[thekrautdog]

Hey everyone, just looking for some expert advice. The 2 best headphones I own currently are the Beyer Amiron Home and Hifiman HE4XX. The thing is idk if I'm especially treble/high-mid sensitive but I can't seem to get away from an oppressive weariness from the upper part of the sound range. Well I guess that says that maybe I am lol. (I have tried a little equalizing to some small improvement but not enough and I prefer not to have to.) I think what's going to make it difficult is that I crave good detail (I mean, respective of my price range obviously) - I am a lyric junkie and want the vocals to be powerful and forward so that I can get emotionally into the songs that really move me. I hope this is not just a natural contradiction that can't be overcome. From what I have learned about headphones naturally I get to thinking about the Senn 6xx, and BTW they are right in my target price range also. I suppose I could consider going a bit higher in price since I'll be able to sell the other 2 for some $ if I find something that hits the mark. I'd still rather not get much pricier though lol. I know Senns can be polarizing ("veil" etc) but I'm wondering if they could fit my needs after some brain adjustment. Open to any other recommendations. I suppose it's clear that I'm looking for open circumaural and hopefully comfy.

(For a source I'm currently just using my LG V60 (so not using the planar at all) as I've had a problem with desktop dac/amps crapping out on me lately. I'll remedy that situation eventually but think the hp should come first.)

Thanks for any input!

 

[earmonger]

Yes, there is a tension between detail (which is largely defined by treble) and warmth (which usually means a boosted lower register and restrained treble). That's the "veil."

I think my go-to headphones, the Audio-Technica ATH-R70X, strike that balance really well. Photo is my avatar. This review turned out to be similar to my experience; it says the ATH-R70X is basically a one-up on the Sennheiser HD650. (The HD6XX is Drop's version of the HD650.)
https://www.theverge.com/2018/7/6/17535412/audio-technica-r70x-review-professional-headphones

They are made for studio use, leaning toward neutrality (R70 is for reference). Nothing is pushed in your face -- not bass, not midrange, not highs -- and the music just feels transparent, beautifully detailed. They are so light I have forgotten I am wearing them -- ultra comfortable.

If you are in the US or Europe, Thomann has them at a slightly lower price than the generally fixed $350, and Thomann also has a 30-day return policy if for some inexplicable reason they're not for you. I have now been using mine for hours a day for more than a year, and neither of the soft replaceable parts (pads and "wings") looks like it's wearing at all yet. The slotted overhead headband is some kind of springy, strong metal, not plastic; it's light yet anything but flimsy.

They are high-impedance and they appreciate power, though they still sound OK straight out of computer or phone. I run mine easily with the Venture Electronics Megatron, $56 shipped to US -- a little chunky, about the size of an external drive, but light. If they're in your budget they are worth a try.

 

[Shane D]

Hey everyone, just looking for some expert advice. The 2 best headphones I own currently are the Beyer Amiron Home and Hifiman HE4XX. The thing is idk if I'm especially treble/high-mid sensitive but I can't seem to get away from an oppressive weariness from the upper part of the sound range. Well I guess that says that maybe I am lol. (I have tried a little equalizing to some small improvement but not enough and I prefer not to have to.) I think what's going to make it difficult is that I crave good detail (I mean, respective of my price range obviously) - I am a lyric junkie and want the vocals to be powerful and forward so that I can get emotionally into the songs that really move me. I hope this is not just a natural contradiction that can't be overcome. From what I have learned about headphones naturally I get to thinking about the Senn 6xx, and BTW they are right in my target price range also. I suppose I could consider going a bit higher in price since I'll be able to sell the other 2 for some $ if I find something that hits the mark. I'd still rather not get much pricier though lol. I know Senns can be polarizing ("veil" etc) but I'm wondering if they could fit my needs after some brain adjustment. Open to any other recommendations. I suppose it's clear that I'm looking for open circumaural and hopefully comfy.

(For a source I'm currently just using my LG V60 (so not using the planar at all) as I've had a problem with desktop dac/amps crapping out on me lately. I'll remedy that situation eventually but think the hp should come first.)

Thanks for any input!

Not sure if you would consider used, but the Focal Elex's are one of my favourite headphones. Many of us have bought them on sale for $599.00, new. If you could get them for "around" $400.00, that is a great headphone. Great bass, awesome mids and enough treble you get you a full, detailed sound. They are referred to as W-shaped for a good reason.

I have owned the HD6XX's and they are OK, but do need some power. I think I enjoyed the HD58X's even more and they are only 150 Ohms. Still need an amp though.

A couple of weeks ago I picked up a used set of R70X's for a great price (about $200.00US). The most comfortable headphones I have ever put on. I don't find them very detailed though. My dongle (FiiO KA5) couldn't drive them good enough, but they are a lot of fun on my desktop system. They are 470 Ohms.

 

[thekrautdog]

Wow, that seems to be a real break in their trend for AT to make a 470 Ohm HP, though admittedly I am not very current on things. Great food for thought, my thanks to both of you!

 

[silent-circuit]

Wow, that seems to be a real break in their trend for AT to make a 470 Ohm HP, though admittedly I am not very current on things. Great food for thought, my thanks to both of you!

They're not that hard to drive (really no more than the HD6XX), most dongles just aren't suitable for full size headphones. That said, I also wouldn't recommend running them directly off a V60.

 

[IkSak]

I'll remedy that situation eventually but think the hp should come first

Very wise of you to think like that. Headphones play the main role in the audio chain. You can start buying a good dac/amp combo that are frequently found under 200 these days after getting the heaphones.

Not sure if you would consider used, but the Focal Elex's are one of my favourite headphones. Many of us have bought them on sale for $599.00, new. If you could get them for "around" $400.00, that is a great headphone

I was also going to suggest the Elex. I completely agree that they are have a nice, warm sound that is very enjoyable, with nice dynamism and good detail.

A week ago I saw one for $400 on the forum. At that price you get a great headphone that IMO could be drive reasonably well by your V60

 

[xanlamin]

Check out the Apps Caspian. Not many people talk about it here but it is an outstanding headphone. Warm, bassy and yet great clarity on midrange.

 

[thekrautdog]

Thanks for all the input guys. Just FYI I know I said what I said but I don't think I should get too far away from the $200+ -ish pricepoint. Maybe if I set $300 as the very top limit. I'll pull the "I'm on a fixed income"...it pretty much applies to everyone it's just that mine is fixed at a low amount atm . I can look for extreme used deals on those models mentioned. Being able to own a Focal would indeed be awesome if I could manage it.

 

[hakunamakaka]

HD650 and ignore the rest. V60 might not be sufficient for you, but if you look enough you can grab used mojo or any other older portable dac/amp within 150$.

On top if you really enjoy lyrics and human voices you can push these headphone even further with OTL tube amp once budget allows

 

[thekrautdog]

Thank you
You're not differentiating between the 650 and 6xx are you? By all accounts I've seen they are identical correct?

 

[hakunamakaka]

Thank you
You're not differentiating between the 650 and 6xx are you? By all accounts I've seen they are identical correct?

I heard HD600 and owned HD650. HD600 is brighter sound with less bass. it can be a bit too much for treble sensitive people. Technically they play in similar tier.

Timbre and vocals is strongest selling point of HD650. If you enjoy lyrics, mid-centric songs at some point you need to get OTL amp which can be found for cheap as well. You will have an end game mid performance.

Even without OTL amp HD650 bests many flagship tier headphones in that category.

This headphone is made for music like this

 

[silent-circuit]

I heard HD600 and owned HD650. HD600 is brighter sound with less bass. it can be a bit too much for treble sensitive people. Technically they play in similar tier.

Timbre and vocals is strongest selling point of HD650. If you enjoy lyrics, mid-centric songs at some point you need to get OTL amp which can be found for cheap as well. You will have an end game mid performance.

Even without OTL amp HD650 bests many flagship tier headphones in that category.

This headphone is made for music like this

The HD6XX (Drop variant based on the HD650) and HD600 (direct from Sennheiser) are not the same headphone. That is to say, while the HD6XX doesn't sound exactly like the original HD650, it sounds more like the 650 than the 600. Drop's naming conventions for their collaboration models are a bit confusing and annoying, as many of us used "XX" to refer to a range before they came along.

 

[thekrautdog]

Yessir I think that's maybe what happened here, I was referring to the drop HP, but all info is good. Drop sure did cause confusion with the XX dealio. Thx guys

 

[hakunamakaka]

I havent heard 6xx, but i think it should be close in their signature to the rest of 6’s series. 600/650 sounds more similar than different. Both very good options on budget which punches above it’s price.

 

[ADUHF]

Hey everyone, just looking for some expert advice. The 2 best headphones I own currently are the Beyer Amiron Home and Hifiman HE4XX. The thing is idk if I'm especially treble/high-mid sensitive but I can't seem to get away from an oppressive weariness from the upper part of the sound range. Well I guess that says that maybe I am lol. (I have tried a little equalizing to some small improvement but not enough and I prefer not to have to.) I think what's going to make it difficult is that I crave good detail (I mean, respective of my price range obviously) - I am a lyric junkie and want the vocals to be powerful and forward so that I can get emotionally into the songs that really move me. I hope this is not just a natural contradiction that can't be overcome. From what I have learned about headphones naturally I get to thinking about the Senn 6xx, and BTW they are right in my target price range also. I suppose I could consider going a bit higher in price since I'll be able to sell the other 2 for some $ if I find something that hits the mark. I'd still rather not get much pricier though lol. I know Senns can be polarizing ("veil" etc) but I'm wondering if they could fit my needs after some brain adjustment. Open to any other recommendations. I suppose it's clear that I'm looking for open circumaural and hopefully comfy.

(For a source I'm currently just using my LG V60 (so not using the planar at all) as I've had a problem with desktop dac/amps crapping out on me lately. I'll remedy that situation eventually but think the hp should come first.)

Thanks for any input!

I guess it sort of depends what you mean by "upper mids", but both the Amiron Home and HE4XX appear to be recessed in 1.5 to 2 kHz range. The Beyer moreso than the HFM...

https://www.dropbox.com/s/fjmrgdg3dvi0cqf/Beyerdynamic Amiron Home.pdf?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/rp71fprbe1lmz7u/Hifiman HE4XX.pdf?dl=0

2 to 2.5 kHz is the area that tends to give me most trouble, because that's where alot of speakers cross over and lose some steam. And mixes often seem to overcompensate for this. Maybe you're bothered by frequencies that are a bit higher though, around say 3 to 4 kHz, where there's more gain from the ear canal/concha?

The 6 series Sennheisers will probably give you more upper mids than either of the above. And probably less extension/warmth in the bass. You might still enjoy them though for certain kinds of music...

https://www.dropbox.com/s/qs4hs92tvfbwr04/Sennheiser HD650.pdf?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/pn3heg2rkwzeh34/Sennheiser HD600.pdf?dl=0

Based on the FR graphs, the tonal balance of the HE4XX would probably be closest to the Senns, because the Amiron Home is much more V-shaped in the upper mids.

I have no idea which of the above would be best for detail.