[tellingthm]

sorry, but couldn't get much useful advice in another thread. here's my dilemma:

my 6i's broke after two years so i figured i'll upgrade instead of merely replacing; i've narrowed down my choices to UE s.f 5pro's or Shure E4's.
the 5pro's seem to have the sound i'm looking for, but the E4's seem to have much better isolation, comfort, and a lower profile. my primary use is commuting via muni w/ a 5.5g ipod.

can anybody w/ experience w/ s.f 5pro's and ety 6i's compare regarding comfort, isolation, and low profile (or lack thereof)? i've seen reports that the 5pro's stick out way too much, but i've seen the same of ety's. obviously i'm used to the ety's; are the 5pro's that much bigger? does the isolation of 5pro even compare to 6i? i don't really care about isolation w/ music off, but i like to listen to ipod at ~50% volume... can i do this w/ 5pro's and not be subjected to noise of a subway?

any experience w/ 6i's and E4's regarding isolation and sound quality, specifically how bass sounds while using ipod (no amp) and E4 compared to 6i & foam tips?

i'm not getting more ety's so please don't recommend i upgrade to the ER4's, and my budget isn't huge so please don't suggest something more expensive than the E4's... unless one knows where i can get EXTREMELY discounted UM2's

thanks everyone.

 

[tbonner1]

The 6i's are not in the same class as the UEs or E4.

The E4s are very clear in the midrange and treble. The bass on the E4 goes very deep despite what you may read about them being bass lite. What bass they do have in the middle and upper bass is well defined but reduced a bit compared to the midrange and treble.

That said, I like the UE SF5 pros. The bass is a bit overpowering but the overall sound is smooth and rich. For IEMs, they have a bit of soundstage. What many refer to as an extra fun factor in the UE's is that they are dynamic and sound good at low listening levels. They also sound good straight from a portable source such as my Iriver Clix.

 

[tbonner1]

The isolation is not that good on the UEs. You can read for the mod that reverses the cables (ie left cable to right earphone). It does alter the sound and they do not stick out like Frankenbolts.

 

[tellingthm]

how is the comfort and isolation of the 5pro's? are they a secure fit or do you have to constantly readjust em to maintain a seal?

 

[LFC_SL]

Quote:

Originally Posted by tbonner1 /img/forum/go_quote.gif The bass on the E4 goes very deep despite what you may read about them being bass lite. What bass they do have in the middle and upper bass is well defined but reduced a bit compared to the midrange and treble.

The E4 bass does go deep. But the E4 bass is still too light for me and doesn't have enough "thump". Impact if you will. Difference between the E4 and the UM2 for me was most apparent with drums in rock tracks and "The Chronic" album

I get better isolation from E4s (though I can only get foamies to work with them) than with my now gone 5Pro's. E4 has lower profile (although compared to UE, any non-full sized can does

)

 

[String Section]

I can't comment on the Etymotics, but, I just exchanged a set of Shure E4Cs for the Super.fi 5 Pros. The E4Cs were my first foray into IEMs, but I have years of experience with hi-fi equipment and speakers (my primary speakers are Von Schweikerts). My listening is about 50% orchestral, 30% acoustic jazz, with the remaining 20% a mix of bluegrass, pop, and country, so any equipment I try gets auditioned with a wide variety of music. I listen to CD and SACD exclusively.

The E4Cs were awful. The bass was anemic and the high treble was nonexistant. This made large orchestral works sound tiny and insignificant, and removed all the splash and presence of cymbals, drums, and violins. Pop and Jazz had no life. These problems could be ameliorated somewhat by using tone controls to boost the bass and treble, but the WORST problem was the boosted midrange. Voices, violins, saxophones, etc. all had an annoying "shout-through-a-funnel" quality to them. It was so unnatural sounding that I found them unlistenable. This quality persisted no matter what source or amplifier I fed them with. For comparison sake, I bought a pair of Sennheiser CX300s. Although they have their own shortcomings, (bloated bass and less detailed midrange) I would easily choos them over the Shures for their more natural sound.

So, I took advantage of Earphone Solutions' exchange policy and swapped the E4Cs for a pair of Super.fi 5 Pros. MUCH better. While still missing that last bit of high-frequency extension and "air", the SF5s have more realistic bass, more treble, and a FAR more natural-sounding midrange. They don't seem as responsive to EQ, however, but they don't really need it. There is a very slight bit of hiss with some sources, but my new Headphonia headphone amp cures this nicely.

So, my IEM experience is limited to three units, and I can't say that the Super.fis are the pinnacle of the IEM art, but I can emphatically state that the Super.fi 5 Pro is superior to the E4C on all counts.

One last thing: I keep reading statements here along the lines of "these IEMs don't have much bass, but they're great for classical." That kind of opinion is simply ignorant. ALL kinds of music require ALL of the frequency spectrum to be accurately represented. Orchestral music has TONS of bass energy, and requires both power and and finesse in the bass regions to be reproduced convincingly.

Rock on.

 

[dwchin]

Quote:

Originally Posted by tellingthm /img/forum/go_quote.gif how is the comfort and isolation of the 5pro's? are they a secure fit or do you have to constantly readjust em to maintain a seal?

Personally, I have no problems with isolation on the UEs. I own all 3 pairs you're trying to compare, and I get the same amount of isolation from the Shures as I do with the UEs. I would rate the UEs more comfortable than the Shures just based on the fit and feel of the UE silicone sleeves. The Shures are not uncomfortable by any means, but I don't use foam sleeves and the UE silicone sleeves are a little "softer" in my ears than both types of Shure's stock non-foams. I can wear the UEs for hours without noticing them, but the Shures are noticeable after a few hours, though not so uncomfortable that I feel the need to stop listening. The UEs do stick out more, and if you're looking for a profile similar to the ER-6i, then the Shures would be better suited for you.

 

[tbonner1]

quote-The E4Cs were awful. The bass was anemic and the high treble was nonexistant. This made large orchestral works sound tiny and insignificant

I think that is the experience for many users. I was able to get the E4C's to sound smoother and add some sparkle with tube amps and the right tubes. Tube amps can also fatten up the mid bass response which helps the E4s. It is all about the synergy. I do like the detail of the E4s but it takes alot of effort to coax mid bass out of them.

My impression was the consensus when the E4s first came out is that people thought the UE SF 5 pros were too bass heavy and people preferred the E4s for accuracy. I think the tide has shifted after time and more people prefer the UE's over the E4s.

 

[PiccoloNamek]

Time to even things out here: I have owned both the SF5Ps and the E4Cs, and I found the E4Cs to be completely, utterly, unequivocally better. Period. The 5 pros had fat, bloated bass, absolutely muddy mids (especially in the upper midrange) and were terribly uncomfortable to wear. The E4Cs are far more balanced across the whole spectrum. The bass is response is flat (but slightly higher than neutral), the mids are warm and forward, (but not excessively so) and the upper midrange is slightly rolled off. (But it doesn't sound as bad as it did on the 5Ps, because there isn't so much bass to drown it out.) The upper treble sounds fine, but being an IEM, it will never have the extension of a high-end dynamic can. They are also MUCH smaller than the 5Ps and take a larger variety of tips.

The thing I liked the most about the E4Cs was the extremely smooth, intimate midrange. It was the first thing I noticed when I first listened to them.

 

[andersoj]

I had the SFi.5Pros for a while and the e4c for about a week and would have to agree with PiccoloNamek. Don't get me wrong, I really enjoyed the 5Pros, but once I put them up against the E4c I realized how distorted there sound signature really was. It felt like there was a constant bass line that would conceal and taint the mids/mid highs and I couldn't get over it. I didn't end up keeping the E4s, because although they sounded good, they didn't wow me like my SFi5s, probably because I don't have an amp, although I found there fit and comfort to be superb. So I decided to opt for the other extreme, the ER-4P, which with my new comply tips I am very happy with. Now for the P->S cable and a Total Bit Head

If you don't want the ER-4 then Id say go with the 4c or the 6i (which I haven't heard, but is supposedly very comparable to the ER-4P). hope this helps.

 

[mudger]

Quote:

Originally Posted by tbonner1 /img/forum/go_quote.gif The isolation is not that good on the UEs. You can read for the mod that reverses the cables (ie left cable to right earphone). It does alter the sound and they do not stick out like Frankenbolts.

I have some super.fi's - Can you point me to this mod

 

[Indygreg]

Do a search for flip side mod or FS mod.

In a nutshell you put the right one in your left ear and left one in your right ear. The super quick way is to just bend the memory wire opposite of what it is now. The more complete way (so that R and L are what the artist meant) is to pop the wire off and connect to the other. There is some ridge or something to line up to make sure they are not out of phase - the bigger post on this tells more.

I cannot tell you how much better the SF.5 were in MY ears after this mod. I just found this mod last week when I was going to get a new set of IEMs becuase the SF5's never stayed sealed in my ears. It was like a new set of headphones. They sounded the same to me (which was always something I liked) but they stayed in perfectly, were more comfy, and stuck out less.

 

[tellingthm]

well, i just ordered the 5pro's. the FS mod sealed the deal for me. a big huge thanks for informing me about that, a big huge apologies to my wallet

 

[PiccoloNamek]

You'll be apologizing even more after a couple of days pass and you find out how terrible they sound, and how much they irritate your ears.

But seriously, I hope you end up liking them.

 

[gtp]

Quote:

Originally Posted by PiccoloNamek /img/forum/go_quote.gif ...when you find out how terrible they sound, and how much they irritate your ears.

Funny, that is exactly how I felt about Ety ER-4P!

I'll stick with my 5Pros (but I do reserve the right to buy Etys again at some point in the future

).