[shigzeo]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Coltrane /img/forum/go_quote.gif So you do feel that your ALO is worth the premium price difference compared to more reasonably priced models?

hello mr avatar-look-alike, i shall forgive you this once, otherwise, feel the rath of shigzeo... a nobody. actually, i am very tired of this one, let's part friends..

 

[jilgiljongiljing]

I dont think amps are over rated, I think they are over priced for what they offer. Whatever they might say about "high" quality components being used, the price sometimes is just not justifiable for its usage model.

 

[adfinni]

HELL NO THEY'RE NOT

When i first got my millett hybrid i couldn't tell a lot of difference between it and the headphone out on my arcam integrated. Then after a few weeks of listening i decided to test.

After plugging my hf-1's into the integrated (playing through my cd-63) i was disgusted by jsut how **** everything sounded. It was dark, had no detail, and one song on my new cyantific album (dnb) sounded totally wrong, with some sounds not even present. Then my millett broke and i fixed + modded it, and now it sounds better than ever as the new BG output caps have been broken in. It sounds truly sensational.

so cd-63 + mods (~$400) --> Millett + mods (~$300) --> HF-1's ($200), Im sure there isn't a rig anywhere in this price range and higher that would please me as much as that combo does.

The only other thing to do is a fully headphile makeover for my HF-1's, then im done with my headphone rig for a long long time until ive paid off my student loan and have enough money for a top-end single power amp

 

[Malakei]

I couldn't read through all 7 pages of responses to this but out of the few I did read I didn't hear anyone talk about volume. Sorry if im repeating something someone has already posted in this thread but are we not forgetting that the "main" purpose of an amp is to amplify the same signal? Not change it? I assumed that in most cases people want to listen to their music loud and clear, which is why so many people turn to headphone amps. Lack of sufficient wattage from line outs especially draws us to purchase something to basically, turn up the volume without losing quality. Realize this before you go buying an amp, if your current source plays your music clear and detailed at your desired listening volume, why buy an amp? If your unsatified with the sound your getting try a different set of cans or a different CD/MP3, if that still doesnt work, then and only then would I consider portable DACs and AMPs. In my case my Discman puts out a puny amt of volume so im forced to comply to that category and buy a headphone amp and with the wide variety of selection online I don't even know where to start because I cannot audition any of them. Keep in mind again that the amps are meant to amplify, not refine our music.

Cheers

 

[chris_ah1]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Malakei /img/forum/go_quote.gif I couldn't read through all 7 pages of responses to this but out of the few I did read I didn't hear anyone talk about volume. Sorry if im repeating something someone has already posted in this thread but are we not forgetting that the "main" purpose of an amp is to amplify the same signal? Not change it? I assumed that in most cases people want to listen to their music loud and clear, which is why so many people turn to headphone amps. Lack of sufficient wattage from line outs especially draws us to purchase something to basically, turn up the volume without losing quality. Realize this before you go buying an amp, if your current source plays your music clear and detailed at your desired listening volume, why buy an amp? If your unsatified with the sound your getting try a different set of cans or a different CD/MP3, if that still doesnt work, then and only then would I consider portable DACs and AMPs. In my case my Discman puts out a puny amt of volume so im forced to comply to that category and buy a headphone amp and with the wide variety of selection online I don't even know where to start because I cannot audition any of them. Keep in mind again that the amps are meant to amplify, not refine our music. Cheers

But even if the music player can put out enough power if there is still way too much electrical hiss and noise audible with that power then you would still be better off with a modestly powered amp and low noise floor.

 

[Malakei]

the amp shouldnt make any noise or hiss dissapear. if your player is hissing or making noise its because its not capable of putting out the volume stabily.

 

[Pete7]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Malakei /img/forum/go_quote.gif I couldn't read through all 7 pages of responses to this but out of the few I did read I didn't hear anyone talk about volume. Sorry if im repeating something someone has already posted in this thread but are we not forgetting that the "main" purpose of an amp is to amplify the same signal? Not change it? I assumed that in most cases people want to listen to their music loud and clear, which is why so many people turn to headphone amps. Lack of sufficient wattage from line outs especially draws us to purchase something to basically, turn up the volume without losing quality. Realize this before you go buying an amp, if your current source plays your music clear and detailed at your desired listening volume, why buy an amp? If your unsatified with the sound your getting try a different set of cans or a different CD/MP3, if that still doesnt work, then and only then would I consider portable DACs and AMPs. In my case my Discman puts out a puny amt of volume so im forced to comply to that category and buy a headphone amp and with the wide variety of selection online I don't even know where to start because I cannot audition any of them. Keep in mind again that the amps are meant to amplify, not refine our music. Cheers

I suggest you make use of the search function. Headphone amplifiers do more than simply increase the volume.

 

[chris_ah1]

but then again it hardly makes logical sense to replace one distortion with another...........even if you find the amp to have a nicer distorted sound

Malakei: yeah, I hadn't thought of it in that way before. But as I've found the amp let's me listen to the line out which has almost no noise whatsoever. Sure, the headphone out will have noise which the amp might amplify, but that is why nobody uses an amp from headphone outs.

 

[kira80]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Malakei /img/forum/go_quote.gif I couldn't read through all 7 pages of responses to this but out of the few I did read I didn't hear anyone talk about volume. Sorry if im repeating something someone has already posted in this thread but are we not forgetting that the "main" purpose of an amp is to amplify the same signal? Not change it? I assumed that in most cases people want to listen to their music loud and clear, which is why so many people turn to headphone amps. Lack of sufficient wattage from line outs especially draws us to purchase something to basically, turn up the volume without losing quality. Realize this before you go buying an amp, if your current source plays your music clear and detailed at your desired listening volume, why buy an amp? If your unsatified with the sound your getting try a different set of cans or a different CD/MP3, if that still doesnt work, then and only then would I consider portable DACs and AMPs. In my case my Discman puts out a puny amt of volume so im forced to comply to that category and buy a headphone amp and with the wide variety of selection online I don't even know where to start because I cannot audition any of them. Keep in mind again that the amps are meant to amplify, not refine our music. Cheers

It's not that simple.
A headphone amplifier with a gain of 1 would still be usefull.

Headphone outs are poor voltage sources. When you put a load on them the signal is reduced and distorted. The main purpose of a headphone amp is not to amplify the signal but to reduce this effect. As I understand them, headphone amps are high quality power amplifiers. The gain is just a side-effect.

But do headphone amps have such a noticeable impact on the sound quality that it really justifies spending hundreds of $ on them ? That's the question...

 

[Skylab]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Malakei /img/forum/go_quote.gif the amp shouldnt make any noise or hiss dissapear. if your player is hissing or making noise its because its not capable of putting out the volume stabily.

This just completely ignores the fact that a players LINE OUT can be much cleaner than it's headphone out, which is often the case, in fact. You can get a hiss-free line out, but not a hiss-free headphone out. And this can also vary with headphone impedance.

Specific example: The Super.fi 5 pro hisses with the 5.5G iPod. Unacceptably. But via the line out and a decent amp - no hiss. This, to me, is a BIG deal.

 

[Skylab]

Also, I have a theory I'd like to test. If you are willing, please post whether you think amps make a big difference, and your age. I'll start:

Yes, and I'm 40.

 

[arnaud]

It's probably been said in these 7 pages, but I'll put my 2cents:
> I am using a portable amp (Tomahawk) with IEMs (Sensas 2X-S), the source is a nano 2G, the cable is a basic Qables LOD
> The headphone out of the nano 2G is the following when compared to the amp (now 40hours burned-in): shrill sounding, anemic bass, major lack of punch, muddy highs
> Differences between the headphone out of the nano and the amp go from dramatic to subtle depending on the recording.

So it seems I am hearing things differently from you. Is it because of the source or the headphones? Possibly both but even and foremost I think this is due to:
1. the type of music you're listening to. Unexceptional (and dynamically compressed) recordings like most mordern rock album make a moot-point of discussing audiophile attributes like soundstage, extension, seperation, detail, dynamic... Anybody will be hard pressed to pick up differences among amps if you're listening to a "bad" recording.
2. how sensitive you are to sound quality. No offense, but as was mentioned here, most people don't hear subtleties we deal with on Head-Fi. Furthermore, nobody has a fine ear from the start and it actually gets trained through listening to bunch of equipment (especially refined audio stuff). Basically, it's like food, the finer you eat, the more picky you become.

As we say, ignorance is a bliss and also a blessing for your wallet. If you're satisfied with a laptop sound card because it's "distortion" fairs well with your headphones, then so be it. Enjoy the income being made available with the sell of your audio gear and buy CDs (bad sounding to prevent upgraditis ;-P)

BTW, The amp is at 1x gain setting, so I am using it as a buffer...

arnaud.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chef Medeski /img/forum/go_quote.gif I have HF-1s. Etymotic ER-4S. I love them to death. Etys were my first real cans. Grados have always been something special for me, and special woody editions only makes them even better. All I heard about them was, AMPS HELP SO MUCH. I was weary though cause I hate making things complicated with Amps. I mean I love just carrying around my iPod, its so slick. But add an amp, extra cables. Batteries. It gets complicated. Yet, finally Head-fi pulled me. I got a Bithead, perfect, right. Its a DAC plus amp itll give me new levels of sound. Plug everything in . Where's the difference? Ok... understandable, its very liad back probably not my style. Dont get discouraged, just sell it. Sold it at $40 lost due to customs. Decide to buy a Tomahawk. Much more present of an amp. Nice small, hopefully it wont be burdensome. Plus amde for Etys and HF-1. Perfect! Well I thought my first one was defective, which might have just been my mind working. But the second one I guess I so wanted to just the $300 spent that my mind tricked me into thinking it sounded great. Sure it was hard to proof. So, I've been carrying it around with me recently. Fun and games. Then I plugged my HF-1s into my computer to hear some old school Beatles. And you no what. It blew me away. This is what I use to love, the detail and quality. The amazing sound. This blew me away in the beginning with buying great headphones. The almost ear-gasm. Then it never returned and I guess I searched for amps to allow me to hear again. Yet to no prevail. Suddenly its the crappy headphone out of my computer making me hear and feel the vibe. I'm thinkin I'm goin to sell my Toma. Its a great product. I just cant justify $300 on a device when I cant hear a difference. I mean I can hear subtleties. But I don't pay subtleties for $300.... atleast not yet. Just wanted to put this out. For those who lookin to buy. It wont always help that much. Headphones are probably the best upgrade ever. Sources make a huge difference. But... if the complexity and cumbersomeness of portable amps has you not wanting to buy one. Dont. The sound isnt worth it. Save yourself some money. Go buy a couple nice albums. Treat yourself to a nice ice cream. And put some money in the bank. If you double check and see that account is just begging to be plucked. Well then splurge away, but I think Blind Testing and critical listening might help you decide for yourself that it really isnt worth it. Especially if it takes you 3 weeks salary to get $300 as it does for most part timers/students like me. Just remember. Enjoy the music and keep your wallet tight! Then you will always enjoy what you have.

 

[fordgtlover]

I was a little sceptical at first, but after spending $20 to make a Cmoy, I could tell the difference straight away. Then add the ability to take a line out signal from my iPod and then amplify that much cleaner signal - SQ increases noticably.

I have compared the SQ of my humble arrangement Senn HD580, iPod Mini w/lineout and Zero Audiocraft Cmoy ($50), and compared it to my HD580 driven from the headphoen socket of my luxman and denon amps. No comparo - the ipod and Zero Audio Craft win hands down.

Do headphone amps make a difference? Only if you care about sound quality.

BTW, I'm nearly 40 - but I have better quality hearing than my teenage kids; maybe not in frequency response but certainly in perception of fidelity.

 

[Skylab]

Quote:

Originally Posted by fordgtlover /img/forum/go_quote.gif BTW, I'm nearly 40 - but I have better quality hearing than my teenage kids; maybe not in frequency response but certainly in perception of fidelity.

That's actually my suppostion. No offense to our younger members, but I believe that one learns to "listen" no nuances over the course of one's life, and that it may be that some of the younger head-fiers do not hear the difference that we older head-fiers do, simply because they have not yet learned to hear it. This is simply a matter of time spent listening, not inherent capability.

 

[Morph201]

Skylab, could ya stop wasting time posting on these threads and get those reviews out!! We need something to read!!