AUDIO over IP - REDNET 3 & 16 Review. AES67 Sets A New Standard for Computer Audio

[rb2013]

  https://www.audinate.com/products/dante-enabled/neutrik/neutrik-nxp-rx-dante

Very cool!  Wireless in the extreme it looks like.  Dante in AES out?

 

[rb2013]

The acousence GISO-GB is a much better one, I have heared both. I have the Acoustic Revive still lying about somewhere. The Acoustic Revive is also limited to 100 Mb/s and I prefer to keep my LAN on 1Gb/s if at all possible.

AR has a GB version now too - no?
 
http://www.ebay.com/itm/172144307287?_trksid=p2060353.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT
 
You had posted some noise measurements here a while ago - that was with the AR 100Mb/s or the GISO-GB?
 
In the 6Moons review the $350 Sotm had some special sauce - have you tried it?

South Korea's Soul Of the Music aka SOtM bank on it. Their iSO-CAT6 inline 'black box' inserts a digital isolation transformer plus sundry unreported bits into the Ethernet pipeline. That strips off noise which invades from the routers's ground plane. As Wikipedia reports, "network isolators are installed as part of a copper Ethernet system as galvanic isolators. Network data continues to be transmitted across an electrically non-conducting barrier through the applied principle of electromagnetic induction whereby high-frequency AC voltages conveying data are induced across an isolating gap. The network isolator is therefore a passive device and functions without any requirement of an external power supply."

Based on what we've been told thus far

, two questions arise. One, if exotic 'audiophile' Ethernet wires make an audible improvement as reviewers and users report, could this be due to incorporating an actual isolation transformer perhaps in the receive-end connector; or do they duplicate its noise-suppressing function by some other means? Two, does the recommendation of placing this passive device close to the receive and not send end imply a certain amount of insertion loss? The first question remains open-ended. I asked May Park about the second. Then I issued the obvious third. Besides an isolation transformer, what else was in the box when their materials talk of 'sound tuning'? I fully expected a diplomatic soft pedal. IP deserves protection. But that never stops our sort. Diplomacy ain't our thing. May proved unfazed. "Our device contains 10GBASE-T Ethernet magnetics. And yes, it does cause some insertion loss. That's why a short distance to the PC is highly recommended." By another name, her explanation mentioned the isolation transformer again. I rephrased my question on what else. With her in a different time zone, I had the answer the next day.  

What of this 'insertion loss'?
Wouldn't the 10GBASE Sotm be superior to the 1GB GISO or 1GB AR.  And cheaper then the GSIO.

 

[rb2013]

   
What you've got should be fine but personally I prefer the MC220L model:
 
https://www.amazon.com/MC220L-Converter-1000Mbps-supporting-mountable/dp/B003CFATL0/ref=sr_1_1?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1466421218&sr=1-1&keywords=tp-link+Media+Converter
 
This comes with empty SFP slot so you can add whatever Mini-GBIC model you want, and can change it later. Also if I remember it's easier/cheaper to go wth Multi-mode vs Single-mode converters, given for our use we will never reach the distance limit.
 
By the way if you're looking for a great switch with SFP slots (they come empty, you need to add the modules) I can very highly recommend this Netgear model:
 
https://www.amazon.com/NETGEAR-ProSAFE-GS110TP-Gigabit-GS110TP-200NAS/dp/B00LW9A328/ref=sr_1_1?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1466421446&sr=1-1&keywords=gs110tp

Thanks for the suggestions - well we'll see how this sounds first and I may try a Sotm ISO LAN filter as well - so the STP CAT7 cables can be used with GI.
 
Many avenues to explore.

 

[rb2013]

I don't think anything upstream of the FMC connected to the Rednet will matter sound wise. Cat 6 should get you all the bandwidth you need. But cat 7 won't hurt anything.

Thanks  - the super expensive HIFI designer CAT6 and CAT7's are out of the question - like the JCAT, AQ, SR, etc...these run into the hundreds, even thousands.  This $100 path is way more acceptable.  Would rather focus on the SPDIF cabling.
 

No problem. I can't wait to hear more feedback, and experiments from others. I need to see some high res board pics of the Rednet 3 and see if I can spot how this thing can be modded to reach sonic nirvana

That would be great!  Here are some from someone here who posted Eric I believe.
I think the SMPS would be a target of improvement - as was done on the Mutec - running an external LPS.

 

 

 
I'll crack the case open on mine and take some more to post

 

[jabbr]

 
AR has a GB version now too - no?
 
http://www.ebay.com/itm/172144307287?_trksid=p2060353.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT
 
You had posted some noise measurements here a while ago - that was with the AR 100Mb/s or the GISO-GB?
 
....

That  new AR isolator is from after my trials (3-4 years ago), so don't know that one. From the name one would assume it is a 1 GB-version, but it doesn't say it anywhere explicitly.
 
The measurements I posted are from the AR 100 Mb/s version and they were published by Acoustic Revive on their website.
 
Cheers

 

[gldgate]

For those going down the optical path, you can great deals on SFP's on e-bay.  A decent 1G SFP (Cisco, Finisar etc..) can be picked up for under $10 a piece.
 
I have had an optical set-up for about 9 months and think it worthwhile. Unfortunately, I've found the power supplies on FMC's to be horrid and did not get the best sound until I swapped them out. Depending on the number of FMC's you need an alternative option would  be getting an optical switch. I have something like this:
 
http://www.aliexpress.com/item/GXCOM-HS1100-10-100-1000M-8-Port-Gigaibt-SFP-port-with-1-port-10-100/32666639282.html?spm=2114.01010208.3.166.UPT4dc&ws_ab_test=searchweb201556_0,searchweb201602_5_10017_10040,searchweb201603_11&btsid=204ad8ff-ca4a-433e-b98e-334cc14da109
 
I also found improvement in replacing power supply on the switch.

 

[mhamel]

 
Very cool!  Wireless in the extreme it looks like.  Dante in AES out?

 
Very expensive, and not full bitrate, I believe.
 
I looked into these, and if I recall, it was around $1500 at each end.

 

[thisisvv]

I am just curious, This entire exercise is to eliminate the USB from our audio chain.  Has anyone tried this.
 
http://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/nuc/nuc-kit-nuc6i7kyk-features-configurations.html
 
This is an i7 NUC that has a toslink output. We can use this to M3 USB+ or dac directly.  Has anyone tried connecting this NUC directly to DAC and then using Rednet
 
just asking 
 
 
V

 

[rb2013]

  For those going down the optical path, you can great deals on SFP's on e-bay.  A decent 1G SFP (Cisco, Finisar etc..) can be picked up for under $10 a piece.
 
I have had an optical set-up for about 9 months and think it worthwhile. Unfortunately, I've found the power supplies on FMC's to be horrid and did not get the best sound until I swapped them out. Depending on the number of FMC's you need an alternative option would  be getting an optical switch. I have something like this:
 
http://www.aliexpress.com/item/GXCOM-HS1100-10-100-1000M-8-Port-Gigaibt-SFP-port-with-1-port-10-100/32666639282.html?spm=2114.01010208.3.166.UPT4dc&ws_ab_test=searchweb201556_0,searchweb201602_5_10017_10040,searchweb201603_11&btsid=204ad8ff-ca4a-433e-b98e-334cc14da109
 
I also found improvement in replacing power supply on the switch.

Have you tried on the Rednet yet?

 

[rb2013]

   
Very expensive, and not full bitrate, I believe.
 
I looked into these, and if I recall, it was around $1500 at each end.

Och - well not so interesting.

 

[rb2013]

  I am just curious, This entire exercise is to eliminate the USB from our audio chain.  Has anyone tried this.
 
http://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/nuc/nuc-kit-nuc6i7kyk-features-configurations.html
 
This is an i7 NUC that has a toslink output. We can use this to M3 USB+ or dac directly.  Has anyone tried connecting this NUC directly to DAC and then using Rednet
 
just asking 
 
 
V

My experience with toslink is pretty miserable.  I get the GI part.  But maybe today the Electro-Optical converters are better - they have increased throughput to match coax.  Every test on a DAC I have seen the Toslink jitter is ridiculous.
 
The native TB3 connection looks interesting...

 

[occamsrazor]

I have those FMC's as well. But they sound the same to me as the SC port ones, and they are more expensive with the minigbic module.
 

 
Not really more expensive..
 
MC220L = $25
GBIC= $18, you can get new as low as $15
Total = $43
https://www.amazon.com/Fiberopticdistribution-AGM731F-Netgear-100%25-Compatible/dp/B00QEASBSS/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1466442310&sr=8-3&keywords=AGM731F
 
MC210CS = $44 to 47
 
I wouldn't buy one or the other on price grounds, just saying the MC220L+GBIC doesn't have to be more expensive....

 

[mourip]

  Thread back up and running!  Will have a few interesting things to share next week!
 
Cheers

 
Great! I went over to the new thread I started to see if I could get the moderator to close it and found that done. Thanks!

 

[Kelowna]

Not really more expensive..

MC220L = $25
GBIC= $18, you can get new as low as $15
Total = $43
https://www.amazon.com/Fiberopticdistribution-AGM731F-Netgear-100%25-Compatible/dp/B00QEASBSS/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1466442310&sr=8-3&keywords=AGM731F

MC210CS = $44 to 47

I wouldn't buy one or the other on price grounds, just saying the MC220L+GBIC doesn't have to be more expensive....

I was talking about with the TPlink minigbic module. And in Canada I save $40 per unit going with this. Another reason why I don't like to recommend the SFP port version is because when people have the option to do something poorly it never fails that it often happens. I've only tested the unit with the TPlink minigbic modules. Some might use $10 generic minigbic modules and get poor results. Then fail to mention they did so. Then they end up with poor results based on my recommendation. By eliminating the option of making this a possibility, this will never occur.

 

[rb2013]

   
Great! I went over to the new thread I started to see if I could get the moderator to close it and found that done. Thanks!

This one's been on fire (in a good way) with it's reopening.  Thanks for openning that one as a place holder - as per your suggestion I changed the title to focus more on the REDNET stuff as that's the 'here and now' solution - but leaving the door open for developments with Ravenna.  With some real products that can be spun off.
 
I'll redo the front page here with a mini-review of the Rednet 3 - and can include some of others on the RN16.  Anybody have one - I can use some posts from other already.  But those who are just getting your Red boxes I can post those as well.
 
Will delete a bunch of the CA reposts - just a general cleanup and refocus.
 
I want Focusrite or any other Manufacturer to have a streamlined read here.