[bangraman]

Quote:

Originally Posted by idiotekniQues with sound quality, and went with a company that tried harder earlier on

Odd that. The ultimate fidelity at that time was lower than the then-iPods but the M3 offered more stable performance with low-impedance loads. The X5 has the same performance as the M3 in all sonic and music-player respects. I considered it a tie on aggregate between the M3 and the iPod then based on different attributes. Now, Apple seems to have dragged themselves down to iAudio levels in terms of achievable fidelity to be competitive, and to achieve a more stable operation with all loads. It makes sense... the vast majority of people don't really care about achievable sound quality but the tone. The iPod's performance in that respect was certainly hurting Apple. The 5G is now very much a X5 sound-alike, although it is still superior in some respects. It makes the iPod more usable certainly for more people, but the performance the mono iPods gave with my higher-impedance phones was worth noting.

 

[PixelSquish]

the only ipod ive listened too for any extended time period was i think the 4g. it was bought a year and a half ago at an apple store by a friend. i am guessing 4g.

i listened to it with the same buds i had on my x5L this summer. i thought the same tracks sounded better on the x5. i used the headphone out on the ipod, not the line-out. ditto with the x5.

on top of that, i enjoy the sound features the x5 has as options. i never use mpenhance, only bbe sometimes at like setting 2, and the m3bass when i listen to certain types of music. i also use the equalizer sparingly. a user eq is a plus IMO.

i am definitely ticked at cowon for having the bass roll-off on the line-out, but since i never use the line-out, i really dont worry about it. however, they should straighten that out because it is quite simply not right. i am wondering if the m5 has the issue, though it probably does. i will see what the next generation x5 does with the bass roll-off.

i am glad for all ipod lovers that the 5g is a notch above the older ones, after all these years its good apple finally figured things out and decided it was worth their effort to do something about it.

 

[bangraman]

As I wrote, the situation is a little different if you use genuine high-end gear and you do actually care about sound quality a good deal, as opposed to just some X5 fanboy who has yet to get into decent cans.

 

[PixelSquish]

Quote:

Originally Posted by bangraman As I wrote, the situation is a little different if you use genuine high-end gear and you do actually care about sound quality a good deal, as opposed to just some X5 fanboy who has yet to get into decent cans.

i use my x5 for portable use, therefore i would only walk around with iem's. i like to keep it in my pocket with the phones all in one package. also being that i want to keep it all in my pocket, i dont want to carry around an amp as well.

at home i use an average onkyo receiver. i use akg240 studios which aren't top end, but they arent any slouches either.

they need an amp for portable use, the x5 cant drive them, even at the highest volume well enough, and they have a pretty good headphone output for an mp3 player. instead i am getting the um1's for xmas until i can afford the um2's in a year or so.

as far as sound quality goes, there was blind test done with some high end cans in a blind test, a sony consistently won out, the ipod photo consistently got worse. i dont know who was judging, it was performed at cnet.

however i remember a couple years back when i was lookin on this site about mp3 players, the majority of people seemed to agree that the ipods were lacking in the sound quality department. this seemed to be the consensus around a lot of audio sites. many seemed to be fairly unbiased, as well as knowledgeable.

i suppose it is quite possible they were all wrong,and you are right. that definitely falls within the realm of possibility.

 

[bangraman]

Quote:

Originally Posted by idiotekniQues as far as sound quality goes, there was blind test done with some high end cans in a blind test, a sony consistently won out, the ipod photo consistently got worse. i dont know who was judging, it was performed at cnet.

As I said elsewhere, that result doesn't surprise me very much. The 4G Photos had some additional issues throwing away the sound quality advantage with anything but an almost line-level load, but keeping the falloff (not a good idea, I'm sure you'll agree), and the test phones they used were Grado SR60's... a pretty fair comparison and one that the iPod Photo clearly failed to match up to given it's peccadilloes. Spad I think disagreed, but to me the difference between a 3/4G and a Photo was pretty clear in terms of quality, if not in tone.


That aside though, I've noticed that many people (including those who believe they are able to differentiate high quality) tend to react far more readily to a change in tone than a change in quality. You can have a noticeably inferior source in terms of quality, but if it offers a more agreeable tone, many people do tend to label that of being higher quality. The thing is of course, you can change tone but you can't change quality. And it does depend on which you actually are looking for when you define 'high quality'. I do a mix of bench tests and listening tests, with a heavy emphasis on the listening but with sufficient bench testing to allow me to keep my results valid in terms of statements of quality. Ultimately when I'm listening on a daily basis I don't analyse on this level, but in order to say x is better than y, I do like to actually give both a fair shot. If being more dilligent about what I say makes me different, well I'm OK with that.

 

[omendelovitz]

Quote:

Originally Posted by bangraman As I wrote, the situation is a little different if you use genuine high-end gear and you do actually care about sound quality a good deal, as opposed to just some X5 fanboy who has yet to get into decent cans.

I do hope you don't mean me, bangraman.

I'm not sure, but k701's, SR-125's and E4's are not low end phones and I am by no means a fanboy. Truthfully, I've found that SRS labs' enhancements are similar in SQ improvement to the BBE and surround features offered by the X5. I've never had the chance to play around w/ the 5g pods, but after the 4th gen, and with the issues plaguing the early photo pods, I just gave up on Apple. I also dealt with many quality issues on 2 of the 3 pods I had and hated dealing with the CSR @ Apple. In all fairness however, Cowon's customer support is no better, and possibly even worse, so... but at least I have no quality issues with the X5.

Anyway, since I was happy with the iAudio sound, I haven't used any new DAP sources since, except for a samsung flash player (for the gym, but sounds decent).

BTW, idiotekniques, thanks for covering my backside, my brotha!

 

[MD1032]

It seems like the ipod is finally getting better and is better accepted around here. To be honest, though, if I had the money, the ipod still doesn't do it for me. I mean, for $300, the ipod does everything absolutely perfectly (you have to admit the scroll wheel is genius once you get used to its feel) except for one thing: durability. I mean, sure, I could run it over with a car and it would still work, but I don't want it to just work, I want it to also be durable to a certain degree, and every ipod I've ever seen needs some kind of protective case to keep its all-too-easily scratched surface looking brand new. Meanwhile, my MZ-S1 has been dropped from six feet onto solid concrete among other things and is a little scratched, but by no means scratched to the point where it's ugly or not usable. On the other hand, there are many band members who own ipods at my school, and their screens and surfaces are all scratched to a fuzzy rough surface unless they absolutely baby their ipods. This isn't what I like to see in an MP3 player that's going to be stored in slightly abrasive places at times or even in pockets (because one Alto Sax player keeps his Nano in his pocket all the time and the screen is barely readable anymore).

So yeah, once durability and gapless are a non-issue, the ipod will be perfect. Until then, enjoy that new mirror finish while it lasts.

 

[Rock&Roll Ninja]

I just enlisted yesterday. I brought my 3rd gen iPod with me.

But I never liked the earbuds. I use a $9 pair of Sonys.

 

[fewtch]

Quote:

Originally Posted by idiotekniQues i suppose it is quite possible they were all wrong,and you are right. that definitely falls within the realm of possibility.

Careful with Bangra... if you contradict him and/or question his experience, he'll be on your case from then on.

 

[omendelovitz]

Quote:

Originally Posted by fewtch Careful with Bangra... if you contradict him and/or question his experience, he'll be on your case from then on.

I've already taken that beating slightly, but in his defence, he seems to have done his homework. Check out his blog:

http://phonephile.blogspot.com/

He seems to have done a lot of work w/iPods and X5's; I'm still trying to interpret his work...

 

[fewtch]

Quote:

Originally Posted by omendelovitz I've already taken that beating slightly, but in his defence, he seems to have done his homework. Check out his blog: http://phonephile.blogspot.com/ He seems to have done a lot of work w/iPods and X5's; I'm still trying to interpret his work...

I'd just say trust your own ears... don't let anyone tell you what you hear and what you don't.

Ever hear that old saw that ends in "...and beat you with experience" ?

 

[omendelovitz]

hey fewtch,

on a side note; what are the koss PortaPro 2's?

 

[fewtch]

Quote:

Originally Posted by omendelovitz hey fewtch, on a side note; what are the koss PortaPro 2's?

Portapro, minus a few adjustment options... no longer sold anywhere, AFAIK.

 

[bangraman]

Quote:

Originally Posted by fewtch Careful with Bangra... if you contradict him and/or question his experience, he'll be on your case from then on.

I don't have any issues with anyone who has done their homework. In fact, you could say I'm here to discuss audio with those sorts of people. The only people I have issues with are those who assume and hypothesise on top of their very limited experience, tell you their very definitive opinions before getting into a contrary discussion caused by their own lack of experience and ending with "I'd just say trust your own ears...". People like that probably deserve a little poke every now and again

 

[bigshot]

You must find yourself very busy around this forum.

See ya
Steve