[PY034]

Which do you reckon will stay longer on your head? The 4z or 24?

 

[mightyKyn]

Which do you reckon will stay longer on your head? The 4z or 24?

as i said

24 DAP

4Z Desktop (tt2/msc)

 

[mightyKyn]

delered

 

[DeepSouth]

However as I said previously. 4Z kicks 24 ass on meat with TT2/Mscaler but you cannot reproduce this
'special effect" on any DAP in existence today... PERIOD....

Therefore 4Z being darker than 24... and because you cannot extract the desktop chord magic from the 4Z with a DAP... the 24 is the clear winner on a DAP... I would say probably the best large set of cans for a modern well powered DAP today.

ohh and Kann Cube balanced 2.5MM powers them wonderfully... at 1500$ a steal VS the 3500$ sp2000 that is underpowered compared to the Cube with very little SQ difference. Running on Med Gain

I'm curious, are you saying the 2.5mm from A&K does not power the 4z well? And if my primary source is a DAP, I should stick with the 24?
I have a McInstosh integrated amp and a sp1000, I'd like one nice headphone that does it all.

 

[CreditingKarma]

I'm curious, are you saying the 2.5mm from A&K does not power the 4z well? And if my primary source is a DAP, I should stick with the 24?
I have a McInstosh integrated amp and a sp1000, I'd like one nice headphone that does it all.

The sp1000 does pretty well with the LCD4Z from the balanced output. I used to listen from the balanced out when I had the 4z so i could be away from my desk. I still use it with my lcdx. You can always get the sp1000 amp that should drive the 4z without any problem.

 

[iceanddice]

Just got my hands on the 4Z's today... checked the Audeze website and the Reveal plugin is not here -- https://www.audeze.com/products/reveal

Where to get it?
TIA and glad to be back on planars!

 

[tjwb84]

Just got my hands on the 4Z's today... checked the Audeze website and the Reveal plugin is not here -- https://www.audeze.com/products/reveal

Where to get it?
TIA and glad to be back on planars!

This link seems to work:

https://www.audeze.com/pages/reveal?_pos=1&_sid=109e44d0b&_ss=r

Congrats on the 4z! Did you get the model with the newer mesh (as discussed a few pages ago?) Would love to see some pics

 

[iceanddice]

This link seems to work:

https://www.audeze.com/pages/reveal?_pos=1&_sid=109e44d0b&_ss=r

Congrats on the 4z! Did you get the model with the newer mesh (as discussed a few pages ago?) Would love to see some pics

They were manufactured last July 12 according to support, and do have them! Here’s a pic

 

[mightyKyn]

Amazing pairing LCD24 + Kann Cube

 

[angelsblood]

Just a quick question, if the LCD-4z sounds every bit the same as LCD-4, but lighter and more efficient, and they both costs the same, why would anyone choose LCD-4 over the newer LCD-4z?

 

[sahmen]

Just a quick question, if the LCD-4z sounds every bit the same as LCD-4, but lighter and more efficient, and they both costs the same, why would anyone choose LCD-4 over the newer LCD-4z?

First of all, I do not think that they sound "every bit the same." People I know who are familiar with the sound of both do dispute that claim, pointing at minor differences in aspects such as width of soundstage, etc. etc. I personally haven't heard both of them, and I wish I had, so that I can give you my own first hand comparative evaluation. Personally, I picked the LCD-4 over the 4z, because, first of all, I have never had any problem with the weight of any Audeze headphones. 2nd, I was attracted by the 200 Ohm spec of the LCD-4, because all my headphone amps have more than enough power to drive the LCD-4, and optimize its scaling powers at those specs, so the superior efficiency of the 4z was a non-issue,. And it was a non-issue since I already owned other relatively less efficient cans, when I came to the LCD-4, such as the Sennheisers HD-600, 6XX, and 800, not to mention the decidedly notorious Hifiman He-6. Thirdly, I have more than enough alternative high efficiency options to use whenever that is called for, such as the LCD-i4, the LCD-X, and the Hifiman He-1000SE. The funny thing is that, although one of their often touted selling points is that they can be used without amplification, with such devices as DAPs and cellphones, they all still sound much better to me when used with the same amps that drive the so-called "less efficient" LCD-4. So in the end, I always wind up using the LCD-X, the LCD-i4, and the Hifiman He-1000SE too with good amps, in order to optimize their performance anyway, which seems to make their touted efficiency a non-issue for practically every case in which I personally want to use them.

With all that said, I fully recognize where, depending on a particular user's preferences, types of gear, and modes of frequent use, the superior efficiency of the LCD-4z could serve as the main deciding factor in picking it over the LCD-4. There is no disputing that. However, given the variety and multiplicity of preferences and also circumstances that determine the choices of users for particular purposes, I found your question to be a bit surprising, especially the dismissive attitude it adopts over the venerable LCD-4, which is one of the best-sounding, and musically rich headphones I have ever heard, period! And let's not forget the emotional gravitas it brings to some kinds of listening sessions...

 

[angelsblood]

I found your question to be a bit surprising, especially the dismissive attitude it adopts over the venerable LCD-4, which is one of the best-sound, and musically rich headphones I have ever heard, period! And let's not forget the emotional gravitas it brings to some kinds of listening sessions...

I appreciate your well thought of and lengthy reply, but how do I come across as dismissive? How can a question be dismissive anyway? It's a genuine question as I am looking for a headphone to compliment the Utopia I have now, looking for a more sweet full bodied sound pairing with my new bought Hugo TT2. And the Hugo TT2 has enough juice to power the LCD-4 so I'm not worried about that. That being said, I just want to know if there's something I'm missing. I mean isn't it better to have the option to power a headphone without an amp even though you don't need this option, as a bonus? And even though you don't mind the weight, isn't it better for the sake of your neck that it is lighter? I guess I've over-complicated the case, so basically they're both the same phones just for different users based on their needs.

I don't have the means to audition headphones so going to base my purchase on purely by reviews. And so far, even on the Audeze website, they're calling the LCD-4z the LCD-4 sound without the need of an amp.

 

[Hifiearspeakers]

Just a quick question, if the LCD-4z sounds every bit the same as LCD-4, but lighter and more efficient, and they both costs the same, why would anyone choose LCD-4 over the newer LCD-4z?

If you have a very powerful tube amplifier, for example, you would be better off with the 4 because of the resistance and damping factor. The 4Z might not sound as good due to its low impedance.

And if your amplifier is very powerful, your control over the volume, with the 4Z, would be much harder to manage as things could get really loud really quickly.

If you have a normal to moderately powerful amplifier, the 4Z would give you more headroom so that you’re not maxing out your amp, which could lead to clipping and higher distortion.

 

[sahmen]

I appreciate your well thought of and lengthy reply, but how do I come across as dismissive? How can a question be dismissive anyway? It's a genuine question as I am looking for a headphone to compliment the Utopia I have now, looking for a more sweet full bodied sound pairing with my new bought Hugo TT2. And the Hugo TT2 has enough juice to power the LCD-4 so I'm not worried about that. That being said, I just want to know if there's something I'm missing. I mean isn't it better to have the option to power a headphone without an amp even though you don't need this option, as a bonus? And even though you don't mind the weight, isn't it better for the sake of your neck that it is lighter? I guess I've over-complicated the case, so basically they're both the same phones just for different users based on their needs.

I don't have the means to audition headphones so going to base my purchase on purely by reviews. And so far, even on the Audeze website, they're calling the LCD-4z the LCD-4 sound without the need of an amp.

It was all implicit in your question : "why would anyone choose LCD-4 over the newer LCD-4z"? You probably did not mean to say so explicitly, but implicitly, the statement seems to question the wisdom in choosing the 4 over the 4z for "anyone," and by extension, by anyone for any purpose. In that sense, it seemed to question in a "dismissive" way, any rationale for preferring the 4 over the 4z, solely on account of the latter's lesser weight and higher efficiency... However, I get from your response that you did not mean to sound that drastic or dismissive. Sometimes, rhetoric and word-choice can have unintended consequences. Duly noted!

As for what is said on the website, I hope you're also aware that they are all sales-pitches, and that as well meaning as they might be, one cannot (and I might even add that, one should never) take such statements (or sales pitches) completely at face-value, if one is a discriminating customer who is looking for precise, "customized," solutions that fit one's personalized lifestyle.

The expression "without the need for an amp," can be loosely applied, for example, to some of the cans I have already listed in my previous post (the LCDi4, the LCD-X, and the Hifiman He-1000SE, not to mentioned the LCD-MX4, which I briefly owned, before getting the LCD-4)... However, being intimately familiar with them and knowing the difference an amp brings to their sound, I personally will never use any of them without an amp, if I have the choice, even though I agree that they can each perform decently well, without amps.

 

[johnzz4]

I appreciate your well thought of and lengthy reply, but how do I come across as dismissive? How can a question be dismissive anyway? It's a genuine question as I am looking for a headphone to compliment the Utopia I have now, looking for a more sweet full bodied sound pairing with my new bought Hugo TT2. And the Hugo TT2 has enough juice to power the LCD-4 so I'm not worried about that. That being said, I just want to know if there's something I'm missing. I mean isn't it better to have the option to power a headphone without an amp even though you don't need this option, as a bonus? And even though you don't mind the weight, isn't it better for the sake of your neck that it is lighter? I guess I've over-complicated the case, so basically they're both the same phones just for different users based on their needs.

I don't have the means to audition headphones so going to base my purchase on purely by reviews. And so far, even on the Audeze website, they're calling the LCD-4z the LCD-4 sound without the need of an amp.

Angelsblood - I've always had a thing for meaty, high-power amps. As such, my system has too much gain for the 4z. I don't really listen to the X's that often on my system since I only get a few useful steps of the stepped attenuator. This results in a higher noise floor, etc. The LCD-4's are perfect with the Well Audio Head Trip with more gain than I'll ever need, but plenty of useful steps in the attenuator.

Additionally, in general, less sensitive phones will provide a greater signal to noise ratio since your noise floor will be further from the signal level.

I also wonder how the traces aren't heavier in the 4z to get the reduced impedance and increased efficiency, but according to Audeze, they aren't - so no additional moving mass.

In the end, it's more a matter of synergy. If you want to use the phones with a portable device, and you have an amp with a low noise floor and not too much gain, chances are the 4z's will be your best bet. If you have large amps and a lot of gain, and no real desire to connect to a portable player, the 4's would likely be the way to go.

Also, the following is probably one of the best articles I've read regarding impedance, sensitivity, and general concepts of the related equipment pairing: https://www.headphonesty.com/2019/04/headphone-impedance-demystified/