to stick to a similar size and material as the original pads. Alcantaras seem to be the best and closest thing I've found, but some big round micro suedes work too.

 

[Shane D]

Not sure I agree about the 6XX vs R70x soundstage comparison that was written up above. Neither are particularly wide, with the 6xx being slightly more intimate and definitely have the Sennheiser 3 blob (L/R/Center). The mids on the 6XX are more detailed. Both benefit from an amp. Not that they can't be driven from lower powered sources, but if you look at the impedance graphs you'll see there are spikes at certain frequencies (basically need more power for the lowest and highest extremities). I.e. it's subtle but you'll get a fuller sound with adequate power. JDS Atom works well for both with me.

I too did not keep the 6XX as I wanted an all rounder, and the 6XX just doesn't play well with some genres or mixes. But when it does, it's a small step above the R70x in my opinion. For example, Fleetwood Mac on the 6XX is incredible. Anything with sub bass is not. I did not care for classical music on the 6XX either.

Right now I swap between the Grado 325X and the R70X. Grado hits that live acoustic feel out of the park for jazz and classical, and often on classic rock. The R70X covers everything else and is just a phenomenal wear all day, listen to anything, with no fatigue, headphone. I have Shure Alcantara pads on mine right now. There are a few pads you can swap on the R70X that sound good, mostly need to stick to a similar size and material as the original pads. Alcantaras seem to be the best and closest thing I've found, but some big round micro suedes work too.

My initial reaction is that I prefer the HD660S2's. But I have only had them for about a month and I only got the R70X's yesterday, so...

 

[frozenOx]

My initial reaction is that I prefer the HD660S2's. But I have only had them for about a month and I only got the R70X's yesterday, so...

I probably would as well, I just can't wear Sennheiser for very long. I've yet to try a pair that didn't clamp my head even after weeks. You can't really adjust them very much because of the plastic.

 

[kman1211]

My initial reaction is that I prefer the HD660S2's. But I have only had them for about a month and I only got the R70X's yesterday, so...

I thought the S2 was better in many ways than the R70x, if the S2 didn't fatigue me I would've kept them, though I could've gotten one with a slight channel imbalance. I'll revisit them in the future. I personally like the mids a little more on the HD 6xx series than the R70x. Though I wouldn't notice the mids being a bit better unless I directly compared them to a HD 6xx headphone. The R70x is better in many ways to the HD 600, 650, and 660S but it does suffer slightly in mids in comparison. I feel technically the S2 pulls ahead. Though I personally like the mids on some Beyers more than the Senns, but many Beyers do have a more recessed midrange which can make people overlook their midrange performance. Some may think I'm crazy but I prefer the mids and vocals of my T1.3 to my HD 650, HD 660S, and R70x.

 

[Shane D]

I probably would as well, I just can't wear Sennheiser for very long. I've yet to try a pair that didn't clamp my head even after weeks. You can't really adjust them very much because of the plastic.

I always find the clamp goes away after a few weeks. Have you tried stretching them over a few books? Maybe just several inches bigger than your head?

 

[Shane D]

I thought the S2 was better in many ways than the R70x, if the S2 didn't fatigue me I would've kept them, though I could've gotten one with a slight channel imbalance. I'll revisit them in the future. I personally like the mids a little more on the HD 6xx series than the R70x. Though I wouldn't notice the mids being a bit better unless I directly compared them to a HD 6xx headphone. The R70x is better in many ways to the HD 600, 650, and 660S but it does suffer slightly in mids in comparison. I feel technically the S2 pulls ahead. Though I personally like the mids on some Beyers more than the Senns, but many Beyers do have a more recessed midrange which can make people overlook their midrange performance. Some may think I'm crazy but I prefer the mids and vocals of my T1.3 to my HD 650, HD 660S, and R70x.

To me, my mids and vocals kings are the Grado GH2's and the Focal Clear's.
But the HD660S2's are burrowing their way into the collection.

 

[Corti]

Not sure I agree about the 6XX vs R70x soundstage comparison that was written up above. Neither are particularly wide

Well, I agree that both are not particularly wide on an absolute basis. What I meant was that the 6XX is too wide in a relative sense to the depth. The L and R appear to me in a 90 degree angle on the Senns making me experience the music too far to the sides, instead of unfolding in front of me. Meanwhile it's more like a 70 degree angle on the R70x left and right. See image below (maybe a bit exaggerated to make the point clearer).

 

[SlhDub]

I have only briefly auditioned the HD560S some time ago and didn’t find the sound that great. Do you have a specific example (preferably with music-link) which, on the 560S, sounds amazing and when it sounds sterile and thin? I could then give you my opinion on such songs on the R70x.

Thanks!

Bad sounding:
1 - On this one the trumpet is way too shouty i need to turn the volume way down:


2 - This one is a bit of a mess cant really distinguish much the instruments in the background, shouty and foggy:


3 - This one is the same pretty messy and raspy spunding cant tell whats going on in there.


Good sounding:
1 - This one sounds great! sub bass is there punchy, mids and treble are spot on everything balanced, using oratory eq gives it even more thump:


2- This one sounds great aswell:


3 - This trip hop track sounds very good on the HD560s: plenty of sub bass and bass, mids and treble a tiny smidge forward but ballanced overall:

 

[Corti]

Thanks!

Bad sounding:
1 - On this one the trumpet is way too shouty i need to turn the volume way down:


2 - This one is a bit of a mess cant really distinguish much the instruments in the background, shouty and foggy:


3 - This one is the same pretty messy and raspy spunding cant tell whats going on in there.


Good sounding:
1 - This one sounds great! sub bass is there punchy, mids and treble are spot on everything balanced, using oratory eq gives it even more thump:


2- This one sounds great aswell:


3 - This trip hop track sounds very good on the HD560s: plenty of sub bass and bass, mids and treble a tiny smidge forward but ballanced overall:

Alright, i'll have a listen on my AT's and maybe when I find the time also on my other phones.
Luckily i have spotify premium too, so i can listen on the highest quality

 

[Shane D]

Today I am going deep down the blues hole with my great blues collection: 50 years of Alligator Records.



And doing it tube style:

 

[Corti]

Thanks!

Bad sounding:
1 - On this one the trumpet is way too shouty i need to turn the volume way down:


2 - This one is a bit of a mess cant really distinguish much the instruments in the background, shouty and foggy:


3 - This one is the same pretty messy and raspy spunding cant tell whats going on in there.


Good sounding:
1 - This one sounds great! sub bass is there punchy, mids and treble are spot on everything balanced, using oratory eq gives it even more thump:


2- This one sounds great aswell:


3 - This trip hop track sounds very good on the HD560s: plenty of sub bass and bass, mids and treble a tiny smidge forward but ballanced overall:

Ok, as promised I’ve listened in on your tracks. It was actually quite fun, I rarely compare my headphones this directly. Here are my impression:

Blur -Song2:
Sounds ok on R70x, nothing hurts but nothing stands out either. Rather boring.
Sounds even worse on the Sundaras as it tries to dissect the track, but there is only mush Whenever you throw bad, mushy music at the Sundaras it will sound really bad (at least in my experience).
The 6XX does surprisingly well here. The warmth from its tuning gives the distorted guitars a pleasant touch. Enjoyable on these.

Romb Zombies Dragula Remix:
Similar to the last one. Sounds bad on all ‘phones. A headphone just cant magically transform a bad recording/production into a pleasant listen. So an upgrade wont help with this kind of stuff.

Doxy:
This one is actually quite interesting in the comparison of the 3 ‘phones.
With the R70x the trumpet is a tad too loud as well, but it’s probably intented to be, bc it’s the main element of the song. And I even like that the Drums are a little quieter, it gives the impression that the Drums are behind the trumpeter on an imaginary stage.

With the 6XX the trumpet sounds very organic, but the soundstage which I criticized already ruins the experience placing the Drums too far to the sides (stop surrounding me!)..
The Sundara rendered the trumpet with the most natural timbre. Also the trumpet appears not as forward as with the other headphones because of Sundaras boosted treble (leading to the hi hats coming forward a little, but not too much).
For me it’s a draw between AT and the Hifiman , depending on what i currently want in the music.

Now to the “Good songs”:

Massive Attack I against I:
You say everything is balanced on your HD560s and the bass has a good punch.

I noticed the same with the R70x.
Sundaras reproduced a cleaner Bass but it was too recessed for my liking. So w/o EQ I liked it more on the ATs , but with EQ (Bassshelf) the Sundara takes the cake. Additionally The Rap from Most Definitely is cleaner on the latter (Hip Hop in general sounds surprisingly good on the Hifimans (when boosting the bass a little), could listen to CunninLynguists on them for hours).

Daydreamin:
Yep it sounds good on all 3. And I found it the most balanced on the 6XX actually (with the only downside being too less Subbass (which is unfortunarely not really fixable with EQ, bc the Senns don’t respond well to Bassshelving IMO, it just distorts.).
With the R70x the snares were a bit too loud (mainly bc of its 1k-2k forwardness).
Sundara reproduced a very pleasant full-bodied Bass-response only heard in planar magnetics, which would be excellent with a 2-3db Bassshelf. However the treble appeared a bit too sharp for me on this track.

Lastly Nobody:
The Treble is too forward/prominent on all 3 phones for me. The piano sounds the best on the 6XX and on the R70x had a weird sharpness to it. But the vocals sound better on R70x and less veiled/disconnected than on the 6XX. Bass also better on R70x due to more extension and Subbass impact.
On the Sundara the treble is way too loud/sharp, the rest is fine. The R70x wins the last one with some EQ tweaks to take control of the mids.

So then, adressing your initial question if R70x would be an upgrade to yur HD560S.. looking at oratory FR graphs the R70x should be a lot darker sounding due to that recessed Treble response and a richer Mid- and SUbbass performance (i think i remember the 560S being too bright for me). But only judging by FR is not gonna do it justice. So I think it’ll depend on what you want from an “upgrade” or “side-grade”. If you want something less bright/analytical than 560S, the R70x could be it. If you want something more sparkly up top, with a unique planar magnetic Bass, Sundara might be worth a try.
But there are, of course, many more options. Good luck on your journey!

 

[Shane D]

Well, I am wrapping up day seven with my new friends, the R70X's.
As usual, it was a bit of shock changing headphones. In this case I went from my most expensive headphone so far, the Focal Radiance, to the cheapest headphone I have bought in years, the (used) ATH-R70X.

Initial reactions were/are:
A) I like the look of them. Very simple.
B) I wasn't sure about the wings, but I never feel them at all, so I guess they work very well.
C) I like the overall sound and there is enough bass when called upon.
D) They were pretty easy to drive with all of my desktop options. They do NOT work well with my phone and dongle combo (FiiO KA5).
E) I can NOT say this loudly enough or strongly enough: These are the most comfortable headphones I have ever touched, picked up or used!

The only downside to me is in the sound. It is not very detailed to my ears. I would say the same in regards to imaging and separation. I am really not very good with technical descriptions though. The music comes to me as one sound. I really can't pick out the guitar work, horn work, backing vocals, etc.
I am guessing that is probably to do with the very affordable pricing.
Also, I found the treble could get a little sharp with my horn jazz. But for most of my listening; new rock, classic rock, pop, blues, etc. They are just fine. You will not be listening analytically, but most folks have other 'phones for that, if so inclined.

Most of my headphones I would rate between 8 and 9 on a 1-10 scale, at this point. These might slide down to a 7-7.5, based on technicalities.
Using the same scale, I would have to give these a solid 13 on comfort.

Every so often I like to pick up a used cheapie and see what all the fuss was/is about. You usually don't lose much money and it ticks another one off the list and you move along. I am going to give these a few more turns through the rotation. The sound is fine, the comfort is sublime and they were dirt cheap. Unless you're a high end/HiFi guy these are worth taking a look at.

Unlike some here, I almost NEVER have a problem with headphone fit and if I do, Nuggets to the rescue. If you fall into this category, Check out the R70X's!

PS: My favourite pairing was with the Violectric V220. The iFi Pro iCAN didn't impress much until I changed the mode to SS, which I never use. That made a large difference.
The tube amps were great but the sound got even less precise, as tube amps do.

 

[llysender]

I would like to say that the R70X is plenty detailed but then I cant find my stock cable and tbh even canare OFC makes a big improvement.

 

[kman1211]

I would like to say that the R70X is plenty detailed but then I cant find my stock cable and tbh even canare OFC makes a big improvement.

I haven't tried other cables, but I do get the feeling it does hold it back, just not sure how much it is. Something is holding it back because sometimes I find they are kinda meh technically and other times show a good amount of insight with surprisingly good technicalities.

 

[Shane D]

I haven't tried other cables, but I do get the feeling it does hold it back, just not sure how much it is. Something is holding it back because sometimes I find they are kinda meh technically and other times show a good amount of insight with surprisingly good technicalities.

If I was to keep them, I would order a Hart modular cable which might improve the detail. Or not. I like the sound, but it is not in the category of high-end Grado's, Focal's or HiFiman's. I am sure the high end model Audio Technica's are much better and more detailed.

For the price (and comfort) involved, these are just fine. If I keep them and order a Hart cable I will comment on any differences on here. I have never needed any 2.5mm cables that I can recall in over 40 sets of headphones.