[sk3383]

When I heard my first DAC separate I was simply stunned. It was the DACMagic, as it is widely available at various local audio shops. The DACMagic opened my eyes and sparked my interest in purchasing a DAC. I considered buying the DACMagic but I wondered what other equipment was available on the market. I called up a bunch of local audio shops and auditioned several other brands, such as the Benchmark, Bryston, Naim, and a couple other high end DACs. It was after listening to these DACs that I realized how plain the DACMagic really is. Don't get me wrong, it is a great entry level piece of equipment that does a little of everything but didnt excel in any area (except maybe connections, offers decent connections at this price point). After consulting with my wallet I knew I wouldnt be able to afford the higher end offerings but I didnt want to "settle" for the DACMagic. I found some online forums and began reading.

I strongly considered getting the Meier StageDAC, but in the end I figured...logically thinking now

...Meier invested a large amount of time, money and effort to bringing these features to tailor the sound for the listener....whereas Audio-gd quite possibly spend more money on quality components and dedicated more time/effort to perfecting the circuit design. Just my opinion...total specualation. I liked the idea of better components and design rather than features.

That thinking, Kingwa's great customer service and the growing community of Audio-gd's extremely satisfied owners made my decision that much easier.

From the moment I turned the DAC-19 on I knew I made the right choice. The DACMagic sounds thin and cold in comparisn. It is clearly not on the same level IMO.

I will say though, like many other members here...I can't wait for the day that a member writes a heads up review between the the DAC-19 & StageDAC.

 

[Audio Jester]

I partially with agree sk3383, I don't see all those switches as being a plus. Personally (I am no electrical engineer), I wonder if adding all those extra connections will create more opportunity for the something to break and maybe they could affect sound quality over time. The other thing is that I am sticking with the Concerto so I want a dac that offers a warmish sound and is very musical rather than super analytical. Maybe this is weird of me but I don't want all those options to change the sound of my music because I would be continually playing with them and it would detract from the listening experience.

Originally I was wanting a PS DLIII with stage 3 cullen mods, but I cannot afford it just yet. Maybe next year.

 

[MadMan007]

Quote:

Originally Posted by sk3383 /img/forum/go_quote.gif Recently I had the same dilema, I was so finding it really hard to decide between the StageDAC, DAC-19, Music Hall 25.2, VDA.2, X-DAC, Havana, etc. So many good reviews for all of the above...but after reading every thread I could find on all above mentioned DACs from Head-fi & other reputable websites I decided that the Audio-gd DAC-19 was the best value for the money. You will not find a magazine review of the Audio-gd equipment, but I think user reviews hold more weight. The members who have Audio-gd gear were so vocal and adament about the performance. I had to try it out. Since I received my DAC-19DSP, I have been having a hard time turning it off. It is an incredible DAC especially for the money. The most important part of my system. Detailed, transparent, great extension and depth in all bands...most importantly the DAC-19 is very musical.

This is kind of OT but just something I thought of when reading your post...paid/free sample reviewer reviews and user-owner reviews both have the potential for bias. The former because of the whole advertising and 'don't give bad reviews' thing and the latter because of owner bias - people are less likely to say bad things about something they own. On top of all that there's the whole 'audio is subjective' part. Just something to keep in mind

 

[oqvist]

Yes audio reviews are quite useless but it´s fun so who cares.

How can the different modes on the StageDAc affect sound over time? Sound like a fairy tale. The DAC chip used support these modes.

I can definiatly see it´s purpose. To fight upgraditis if nothing else since it´s very refreshing with new sound signatures. I would love a "bright" button on my DAC19 for example

 

[Necrolic]

IMO, if you're getting one Meier product you might as well get the other.

If you haven't purchased the amp yet, the C2/DAC19DSP combo connected with ACSS is AMAZING. I'm sure the Meier combo is fantastic, but I'm just speaking from first hand experience with A-GD.

 

[SoupRKnowva]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Necrolic /img/forum/go_quote.gif IMO, if you're getting one Meier product you might as well get the other. If you haven't purchased the amp yet, the C2/DAC19DSP combo connected with ACSS is AMAZING. I'm sure the Meier combo is fantastic, but I'm just speaking from first hand experience with A-GD.

i dont really understand your first statement, why would you buy them together just because they are from the same company? i think from what ive read that the Dac19 would go pretty great with the Concerto, i've even thought about getting one as a home amp to use with my jh-13's and my dac19, instead of using the protector at home. specially because of the super low noise floor

the dac19 is one of the best dacs in its price range, and the concerto is one of the best single ended amps in its price range, why not pair them? the c2 really isnt in the same price class as the concerto.

 

[IPodPJ]

I think you should consider an Audio-gd amp instead of the Concerto. Meier uses op-amps. I used to own the Corda Opera and while I thought it nice at the time because it was my first desktop amp, it doesn't hold a candle to the Audio-gd stuff. I'm not sure how much better the Concerto is, but it still uses op-amps. It is the same as the Symphony without the DAC, which isn't much different than the Opera from what I've been told. You'd be much better off getting an Audio-gd Roc or C2.

Why would you want a DLIII with Stage 3 Cullen mods to replace the DAC19DSP? That's futile. The DAC19DSP is a league above it because it uses much better DACs, the PCM1704U-K, not to mention the DSP1 processor. It is the baby brother of the Ref7/Ref1. I owned the DLIII modded by RAM, and while it is a great unit, you can't even compare it to the Ref7 or Ref1. I'm quite confident the DAC19DSP blows the DL3 out of the water too. Just look under the hood. And if you need a balanced DAC, spend the money on a Ref1 or a Ref7 --- don't mod the DL3, it would be a downgrade.

 

[IPodPJ]

Quote:

Originally Posted by SoupRKnowva /img/forum/go_quote.gif the c2 really isnt in the same price class as the concerto.

All being equal, the C2 is in a higher price class. One is designed, made and sold in China, the other is designed in Europe, made in China and sold in Europe. If the C2 was made in Europe, it would sell for the same or more than the Concerto.

 

[SoupRKnowva]

Quote:

Originally Posted by IPodPJ /img/forum/go_quote.gif All being equal, the C2 is in a higher price class. One is designed, made and sold in China, the other is designed in Europe, made in China and sold in Europe. If the C2 was made in Europe, it would sell for the same or more than the Concerto.

Dont get me wrong iPod, i think that Audio GD gear is great value too. But if the OP wants to stay single ended, that the Concerto would probably be a better amp than the c2. I understand the value proposition of the c2, but at half the price?? the concerto is built in china, which aleviates alot of the costs. I think if the OP was willing to go balanced, that the Roc balanced would most likely be better than the Concerto single ended.

And way off topic, but everytime i go to the audio gd site, which i just did to check the price on the c2, i start drooling over the C3-Mk3, and the C10 amp that im going to get when i finally move out of the dorms and can get speakers again. I read both pages in their entirety each time, dreaming about how awesome they will sound....

 

[IPodPJ]

Quote:

Originally Posted by SoupRKnowva /img/forum/go_quote.gif Dont get me wrong iPod, i think that Audio GD gear is great value too. But if the OP wants to stay single ended, that the Concerto would probably be a better amp than the c2. I understand the value proposition of the c2, but at half the price?? the concerto is built in china, which aleviates alot of the costs. I think if the OP was willing to go balanced, that the Roc balanced would most likely be better than the Concerto single ended.

Having owned the Opera and comparing to the C2-C, the C2-C was a better sounding amp without a doubt. Had it not been for me receiving the HD800 the day before CanJam and being able to listen to them on other amps (over 40) I would have returned the HD800 because they just don't sound good with the Opera. The Concerto is a slight upgrade from the Opera, and the C2 is a slight upgrade from the C2-C. Therefore, it would reason that the C2 would be the better choice. Dr. Meier is a great guy and deserves the utmost respect, but when it comes to SQ Audio-gd has the edge in my opinion.

Quote:

And way off topic, but everytime i go to the audio gd site, which i just did to check the price on the c2, i start drooling over the C3-Mk3, and the C10 amp that im going to get when i finally move out of the dorms and can get speakers again. I read both pages in their entirety each time, dreaming about how awesome they will sound....

If I get into speakers, I would want to build a Beta24. If ultimate transparency is your thing, it's something to consider.

 

[SoupRKnowva]

Quote:

Originally Posted by IPodPJ /img/forum/go_quote.gif Having owned the Opera and comparing to the C2-C, the C2-C was a better sounding amp without a doubt. Had it not been for me receiving the HD800 the day before CanJam and being able to listen to them on other amps (over 40) I would have returned the HD800 because they just don't sound good with the Opera. The Concerto is a slight upgrade from the Opera, and the C2 is a slight upgrade from the C2-C. Therefore, it would reason that the C2 would be the better choice. Dr. Meier is a great guy and deserves the utmost respect, but when it comes to SQ Audio-gd has the edge in my opinion.

i think that might be true, but from what ive read, his circuit designs have come quite a long ways since the opera, but what you said could very well be true

Quote:

If I get into speakers, I would want to build a Beta24. If ultimate transparency is your thing, it's something to consider.

I thought about it, but i liked the fact that with that combo it would all be done in the current domain, which seems like it would be nice. But also, since i want maggies, they need loads of power, and the 100W per channel that the Beta24 is rated at i dont think would be enough. Though since then i would have the room, i might build one for fun just to see

 

[IPodPJ]

Quote:

Originally Posted by SoupRKnowva /img/forum/go_quote.gif I thought about it, but i liked the fact that with that combo it would all be done in the current domain, which seems like it would be nice. But also, since i want maggies, they need loads of power, and the 100W per channel that the Beta24 is rated at i dont think would be enough. Though since then i would have the room, i might build one for fun just to see

I don't keep it in the current domain any longer since I'm building a Beta22, nor did I when I still had the Phoenix. I did my own passive I/V conversion inside of the XLR connector on a custom cable. It sounded better (more dynamic, much larger soundstage, etc.) using this cable between the ACSS output on the DAC and the XLR input on the amp than using ACSS to ACSS.

 

[SoupRKnowva]

Quote:

Originally Posted by IPodPJ /img/forum/go_quote.gif I don't keep it in the current domain any longer since I'm building a Beta22, nor did I when I still had the Phoenix. I did my own passive I/V conversion inside of the XLR connector on a custom cable. It sounded better (more dynamic, much larger soundstage, etc.) using this cable between the ACSS output on the DAC and the XLR input on the amp than using ACSS to ACSS.

yeah i remember reading about you doing that in the ref1 thread. I just went and checked the AMB site, and i guess the b24 is 310 watts into 4 ohms, might be enough. If i decided to go that way, id probably get the Wyred4Sound pre amp, its supposed to be pretty ridiculously good.

Edit:iPod, were pretty OT

 

[Audio Jester]

Thanks for all the input!

To add some info to the mix.
1. I am not into speakers at the moment... and am unlikely to be for some time.

2. I do not want to go balanced just yet. SE is what I am after.

3. I like the Meier amp because of the balanced ground, the option of crossfeed, and I currently have a Meier amp and have found it to be very good.

4. Skylab gave the concerto a very positive review and he rates the sound of D7000's and T1 out of it. I believe he still owns a concerto, which speaks volumes, and I respect his opinions.


But that aside I will look into the C2. Thanks for the info.

 

[Audio Jester]

Well, I did a little more homework and this DAC19 + C2 idea does intrigue me. The ACSS and swappable OPAs sound like a very nice feature. My only concern is that we are comparing a $720 concerto to a $350 C2. On price alone it makes me wonder if it is really apples to apples? Another thing that is in the back of my mind is that Skylab has a Phoenix and told me that he felt that the SE output on it does not keep up with the Concerto.

So if I go DAC19 > Concerto I lose ACSS and gain Balanced ground and Crossfeed
(this is starting to sound like Final Fantasy.)