[IronDoq]

Well hello everyone, welcome!  Seeing as how this is my first post I suppose an introduction should be in order, but ehh.  It's a forum.  I've been fairly active on placed like OCN and [H], as prior to this my major emphasis has been with computers themselves, rather than their audio.
 
Well, it seems I can't attach pictures yet...?  I was gong to show you a picture of my computer, but I guess a link will have to suffice.
 
I currently have a pair of Sennheiser PC360s and a Creative Titanium HD, and while I love them, I can't help at marvel at all of the wonderful, glorious headphones that I've seen in my recent exploration of this site.  I've done enough browsing to know that I want something with an open soundstage with decent positional audio, something that'll benefit from the surround effects that my sound card offers.  
 
All of this my PC360s do, but I want something better.  Through much looking I narrowed it down to some AKG 702 anev. editions and the Hifiman HE-400s.  After further investigation I determined that the HE-400s would be much better suited to my love of dubstep and all things electronic in nature.  
 
My budget is around the 3-4 hundred dollar mark for the headphones and undetermined for the AMP/DAC.  I'm willing to pay for quality, but that's not to say I don't appreciate value.  Another note is that I'm still unsure if I need/want a dedicated DAC, as from what I've been able to gather, the DAC in my TiHD is apparently of decent quality, and that I probably wouldn't be able to tell a difference. 
 
So seeing as how I'm pretty dang set on the HE-400s, my real conundrum here is choosing an amp.  Portability is something that I still have to consider, and although I don't travel much, it would certainly be nice to have something available to me.  Then again, I've heard many times that the 400s aren't TOO difficult to drive, and that for traveling, my iPhone 5 should do enough to get me by.
 
I've done enough looking to know that I want something more tailored to delivering current than something tailored for high impedance headphones, but I'm still not sure how that narrows the playing field. I've considered many amps, and I'd say I'm willing to pay up to $250--300 for one, provided it's of good quality of construction and sound.
 
Things I've looked at, please give suggestions:
 
Objective O2 (good price, but I'd be willing to spend more)
Fiio E17/EO9K (since the E17 is a DAC, how would I connect this up to my soundcard?)
Shiit Asgard 2 (highish price, but looks damn good.  One of my main contenders)
Shiit Magni/Modi stack (again, this is confusing becasue I apparently already have a decent DAC in the soundcard.)
JDSlabs C5 (good portable sound, not sure if the portability, which would certainly be appreciated, will compromise its sound quality.)
 
Am I overthinking things?  My main point of confusion is whether or not I need an external DAC, although I'm led to understand that I don't.  Should I then just invest in a dedicated AMP?  Any and all help is greatly appreciated, thank you!

 

[PurpleAngel]

You would have to get an external DAC with a S/PDIF input (not USB) to be able to still use the Headphone Surround Sound features (CMSS-3D) of the T-HD (Titanium HD)
 
I would say to use the DAC feature on the T-HD and just get an external headphone amplifier and hook it up to the RCA outputs on T-HD.
 
I would think any one of these amplifiers could easily drive the HE-400.
Schiit Magni, $99
O2 (Objective 2), $150 (works off both AC & batteries)
Schiit Asgard II, $250
 
Not sure what amplifier works best with the HE-400, maybe ask on this link.
http://www.head-fi.org/t/604583/hifiman-he-400-impressions-and-discussion-thread/12270

 

[IronDoq]

Quote:

You would have to get an external DAC with a S/PDIF input (not USB) to be able to still use the Headphone Surround Sound features (CMSS-3D) of the T-HD (Titanium HD)
 
I would say to use the DAC feature on the T-HD and just get an external headphone amplifier and hook it up to the RCA outputs on T-HD.
 
I would think any one of these amplifiers could easily drive the HE-400.
Schiit Magni, $99
O2 (Objective 2), $150 (works off both AC & batteries)
Schiit Asgard II, $250
 
Not sure what amplifier works best with the HE-400, maybe ask on this link.
http://www.head-fi.org/t/604583/hifiman-he-400-impressions-and-discussion-thread/12270

Thanks for the quick reply, and for comfirming that I should probably just stick with the TiHD for the converting.  At this point it's between the Asgard and the O2, with the Asgard being more expensive but (probably?) better sounding amplification, and the O2, still sounding quite good, having the possibility of being able to run off of batteries for mobile use.  Oh, the decisions!  I'll ask over in the thread, wasn't sure if I should ask there of here.

 

[davidsh]

Wanna consider tubes as well, or you like solid state the most? I was thinking about the project ember

 

[IronDoq]

Quote:

Wanna consider tubes as well, or you like solid state the most? I was thinking about the project ember

Well seeing as how I've never had any experience with ANY outboard amps, it would be foolish of me to disregard something I've never tried!  So no, I'm not ruling anything out at this point.

 

[catspaw]

Personally i Have exactly what you have (Titanium HD and HE-400) and i use Asgard 1 as my amp.
 
Most of the time i use Fiio E17 as DAC through optical and then send the Signal to the Asgard, But ill try it from the Titanium and tell you what It goes like.
 
In general the Asgard pairs very well with the HE-400. Main reason is becouse its a slightly Warm amp, so it fills the laid back mids on the Asgard (Vocals dont feel so recessed).
 
Its the only Amp i have apart from the Fiio E17 itself, so its hard fot me to comment on other amps, but i do think the asgard is a safe bet.

 

[cel4145]

I just got the Asgard 2, and I like the sound a little better than the O2. But not so much that I think you should base your decision on that. The O2 is very good. If you like the potential portability of the O2, that's a plus. It also takes up much less room, The Asgard has the advantage of a little more power--so a little more headroom. Also has pre-outs so you can hook up speakers to it and control them with the volume pot on the Asgard if you'd like that (one of the reasons I got it).

 

[IronDoq]

Quote:

Personally i Have exactly what you have (Titanium HD and HE-400) and i use Asgard 1 as my amp.
 
Most of the time i use Fiio E17 as DAC through optical and then send the Signal to the Asgard, But ill try it from the Titanium and tell you what It goes like.
 
In general the Asgard pairs very well with the HE-400. Main reason is becouse its a slightly Warm amp, so it fills the laid back mids on the Asgard (Vocals dont feel so recessed).
 
Its the only Amp i have apart from the Fiio E17 itself, so its hard fot me to comment on other amps, but i do think the asgard is a safe bet.

Awesome, I'm glad to head it works well.  What outputs do you use, SPDIF I assume? Which bypasses the DAC on the soundcard but still retains the effects that it brings to the table.  Yes?  Please let me know how it sounds when you change it, I might just base my decision between the two.
Quote:

I just got the Asgard 2, and I like the sound a little better than the O2. But not so much that I think you should base your decision on that. The O2 is very good. If you like the potential portability of the O2, that's a plus. It also takes up much less room, The Asgard has the advantage of a little more power--so a little more headroom. Also has pre-outs so you can hook up speakers to it and control them with the volume pot on the Asgard if you'd like that (one of the reasons I got it).

I understand, do you, personally, feel that it's worth it? I have heard a ton about the O2, it's one of the frontrunners. The Asgard, though, has as you said, the option to be a pre-amp, which is nice.  And I might in the future want to add a standalone DAC to my setup, depending on the results of catspaw.
 
Thank you both for the advice, catpaw, I await your information!

 

[cel4145]

Dollar for dollar, the O2 is the better price/performance value over the Asgard 2. No doubt. And I probably wouldn't spend the extra $100 for the SQ difference alone. But the Asgard 2 is better build quality. The other thing is that the O2 controls are pretty crowded by the plugs once you get everything connected. Got a tiny volume knob.

So I think it depends more on whether or not the $100 is a lot to you, and whether or not everything other than SQ is attractive to you about the Asgard 2. And certainly if you see yourself continuing in the audio equipment hobby, I'd go with the Asgard 2 so you don't wonder what you missed and want to upgrade again as quickly

 

[johnman1116]

Sorry could you clarify this? You called the Asgard warm then said it had laid back mids? I think you meant HE-400. 
Quote:

In general the Asgard pairs very well with the HE-400. Main reason is becouse its a slightly Warm amp, so it fills the laid back mids on the Asgard (Vocals dont feel so recessed).
 
Its the only Amp i have apart from the Fiio E17 itself, so its hard fot me to comment on other amps, but i do think the asgard is a safe bet.

 
I also think a nice warm amp would mesh nicely with the HE-400 but the O2 would maybe "tame" its bass making it detailed while increasing the detail across the spectrum due to its black background and clarity.
 
I used to have an Asgard 1 about a year ago but currently have an O2 going through another amp in between. The O2 is definitely only of the best bang for buck headamps out there but its functions are very limited (one input, one output, 2 gain settting, every thing on front panel).
However like Cel4145 said, the Asgard 2 is of much better build, and the preouts are very nice. It just feels more like a desktop amp and worth the money in that sense.
 
anyways the HE-400 is not supposed to be very amp picky. Good luck! 

 

[blueangel2323]

You can just get the Schiit Magni without the Modi, and for $99 it's the best value of all the ones you listed. For a step up, the Matrix M-Stage, which is under $300, rivals many $1k amps.

 

[IronDoq]

Quote:

Dollar for dollar, the O2 is the better price/performance value over the Asgard 2. No doubt. And I probably wouldn't spend the extra $100 for the SQ difference alone. But the Asgard 2 is better build quality. The other thing is that the O2 controls are pretty crowded by the plugs once you get everything connected. Got a tiny volume knob.

So I think it depends more on whether or not the $100 is a lot to you, and whether or not everything other than SQ is attractive to you about the Asgard 2. And certainly if you see yourself continuing in the audio equipment hobby, I'd go with the Asgard 2 so you don't wonder what you missed and want to upgrade again as quickly

The asthetics of the O2 are really it's only downfall, I can't stand how cramped the front it.  I'm loving almost everything that Shiit it making with regards to looks, and from what I've heard (or rather, haven't) they sound great.
Quote:

Sorry could you clarify this? You called the Asgard warm then said it had laid back mids? I think you meant HE-400. 
 
I also think a nice warm amp would mesh nicely with the HE-400 but the O2 would maybe "tame" its bass making it detailed while increasing the detail across the spectrum due to its black background and clarity.
 
I used to have an Asgard 1 about a year ago but currently have an O2 going through another amp in between. The O2 is definitely only of the best bang for buck headamps out there but its functions are very limited (one input, one output, 2 gain settting, every thing on front panel).
However like Cel4145 said, the Asgard 2 is of much better build, and the preouts are very nice. It just feels more like a desktop amp and worth the money in that sense.
 
anyways the HE-400 is not supposed to be very amp picky. Good luck! 

Gah I've heard a lot about it not being picky, do you know if the same can be said about the HE-500s?  If I can spare some money on the amp, then I might just spring for the nicer headphones!
Quote:

You can just get the Schiit Magni without the Modi, and for $99 it's the best value of all the ones you listed. For a step up, the Matrix M-Stage, which is under $300, rivals many $1k amps.

I'm still definitely considering the trusty Magni, and the M-Stage is still a consideration.  
 
I'm well aware that i'm giving it too much thought and that whatever I get I'm going to be happy with, seeing as how it's going to be such a step up from what I have currently and that I won't have anything else to really compare it to.  Just trying to test the waters.  Damn head-fi... I'm starting to look into the HE-500s 

 

[johnman1116]

Its funny because the M-stage is a relatively old product thats making a come back. Highly recommended product though.
Any one of those amps are fine for driving basically anything (headphones).
 
HE-400 and HE-500 have different sound signatures and that's the main thing to consider.
Fun sound for reference sound. Mids for Bass (extension). Punch for Smooth. 
Huge generalizations but yea.
 
btw. just got the HE-400 

 

[IronDoq]

Quote:

Its funny because the M-stage is a relatively old product thats making a come back. Highly recommended product though.
Any one of those amps are fine for driving basically anything (headphones).
 
HE-400 and HE-500 have different sound signatures and that's the main thing to consider.
Fun sound for reference sound. Mids for Bass (extension). Punch for Smooth. 
Huge generalizations but yea.
 
btw. just got the HE-400 

This is the thing that I'm finally starting to understand, and something that my wallet desperately wants me to realize.  I just need to come to terms with it.  Very wise words, thank you.  But please to relate your experience with the headphones, what are you using to power them, and how are you liking them with regards to your tastes in music?

 

[catspaw]

Hehe, yes i meant that the HE-400 has slighly ressesed mids and that the asgard seems to fill them up a bit .
I will be able to test the HD Titanium by this weekend (long story short, i dont have the mental sanity untill the weekend to do that). 
Im not sure if the Optical (SPDIF I) output of the Titanium HD carries the effects of the sound card, ill try to figure that one out as well.