[Shane D]

Hmmm @Shane D Your phone and dap should be able to get them loud enough since its 99dB/(god knows what unit since AT forgot to put in the specs but I can run them off my Xiaomi phone 3.5mm loud enough), might be a tad too bassy though since underpowered the subbass tends to distort giving more body to the sound.

Hmmm Im very against ghost since it sounded quite lowfi and grainy everything Ive heard it but apperently if you spend more money(or just use hifiman's sergical tube cable as a temp cable) on a new cable apperently it becomes quite ok for the price.

I was looking at buying the Ghost headphones with a set of angled Brainwavz pads. Supposed to be great and MUCH less than the Meze pads. Total landed cost for both is $225.00.

Or, I can get a used set of R70X's for $250.00.
All in Canuck bucks.

 

[TheDreamthinker]

Thank you for the link for the pads. I don’t think it’s worth to buy other 2 . But you can try Hi-Fi man see if you like . But hd6 are too similar, and not really meaningful better or worse . I think people who bought the r70x could think of a big bass v shape headphones.mdr-z7 kinds ? That’s really meaningful side grade .

Thanks for the opinion. I also doubt the other two are substantially better.
My next upgrade will hopefully be something more for dedicated listening.

50mW @ 32Ohm is not gonna be enough for decent volume levels with the R70x.
My BTR5 puts out 80mW on the unbalanced port and that doesnt get them loud enough most of the time. The balanced port (2.5mm) with 220 mW does work quite well, I am usually around 40-50/60 volume steps.

But since you don’t have a balanced cable maybe you can take that Liquid Spark with you for testing?

I have the R70x for 1.5 years now and it has become my main listening headphone for most genres. I prefer it over my Sundaras and 6XX's most of the time.

How so? Just curious.

 

[Corti]

I have the R70x for 1.5 years now and it has become my main listening headphone for most genres. I prefer it over my Sundaras and 6XX's most of the time.

How so? Just curious.

Alright, so this is gonna be my personal, subjective opinion comparing the 3 mentioned headphones in a rather superficial way (i think there are more in-depth comparisons between these as they are all very popular headphones).

I first had the Sundara, which was one of my first hifi – headphones in general. Of course I was completely blown away by its sound quality (obviously, since I was coming from regular consumer IEMs and cheaper over-ears.).
Half a year later I bought the 6XX and found it to be a good addition to the Sundara, because of its gentle, non-fatiguing sound. Good for a very relaxed listen. But there were a few things “missing” with these cans for me..
About a year later I tested the R70x in a music-store and was instantly pleased by its sound; I bought it with a 30 day return window in mind. In the next days I decided to keep them, as they felt like a direct upgrade to the 6XX/650 in a few crucial ways.

For now I’m keeping all three, but will eventually sell the 6XX.

A bit more about the particular headphones and for what I mainly use them:

SUNDARA
I love these for everything with vocals and acoustic, natural instruments. It beats the other 2 in terms of timbre (naturality of sound - when i close my eyes it sometimes sounds as if I’m listening to the actual singer/instrument in front of me). It also has the best “detail-retrieval”, so it’s also the one I choose for more critical listening, especially in the treble area. Further the soundstage and imaging is impressive.

It does lack a bit of.. “organicness” <- yes, weird word. It feels more like a scalpel severing the music into many details and at times forgets to put the pieces together to create a coherence (which the other 2 do better). It is also heavier than the others with the cups floating around a little (but that's only an issue when you move around).

The second big use-case for me is watching movies/shows because of its great timbre and neutral-ish sound (never sounding boomy, which the other 2 occasionally do).

While the reduced bass is great for naturality it doesn’t work well for me with most of my electronic /synthetic music.

6XX
AS said before, very non-fatiguing (rolled of bass and rolled of treble). Very mid-centric with upper-bass/lower-mids hump. There is a lot of music which works well with this kind of tuning (especially older productions).

But the main caveat with these for me is its soundstage.. After having tried a few headphones over the time I just cant listen to the 6XX anymore because of its weird spatial presentation. When I apply HRTF convolution it does get a lot better (even listenable again), but it also alters the sound a fair bit. Everytime I put on these cans, after a few minutes I think.. nah, why not try the R70x instead.

R70x
So the R70x is the perfect allrounder for me in terms of frequency response and presentation. Overall it really feels to me like a cross between the Sundara and the 6XX taking the good properties (except for the planar magnetic treble-sparkle from the Sundaras).

As I mostly listen to electronic and trip-hop music, R70x are very satisfying for a range of different bands and artists. For really deep subbass-driven techno stuff (which probably makes up 60-70% of my listening time) I have 2 other cans. But the R70x has great bass-extension (for an open-back) and good treble-quality. The spatiality is more focused on depth instead of too much width like the 6XX does. Imaging is not far away from the Sundara's.
Another key factor is the comfort of these being feather-light and having a balanced clampforce (they almost disappear on my head).

PS: I’m mostly listening on my Fiio BTR5 Balanced output, but switch to SMSL SU/H6 stack when getting serious (all three 3 headphones have very similar power-demand).

So there you have it.. hope it helps you a bit on your “side-grading” adventure Enjoy the music!

 

[TheDreamthinker]

Alright, so this is gonna be my personal, subjective opinion comparing the 3 mentioned headphones in a rather superficial way (i think there are more in-depth comparisons between these as they are all very popular headphones).

I first had the Sundara, which was one of my first hifi – headphones in general. Of course I was completely blown away by its sound quality (obviously, since I was coming from regular consumer IEMs and cheaper over-ears.).
Half a year later I bought the 6XX and found it to be a good addition to the Sundara, because of its gentle, non-fatiguing sound. Good for a very relaxed listen. But there were a few things “missing” with these cans for me..
About a year later I tested the R70x in a music-store and was instantly pleased by its sound; I bought it with a 30 day return window in mind. In the next days I decided to keep them, as they felt like a direct upgrade to the 6XX/650 in a few crucial ways.

For now I’m keeping all three, but will eventually sell the 6XX.

A bit more about the particular headphones and for what I mainly use them:

SUNDARA
I love these for everything with vocals and acoustic, natural instruments. It beats the other 2 in terms of timbre (naturality of sound - when i close my eyes it sometimes sounds as if I’m listening to the actual singer/instrument in front of me). It also has the best “detail-retrieval”, so it’s also the one I choose for more critical listening, especially in the treble area. Further the soundstage and imaging is impressive.

It does lack a bit of.. “organicness” <- yes, weird word. It feels more like a scalpel severing the music into many details and at times forgets to put the pieces together to create a coherence (which the other 2 do better). It is also heavier than the others with the cups floating around a little (but that's only an issue when you move around).

The second big use-case for me is watching movies/shows because of its great timbre and neutral-ish sound (never sounding boomy, which the other 2 occasionally do).

While the reduced bass is great for naturality it doesn’t work well for me with most of my electronic /synthetic music.

6XX
AS said before, very non-fatiguing (rolled of bass and rolled of treble). Very mid-centric with upper-bass/lower-mids hump. There is a lot of music which works well with this kind of tuning (especially older productions).

But the main caveat with these for me is its soundstage.. After having tried a few headphones over the time I just cant listen to the 6XX anymore because of its weird spatial presentation. When I apply HRTF convolution it does get a lot better (even listenable again), but it also alters the sound a fair bit. Everytime I put on these cans, after a few minutes I think.. nah, why not try the R70x instead.

R70x
So the R70x is the perfect allrounder for me in terms of frequency response and presentation. Overall it really feels to me like a cross between the Sundara and the 6XX taking the good properties (except for the planar magnetic treble-sparkle from the Sundaras).

As I mostly listen to electronic and trip-hop music, R70x are very satisfying for a range of different bands and artists. For really deep subbass-driven techno stuff (which probably makes up 60-70% of my listening time) I have 2 other cans. But the R70x has great bass-extension (for an open-back) and good treble-quality. The spatiality is more focused on depth instead of too much width like the 6XX does. Imaging is not far away from the Sundara's.
Another key factor is the comfort of these being feather-light and having a balanced clampforce (they almost disappear on my head).

PS: I’m mostly listening on my Fiio BTR5 Balanced output, but switch to SMSL SU/H6 stack when getting serious (all three 3 headphones have very similar power-demand).

So there you have it.. hope it helps you a bit on your “side-grading” adventure Enjoy the music!

Thanks for the highly detailed write-up. Do you think the 6xx is less detailed than the R70x? I have read and heard on multiple occasions that the 6xx is more detailed than the R70x.

 

[SlhDub]

Alright, so this is gonna be my personal, subjective opinion comparing the 3 mentioned headphones in a rather superficial way (i think there are more in-depth comparisons between these as they are all very popular headphones).

I first had the Sundara, which was one of my first hifi – headphones in general. Of course I was completely blown away by its sound quality (obviously, since I was coming from regular consumer IEMs and cheaper over-ears.).
Half a year later I bought the 6XX and found it to be a good addition to the Sundara, because of its gentle, non-fatiguing sound. Good for a very relaxed listen. But there were a few things “missing” with these cans for me..
About a year later I tested the R70x in a music-store and was instantly pleased by its sound; I bought it with a 30 day return window in mind. In the next days I decided to keep them, as they felt like a direct upgrade to the 6XX/650 in a few crucial ways.

For now I’m keeping all three, but will eventually sell the 6XX.

A bit more about the particular headphones and for what I mainly use them:

SUNDARA
I love these for everything with vocals and acoustic, natural instruments. It beats the other 2 in terms of timbre (naturality of sound - when i close my eyes it sometimes sounds as if I’m listening to the actual singer/instrument in front of me). It also has the best “detail-retrieval”, so it’s also the one I choose for more critical listening, especially in the treble area. Further the soundstage and imaging is impressive.

It does lack a bit of.. “organicness” <- yes, weird word. It feels more like a scalpel severing the music into many details and at times forgets to put the pieces together to create a coherence (which the other 2 do better). It is also heavier than the others with the cups floating around a little (but that's only an issue when you move around).

The second big use-case for me is watching movies/shows because of its great timbre and neutral-ish sound (never sounding boomy, which the other 2 occasionally do).

While the reduced bass is great for naturality it doesn’t work well for me with most of my electronic /synthetic music.

6XX
AS said before, very non-fatiguing (rolled of bass and rolled of treble). Very mid-centric with upper-bass/lower-mids hump. There is a lot of music which works well with this kind of tuning (especially older productions).

But the main caveat with these for me is its soundstage.. After having tried a few headphones over the time I just cant listen to the 6XX anymore because of its weird spatial presentation. When I apply HRTF convolution it does get a lot better (even listenable again), but it also alters the sound a fair bit. Everytime I put on these cans, after a few minutes I think.. nah, why not try the R70x instead.

R70x
So the R70x is the perfect allrounder for me in terms of frequency response and presentation. Overall it really feels to me like a cross between the Sundara and the 6XX taking the good properties (except for the planar magnetic treble-sparkle from the Sundaras).

As I mostly listen to electronic and trip-hop music, R70x are very satisfying for a range of different bands and artists. For really deep subbass-driven techno stuff (which probably makes up 60-70% of my listening time) I have 2 other cans. But the R70x has great bass-extension (for an open-back) and good treble-quality. The spatiality is more focused on depth instead of too much width like the 6XX does. Imaging is not far away from the Sundara's.
Another key factor is the comfort of these being feather-light and having a balanced clampforce (they almost disappear on my head).

PS: I’m mostly listening on my Fiio BTR5 Balanced output, but switch to SMSL SU/H6 stack when getting serious (all three 3 headphones have very similar power-demand).

So there you have it.. hope it helps you a bit on your “side-grading” adventure Enjoy the music!

I also listn to mostly electronic like trip hop, tech house, Massive attack stuff like that. I have the HD560S and they can sound amazing on some tracks but sterile and thin on others, especially where's a lot going on like in hard rock or metal. Having said that with Oratory EQ they can sound very nice, do you think the R70x would be an upgrade? i do love the details of the HD560s though.

 

[Shane D]

I am going to look at a pair of used R70X's tomorrow. I thought hard about the Ghosts, but the R70X's seem like a safer gamble. I don't expect to get a top line set for this price. Just hope it is something that I like and that fits into the collection.

 

[Corti]

Thanks for the highly detailed write-up. Do you think the 6xx is less detailed than the R70x? I have read and heard on multiple occasions that the 6xx is more detailed than the R70x.

I don’t know really, I think they are more or less on a par. Sometimes I hear things on the 6XX, which I don’t hear on the R70x and vice versa.
When I switch to my Hifiman Edition S or even Fiio FF3, again I hear different elements in the same tracks. Also dependent on the current state of mind.

Detail-level might be a misleading concept on judging headphones/IEMs/earbuds (which is also not measurable). I find other traits more important. But that’s just me.

 

[Corti]

I also listn to mostly electronic like trip hop, tech house, Massive attack stuff like that. I have the HD560S and they can sound amazing on some tracks but sterile and thin on others, especially where's a lot going on like in hard rock or metal. Having said that with Oratory EQ they can sound very nice, do you think the R70x would be an upgrade? i do love the details of the HD560s though.

I have only briefly auditioned the HD560S some time ago and didn’t find the sound that great. Do you have a specific example (preferably with music-link) which, on the 560S, sounds amazing and when it sounds sterile and thin? I could then give you my opinion on such songs on the R70x.

 

[Shane D]

Playing with new to me R70X's. Super, super light. Even compared to the HD660S2's.

Good mids, decent bass, nice sound. Of course I am only about three songs in.



One question for the experts:
Is the cable supposed to have left and right markings?

 

[Corti]

Playing with new to me R70X's. Super, super light. Even compared to the HD660S2's.

Good mids, decent bass, nice sound. Of course I am only about three songs in.



One question for the experts:
Is the cable supposed to have left and right markings?

Awesome! Have fun with it.
Nope, the cable does not have left and right, sides are interchangeable and the headphone manages left and right internally.

 

[Shane D]

Awesome! Have fun with it.
Nope, the cable does not have left and right, sides are interchangeable and the headphone manages left and right internally.

Thank you!

 

[Slim1970]

Playing with new to me R70X's. Super, super light. Even compared to the HD660S2's.

Good mids, decent bass, nice sound. Of course I am only about three songs in.



One question for the experts:
Is the cable supposed to have left and right markings?

They are really good headphones. I've managed to hang onto these even with the more expensive offerings I have on hand. They have replaced the entire Sennheiser 6XX series of headphones I previously owned. I haven't heard the HD660S2's. Maybe you can shed some light on how they compare to the R70x's.

 

[Corti]

Already noticed that the metal-headband has been bent a little by the pre-owner (it is more even out of the box). You can bend it carefully to have the cups fit your noggin. It helps in getting a better seal since the cups do only rotate horizontically but dont swivel vertically (which really is a little downside on the design).

 

[Shane D]

They are really good headphones. I've managed to hang onto these even with the more expensive offerings I have on hand. They have replaced the entire Sennheiser 6XX series of headphones I previously owned. I haven't heard the HD660S2's. Maybe you can shed some light on how they compare to the R70x's.

I took your past advice into account when I picked these up.
Sounded pretty good on the iFi Pro iCAN, but maybe a little bright. Even with bass boost. I have now moved over to the Violectric V220 and I am enjoying these more. Started off with some Glorious Sons. Now listening to a new single from ZZ Ward and it is rocking.

Next up is new Ayron Jones and Buckcherry. Then roll over to some Miles Davis tomorrow.

Much like the HD660S2's, they are surprisingly easy to drive.

For the price I paid, I can't lose. Unless they stop working tomorrow.

 

[Shane D]

Already noticed that the metal-headband has been bent a little by the pre-owner (it is more even out of the box). You can bend it carefully to have the cups fit your noggin. It helps in getting a better seal since the cups do only rotate horizontically but dont swivel vertically (which really is a little downside on the design).

I have a pretty good seal right off the bat. I will straighten them out later.