[Dinrog]

OK, I listened to the 4z again yesterday. It was a three way sluggout between the 4z, 1266 and the Utopia. If I had to pick one I would have chosen the 4z. While I did think the 1266 was generally better in most aspects, I found it uncomfortable and the timbre to be a little suspect. It didn't sound quite natural. I also still think the 4z and 4's bass is the best i have heard on an HP. I do think besides the timbre the 1266 is the headphone that Audeze should have and could have made to really make the 4/4z a truly word class TOTL HP. The 1266 did have a lot better soundstage and generally a better tonal balance to the 4z.

This gets me to the reason I am posting. Is here an amp or cable that goes well with the 4z that can make that classic Audeze dip less noticeable? That upper midrange dip seems to be more noticeable that that of my X. It results in muted guitars but full tonal vocals. It just seemed like a strange imbalance, especially compared to HP's like the Empys, which do not have as bad of an upper midrange dip.

Cant say on amps or cables, but since the 4z has such an insanely low distortion, you can just EQ the dip out for the most part.. i did that and its perfect now

 

[CreditingKarma]

OK, I listened to the 4z again yesterday. It was a three way sluggout between the 4z, 1266 and the Utopia. If I had to pick one I would have chosen the 4z. While I did think the 1266 was generally better in most aspects, I found it uncomfortable and the timbre to be a little suspect. It didn't sound quite natural. I also still think the 4z and 4's bass is the best i have heard on an HP. I do think besides the timbre the 1266 is the headphone that Audeze should have and could have made to really make the 4/4z a truly word class TOTL HP. The 1266 did have a lot better soundstage and generally a better tonal balance to the 4z.

This gets me to the reason I am posting. Is here an amp or cable that goes well with the 4z that can make that classic Audeze dip less noticeable? That upper midrange dip seems to be more noticeable that that of my X. It results in muted guitars but full tonal vocals. It just seemed like a strange imbalance, especially compared to HP's like the Empys, which do not have as bad of an upper midrange dip.

Having owned the 4z I can say that it is a great headphone. The mids are thicker than the empyrean and it has a bit more sparkle up top. For me the ab1266 phi tc is better in every regard than both the 4z and empyrean. The detail retrieval and sound stage are simply breath taking. I still love my lcd x and clears but am thinking about selling them to fund some rel s3 subs for my 2 channel system. The abyss does take alot of trial and error to get the fit right. But when you do it is incredible.

 

[mixman]

Having owned the 4z I can say that it is a great headphone. The mids are thicker than the empyrean and it has a bit more sparkle up top. For me the ab1266 phi tc is better in every regard than both the 4z and empyrean. The detail retrieval and sound stage are simply breath taking. I still love my lcd x and clears but am thinking about selling them to fund some rel s3 subs for my 2 channel system. The abyss does take alot of trial and error to get the fit right. But when you do it is incredible.

If I have to say something really good about the 1266 I would say that I do think sound wise this is the headphone that Audeze should have designed........Better soundstage, more coherent tonal balance and slightly better dynamics. Although, I would say the 4z did sound more natural, because as I mentioned earlier the 1266 timbre just seemed off.

Design wise the 1266 is a mess. That damn clamp needs to go. Anything that is more clampy than Audeze, has a problem. Also after $5K no upgrade path for Phi owners is a crime. Audeze, for a fee of course did allow 100 ohm 4 owners upgrade to 200 ohm drivers. Overall I see no real compelling reason to own the 1266 or get into that ecosystem. I would purchase the Susvara first and be content with the 4z as a companion HP.

 

[CreditingKarma]

If I have to say something really good about the 1266 I would say that I do think sound wise this is the headphone that Audeze should have designed........Better soundstage, more coherent tonal balance and slightly better dynamics. Although, I would say the 4z did sound more natural, because as I mentioned earlier the 1266 timbre just seemed off.

Design wise the 1266 is a mess. That damn clamp needs to go. Anything that is more clampy than Audeze, has a problem. Also after $5K no upgrade path for Phi owners is a crime. Audeze, for a fee of course did allow 100 ohm 4 owners upgrade to 200 ohm drivers. Overall I see no real compelling reason to own the 1266 or get into that ecosystem. I would purchase the Susvara first and be content with the 4z as a companion HP.

The clamp on the 4z was a bit of an issue. With the 1266 it is about getting the fit right. You can bend the frame on it. I opened them all the way up and slightly bent the frame. Now there is zero clamp on the 1266. It is actually strange to use the LCD x or clear and feels like they clamp hard I know that they don't. The Sonoma m1 now there is a can with some serious clamp.

The look of the 1266 is a down side for sure.the 4z looks alot better imo. They said that the 1266 couldn't be upgraded because there was too much that was different from the phi to the tc. Hifiman has issues with constant release of new cans. To each their own as long as you are happy.

 

[mixman]

The clamp on the 4z was a bit of an issue. With the 1266 it is about getting the fit right. You can bend the frame on it. I opened them all the way up and slightly bent the frame. Now there is zero clamp on the 1266. It is actually strange to use the LCD x or clear and feels like they clamp hard I know that they don't. The Sonoma m1 now there is a can with some serious clamp.

The look of the 1266 is a down side for sure.the 4z looks alot better imo. They said that the 1266 couldn't be upgraded because there was too much that was different from the phi to the tc. Hifiman has issues with constant release of new cans. To each their own as long as you are happy.

Hifiman generally offers an upgrade program. Abyss did not. This is why there are so many used Phi’s for sale right now. I might pick one up if I see a used Phi at about $2,500 or they come out with a newer version and people start dumping their TC’s.

 

[jlbrach]

If I have to say something really good about the 1266 I would say that I do think sound wise this is the headphone that Audeze should have designed........Better soundstage, more coherent tonal balance and slightly better dynamics. Although, I would say the 4z did sound more natural, because as I mentioned earlier the 1266 timbre just seemed off.

Design wise the 1266 is a mess. That damn clamp needs to go. Anything that is more clampy than Audeze, has a problem. Also after $5K no upgrade path for Phi owners is a crime. Audeze, for a fee of course did allow 100 ohm 4 owners upgrade to 200 ohm drivers. Overall I see no real compelling reason to own the 1266 or get into that ecosystem. I would purchase the Susvara first and be content with the 4z as a companion HP.

Not sure what you are referring to in terms of clamping with the 1266 as i basically feel almost nothing on my head or any clamping pressure as these are designed to float just off of your ears and can be adjusted as you wish...the lcd-4 and 4z have much tighter clamping pressure, not even remotely close...

 

[CreditingKarma]

Not sure what you are referring to in terms of clamping with the 1266 as i basically feel almost nothing on my head or any clamping pressure as these are designed to float just off of your ears and can be adjusted as you wish...the lcd-4 and 4z have much tighter clamping pressure, not even remotely close...

Same here there is no clamp with the 1266. They just float.

Hifiman generally offers an upgrade program. Abyss did not. This is why there are so many used Phi’s for sale right now. I might pick one up if I see a used Phi at about $2,500 or they come out with a newer version and people start dumping their TC’s.

Abyss did offer an upgrade from the original 1266 to the phi. They just didn't offer an upgrade from the phi to the tc. I honestly can't see myself upgrading from the tc anytime soon. To me it is the best headphone this side of the orpheus. Now I am trying to get my two channel to the same level. For that I think it will cost upwards of over $30k in speakers.

 

[mixman]

Not sure what you are referring to in terms of clamping with the 1266 as i basically feel almost nothing on my head or any clamping pressure as these are designed to float just off of your ears and can be adjusted as you wish...the lcd-4 and 4z have much tighter clamping pressure, not even remotely close...

Same here there is no clamp with the 1266. They just float.



Abyss did offer an upgrade from the original 1266 to the phi. They just didn't offer an upgrade from the phi to the tc. I honestly can't see myself upgrading from the tc anytime soon. To me it is the best headphone this side of the orpheus. Now I am trying to get my two channel to the same level. For that I think it will cost upwards of over $30k in speakers.

Now that two of the main 1266 advocates are here, I can say what I feel without being rude and posting in the 1266 thread. The clamping issues are real, not just me. Now maybe my head is too large, but the 1266 is too clampy. I did read up on the proper adjustment before this audition and spent time getting it right. It still stinks for me as far as clamping pressure. So for me, the clamping pressure is worse than the 4z, which I had right beside it.

Do I think the 1266 is good? Yes, one of the best. Is it the absolute best headphone? For me, no. There are too many variables with it to say that. Go to the Utopia thread they claim their headphone is the best too.

Jlbrach.....I think you do a bit of disservice to these headphones as you are creating too high of an expectation on them. Not everyone will think they are as good as you, no matter what the equipment is behind them. They are really good headphones but do not transcend headphone tech......yet.

 

[jlbrach]

i accept that all of the HP's are subjective....

 

[CreditingKarma]

Now that two of the main 1266 advocates are here, I can say what I feel without being rude and posting in the 1266 thread. The clamping issues are real, not just me. Now maybe my head is too large, but the 1266 is too clampy. I did read up on the proper adjustment before this audition and spent time getting it right. It still stinks for me as far as clamping pressure. So for me, the clamping pressure is worse than the 4z, which I had right beside it.

Do I think the 1266 is good? Yes, one of the best. Is it the absolute best headphone? For me, no. There are too many variables with it to say that. Go to the Utopia thread they claim their headphone is the best too.

Jlbrach.....I think you do a bit of disservice to these headphones as you are creating too high of an expectation on them. Not everyone will think they are as good as you, no matter what the equipment is behind them. They are really good headphones but do not transcend headphone tech......yet.

All headphones are subjective. Not everyone will like everything. I loved the 4z and regretted selling it almost immediately. I really like the susvara driven from the headtrip level 2. There is no way I could justify spending that much on a headphone and then $15k on an amp to drive them.

The 1266 might not be the best for everyone. For me it is my end game. I live them out of an auris nirvana but that is a pricey amp too. Maybe some day but first I want to upgrade my 2 channel with 2 rel s3 subs and then upgrade my dynaudio c1 to some rockport arias or magico s3.

In the end I love this hobby for its variations and all of the people. That is why I still have my LCD x and clears.

Enjoy the music

 

[mixman]

i accept that all of the HP's are subjective....

True, in the end it’s all about preference. Heck you may wake up tomorrow and say....” all I need is my Susvara, I heard something magical with them last night” and at that point you may not need your TC’s

All headphones are subjective. Not everyone will like everything. I loved the 4z and regretted selling it almost immediately. I really like the susvara driven from the headtrip level 2. There is no way I could justify spending that much on a headphone and then $15k on an amp to drive them.

The 1266 might not be the best for everyone. For me it is my end game. I live them out of an auris nirvana but that is a pricey amp too. Maybe some day but first I want to upgrade my 2 channel with 2 rel s3 subs and then upgrade my dynaudio c1 to some rockport arias or magico s3.

In the end I love this hobby for its variations and all of the people. That is why I still have my LCD x and clears.

Enjoy the music

Believe it or not, other than the exotic headphones like the Shagri la and He-1, the 1266 is the most expensive headphone according to actual street pricing. The Susvara can be had all day at steep discounts the 1266 cannot. So one has to consider that when buying them, to ascertain whether they are worth it to them.

Oh I would say before you buy the Rel subs look into the JL Audio Fathom excellent subs. If you want to talk more two channel subs pm me.

 

[jlbrach]

Love my susvara it is fantastic

 

[mixman]

Love my susvara it is fantastic

I love Susvara too, but all of that talk about amps on that thread makes me dizzy! I do agree with you about amps for the Susvara. You do not have to have to a speaker amp to make them sound great. Hell, I heard them on a GSX mini and they sounded damn good. Now with the Formula you have, they must sound even better. I think speaker amps are just a luxury, especially if space is important.

 

[jlbrach]

we are in agreement

 

[nick97]

I just got my 4Z about a week ago, bought a Forza audio cable for it and just got the new dragonfly Cobalt today and honestly couldn't be happier, these things are big bold and beautiful In design and sound