Anyone own or have experience with Hybrid cars?
Mar 21, 2007 at 6:09 AM Post #16 of 28
Quote:

Originally Posted by uzziah /img/forum/go_quote.gif
for crying out loud, my 91 civic hatchback gets about 42mpg highway


The Hybrid Camry isn't a "max mileage" vehicle. It's leveraging hybrid technology to provide 3.0L V6 performance at 2.0L I4 mileage.
 
Mar 21, 2007 at 6:10 AM Post #17 of 28
Quote:

for crying out loud, my 91 civic hatchback gets about 42mpg highway


The 34 mpg is a conservative combined city/hwy real-world number for the 2007 Camry which is considerably larger and heavier than a 91Civic. The Toyota Yaris and several other small cars also have excellent milage numbers, but they are simply too small for me.
 
Mar 21, 2007 at 6:14 AM Post #18 of 28
Quote:

Originally Posted by marvin /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Going to be a while. Plug in hybrids are a strictly enthusiast affair for the near future due to technological constraints. Battery capacity isn't even close to supporting a serious plug in hybrid or electric car


you think so, huh? i thought there were great advancements in batteries going on. would it take so much room in the car to put enough batteries to run it for say 50miles or so? enough for a lot of commutes. maybe so, i don't know
 
Mar 21, 2007 at 6:17 AM Post #19 of 28
Quote:

Originally Posted by mbriant /img/forum/go_quote.gif
The 34 mpg is a conservative combined city/hwy real-world number for the 2007 Camry which is considerably larger and heavier than a 91Civic. The Toyota Yaris and several other small cars also have excellent milage numbers, but they are simply too small for me.



yeah, it's a bit of a shame though. honda made this VX engine for about a year and half and the thing is incredibly economical. of course it's rather weak, and you're right, the car is VERY lightweight, and thus not terribly safe. still, seems strange.


so yeah, i think my final thoughts on the matter are:

1. get what car will make you happy; hopefully getting decent mileage makes you happy
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2. if you're really interested in cheap and economical, an old civic, toyota tercel, something like that, is probably the best way to go. the longer old cars are driven, the less new ones are needed, and the less the overall cost of car production, which is extremely energy and material hungry of course



right now i drive a 94 salvage ford explorer, and though it gets lousy mileage, i think for me it's actually more environmentally friendly to keep it. mainly because i hardly drive it. take the bus to school, and around town, drive the ford once in awhile to get groceries, and buying a new car is a big energy sink. of course i also am poor
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Mar 21, 2007 at 6:42 AM Post #20 of 28
Quote:

Originally Posted by uzziah /img/forum/go_quote.gif
you think so, huh? i thought there were great advancements in batteries going on. would it take so much room in the car to put enough batteries to run it for say 50miles or so? enough for a lot of commutes. maybe so, i don't know


Not really practical with the mild hybrids that Toyota and Co are doing now. Enthusiast tinkering has yielded about 10 miles worth of range from adding on extra batteries. While I'd expect a factory effort to do better, the electric motor design used in current hybrids really isn't made for high speed operation. That's the bigger problem than battery capacity for "battery only" hybrid operation.

If diesel-electric technology ever catches on in the personal vehicle market though, short trip battery only operation will be a reality. Course, it'll need better batteries than the ones available now.
 
Mar 21, 2007 at 9:30 AM Post #21 of 28
I have a little experience with the Prius. Last October, I took a trip from LA up into the northeastern corner of Oregon. As usual, it was to be a road trip. I poked around the rental companies here and found one renting the Prius. The numbers on gas made sense, so I went and rented one.

In short, I loved it. I put around 4,000 miles on it, and it performed flawlessly. It turned in 50 MPG or so (mostly highway) and was great on the highway. It climbed more than a few mountain passes and did alright. I had to move a few things, and when you fold down the rear seats it has about as much room as a station wagon.

The only thing I couldn't stand was that weird wing that bisects the rear window. I sorta got used to it, but it drove me nuts the first thousand miles or so. It wouldn't be a dealbreaker for me, but I wish the engineers had done something else.

I liked it so much that I came pretty close to buying one last month. The reason I didn't is because it's a little too much car for me. Most of my driving is just me in the car. Also, I've only owned coupes and wanted another clutch. That added up to the Scion tC, which I bought and love.

There are a few practical considerations to the Prius. I purchased the 100k warranty with my car and Toyota mailed me the details this week. I read through the exclusions, etc., and discovered that Toyota's warranty does not cover hybrid batteries and parts of the regenerative brakes. Those are the two hybrid systems that freak me out a little. They're relatively new and unproven as well as proprietary. You can't get (at least I don't know of) aftermarket battery packs. One of the reasons I like the tC is that the mechanical parts borrow heavily from the Toyota parts bin, so I know what to expect from the engine, clutch, brakes, etc. I didn't know what to expect from the Prius. If this stuff goes, you could on the hook for some very expensive repairs.

Also, my sister-in-law owns one. She was hit by another driver (not her fault) and they had to replace some of the batteries and other systems. Though covered by insurance, the repairs were steep. I'm not sure what insurance is, but you can be sure that insurers figure this into your premium. Also, if it does get hit a few years from now, I imagine the insurer would be eager to total it, leaving you either buying used or several thousand short of a new one.

But still, if I had a family, I'd strongly consider the Prius. I loved that rental car.
 
Mar 21, 2007 at 11:52 PM Post #22 of 28
I've owned a Honda Insight for the last two years. The gas mileage I've gotten has been between 50mpg at the low end (lots of big hills in SoCal), and 72mpg on nice, flat ground in Texas. If you take it easy, keep your tire pressure high, gently accelerate, and watch your battery charge the Insight gets absoultely incredible gas mileage.

I'm 6'3" tall, and fit in this little car quite easily with room to spare.

If you can find one these are great cars that require veyr little gas, manuever in the tightest spots, and only lack one thing I wish they had: comfort. The seats are quite uncomfortable. A small pillow for your lower back does wonders, but can't make up for the uncomfortable design.

Overall I'm quite happy with hybrids and can only hope that they continue to improve upon the technologoy in the future.
 
Mar 22, 2007 at 12:20 AM Post #23 of 28
I bought 2 new cars lately, and hybrid was on my list, but decided to stay with conventional combustion. There were a few concerns I had when I do my analysis:

1. Upfront cost of hybrid
2. Limitation of batteries
3. Power for off-road
4. Long term maintenance of virtually 2 different engines in the same system.
5. Adoption of new technology (learned enough from software industry...
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)

I hope that this new technology might be a lot cheaper when they have more experiences, gaining enough momentum, and benefit from scale.
 
Mar 23, 2007 at 3:53 AM Post #24 of 28
My girlfriend has a Prius that we always take when we go somewhere by car, and I'm usually the one driving. I love that car. It is quiet and highly fuel efficient (great for city driving, with no gas wasted when stopped or creeping along in traffic), and it has lovely handling and a nice strong brake (I'm used to driving my mom's old 1996 Geo Tracker standard shift, which is in no way aerodynamic, and which has no power steering).

The Prius is the most pleasant-to-drive car I have ever operated. If it's cheaper and has better mileage than the Camry, I'd definitely recommend it.

As you noted, the Prius does not have wonderful acceleration, most noticeable when on the entrance ramp to a highway. I'm not bothered by this, and the OT said he wasn't either, so that's fine. It took a few times to get used to it next to my (crap) standard shift car, but now it's fine.
 
Mar 24, 2007 at 2:16 AM Post #25 of 28
If you are in CA the hybrid system is covered for 10yrs/100000miles by state law... same deal here in NJ.
Quote:

Originally Posted by Uncle Erik /img/forum/go_quote.gif

There are a few practical considerations to the Prius. I purchased the 100k warranty with my car and Toyota mailed me the details this week. I read through the exclusions, etc., and discovered that Toyota's warranty does not cover hybrid batteries and parts of the regenerative brakes. Those are the two hybrid systems that freak me out a little. They're relatively new and unproven as well as proprietary. You can't get (at least I don't know of) aftermarket battery packs. One of the reasons I like the tC is that the mechanical parts borrow heavily from the Toyota parts bin, so I know what to expect from the engine, clutch, brakes, etc. I didn't know what to expect from the Prius. If this stuff goes, you could on the hook for some very expensive repairs.



 
Mar 24, 2007 at 7:36 AM Post #26 of 28
Quote:

Originally Posted by Uncle Erik /img/forum/go_quote.gif
I read through the exclusions, etc., and discovered that Toyota's warranty does not cover hybrid batteries and parts of the regenerative brakes. Those are the two hybrid systems that freak me out a little. They're relatively new and unproven as well as proprietary.


Batteries are proven to fail. It's not a matter of if, it's a matter of when.

Whenever shopping for a Hybrid, make sure the battery, electrical, and charging system are covered for at least 10 years. Replacement costs will be in the thousands $$$$.

-Ed
 
Mar 24, 2007 at 4:53 PM Post #28 of 28
Quote:

Originally Posted by Edwood /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Whenever shopping for a Hybrid, make sure the battery, electrical, and charging system are covered for at least 10 years. Replacement costs will be in the thousands $$$$.

-Ed



I recently got a notice from Honda stating they would cover the battery and IMA in the Insight for 10 years / 150,000 IIRC.
 

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