mordy said:

Hi R89,

Take a look at my avatar...
UT did try it as well.

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Oh I was assuming that was from the Elise.

You are right - but UT claims that the updated Elise and the Euforia sound similar......

Does the Euforia have hum with the 6 pack mordy?

Wanna see something that looks really cool?? Psvane with TS5998. Also sounds really, really wonderful. I mean bring tears to the eyes wonderful!!!! Is there any approved tube that can make Euforia sound less than amazing????

richard89 said:

Does the Euforia have hum with the 6 pack mordy?

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Hi R89,

I had the misfortune of ordering three EL3N adapters (had three before from Mrs Xuling)) from a different company than Mrs Xuling and they shorted out the three EL3N tubes and fried a different amp than the Elise. Luckily, the protective circuitry in the Elise kicked in, and the amp shut down for 10 min or so. At the time I did not understand what happened, and tried a different amp with disastrous results.

The 6xEL3N worked for a while and sounded good before the adapters shorted out, but at this point in time I am content using only 4 tubes and don't feel the need for more. Re the controversy in using non recommended tubes I do feel that the EL3N is safe as a driver, having logged hundreds of hours as driver tubes in my Elise.

Very quick report. My back up pair of Sylvania 6SN7-WGTs arrived today. Cost was $39.99. They sound great with almost no burn-in time. That was a real find, but offset by the $300 I paid for my pair of Sylvania 6SN7-Ws (((( Pair of Fotons ($8 plus $8 shipping) on the way from Romania, and that's it as far as tubes go. I don't care what UT tries to tempt us with

pctazhp said:

Very quick report. My back up pair of Sylvania 6SN7-WGTs arrived today. Cost was $39.99. They sound great with almost no burn-in time. That was a real find, but offset by the $300 I paid for my pair of Sylvania 6SN7-Ws (((( Pair of Fotons ($8 plus $8 shipping) on the way from Romania, and that's it as far as tubes go. I don't care what UT tries to tempt us with

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There is a Ukranian seller that sells the Fotons for $2.97, $3.97 and $4.97 each with free shipping, These tubes have different prices depending on the decade they were made, 70-80's, 60's and 50's.
As a general rule, earlier tubes may be of better quality, but I do not know for sure in this case.
Figure 4-5 weeks for them to arrive in the US.

http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_fro...TR0.TRC0.H0.X1x6N8S.TRS0&_nkw=1x6N8S&_sacat=0

Just saw now that he has a fourth Foton 50s version for $9,70 (same page as above) that he claims is as good as the Melz tubes. And yes, he has the Melz metal base tubes as well for $27.70 each.

(In the beginning Feliks offered the Melz tubes as an upgrade but discontinued due to quality problems.)

There's no controversy re non recommended. Everyone is free to roll as they see fit. With the usual caveat. If your amp goes belly up, you have yourself to blame.

I was the first to use 6xEL3N in Elise. It was alright for a year. Then I get slight noise like the tubes not contacting well. Reseating the tubes make it better than it came back again.

Now I go commando. I dont wear adapters anymore. Did I miss those tubes with adapters? No. I am more comfortable now naked. Just ask Tarzan.... and Jane.

pctazhp said:

Very quick report. My back up pair of Sylvania 6SN7-WGTs arrived today. Cost was $39.99. They sound great with almost no burn-in time. That was a real find, but offset by the $300 I paid for my pair of Sylvania 6SN7-Ws (((( Pair of Fotons ($8 plus $8 shipping) on the way from Romania, and that's it as far as tubes go. I don't care what UT tries to tempt us with

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I have a feeling that Tung Sol 6sn7gt black glass round plates with GEC 6as7g will restore and prolong longetivity. Dont believe just ask the Monkey .... that little monkey in 'Monk goes west'.

pctazhp said:

Interesting you should mention Agave. I happen to know quite a bit about it, but super top secret. Mum's the word. My lips are sealed. Lose lips sink ships. Those who don't know are talking; those who know are keeping silent. Etc.

First time for TS5998s in my Euforia. Absolutely wonderful. I am coming to believe that Euforia is so good that tubes may not be as critical as they are in Elise.

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Hey pct...I want to know more about this Agave - spill the beans, man!!! ...

Anyway, as I have managed to grab a few spare moments to let y'all know I am indeed still alive, and bore you with yet another massive missive, your statement - that I've emboldened (yes, that's the correct term, don't you know!) - is in fact very timely. It is both true and false, m'Lud!

In general it would appear to be so - as I myself (and others) have previously stated. AND, as I have already covered ad nauseum, upgrading other elements in the system can bring much greater improvements overall.... HOWEVER...the addition of my Naim Uniti Core and Balanced AC Mains unit (with Advanced Filter System - the ASF3000) has finally confirmed to me, and in my particular system, that the out-of-favour EL tubes - in my case, mesh-plate Valvo EL11 drivers (and one Australian EL3NG) and EL12 Spezial powers - surpass any other combo I have ever tried, and which include drivers generally regarded 'better' than any 6SN7 lol!

At this point, I want to emphasise that my position goes against that recommended by F-A, and is only undertaken on the understanding that I (and anyone else) do so purely at one's own risk. But speaking of 'risk'... with regard to the EL3N/EL11/EL12, my own feeling (based upon amateur logic) is that as these tubes have the transformer AND casing run barely warm, I personally cannot see how they could cause any problems related to overheating...but I'm open to any and all explanations as to how this could possibly happen!

OK...so what has convinced me of my conclusions?...Well, apart from various top grade 6SN7s used, including different VT231s/NU Black Glass/Sylvania 7N7 ('Chrome Dome'), my last comparison was using the Mullard ECC31s driving GEC CV2523 powers...(the 31s being, of course, basically the same as the famous ECC32, but with common cathode, and as such generally accepted by afficianados as 'better' than 6SN7s per se).

Anyway, at first I was taken aback at the sound that filled my ears - especially the incredible bass and mids, and was even more impressed than before the Naim and BM unit were in place. So I waited a couple of days for the amp (and my ears!) to readjust...and then I had the shock of my life - there were so many aspects of the presentation that simply came nowhere near my 11/12 Spez combo (I shall call #2, the 31/GECs #1)....viz :

1. Although #1's bass was more forceful, #2's had better detail, control and balance. The lower frequencies dominated much more in #1...far too much for my own particular taste.
2. Instrument/voice separation was much better in #2, giving greater clarity, positioning and overall coherence.
3. Soundstage was much more expansive in #2, with wonderful spatial quality, air and 3-dimensionality. No other tube combo has given me this degree of feeling "out there in Space", with no hint of compression whatsoever...or such a sense of natural, effortless flow of sound. "Immersion" is total, but not in any artificial way...it just feels right...
4. The entire #2 FR was presented in perfect balance - no single section dominating whatsoever. Bass was tight, and still with sufficient force/'slam'; mids gave vocals all the depth and timbre needed for different tonal ranges, along with relevant instruments of course!; and treble extended as far as you'd be able to hear, but again with great control and finesse (and the most delicious shimmer and decay I've ever heard).
5. Immaculate Pace, Rhythm and Timing (#2) kept the delivery precise and the flow unwavering...with wonderful transient handling - highlighted especially by the tremendous guitar playing (and masterly recording) of Maury Muehleisen and Jim Croce in the various numbers they performed together...truly mesmerising!

I could say more, but I think I've already caused enough indigestion to last a lifetime lol! ...

I must repeat, however, that the Naim and ASF3000 have helped immensely in highlighting these qualities, and that my own particular tubes are adapted by myself...with the caveat that the EL11/12 family (apart from the straight-sided EL12N) can be somewhat unreliable, being very old tubes in the main. They are also, of course, not officially endorsed by F-A.

Anyway, this will probably be my last BIG post, so I shall finish for now with a few relevant photos :

Mesh-plate Australian Philips EL3NG + mesh-plate Valvo EL11 drivers; Telefunken EL12 Spezial powers (#2 combo)



Especially for "Blue" lover - @connieflyer (and you, @pctazhp?!)....the glow from my Airlink Transformers ASF3000 Balanced AC Mains unit (with Avery Magnetics Advanced Filter System) :


And lastly the usurped ECC31/GEC CV2523 setup :



Time for nightcap and early zzzzzzzzzzz

BFN guys....CHEERS!....and HAPPY LISTENING, whatever your favourite setup!...CJ

Welcome back @hypnos1 and great pictures. Nice picture is what we need. I'm glad you're promoting ECC31 again. Perhaps I could sell my nearly new pair of ECC31 now. Anyone who wants it please PM me for a great discount.... together with the adapters. Better it go to someone who will use them than me hoarding it and not using it.

I concur with HAPPY LISTENING and whatever your favourite setup.

My position though is I've never been happier without adapters and complying with manufacturer's recommendations... not to mention the great euphonic tones of 6sn7 and 6as7. Very few amps use this exact combination now. I mean specifically tuned for it. I can only think of SinglePower of long ago and that has many fans till it goes sour with the designer....

Blue we want more blue. That is really interesting I want one correction I want two need a spare just in case. Great post glad to see you back in quantity and quality take care H

Great presentation H1. I love your pictures. The one's I take make me want to barf!!!

I guess we have each charted our own separate course, but that keeps it interesting. I could never work with tubes the way you do and at this stage in my life there is no realistic expectation that I'm going to use any source other than Tidal HD (or some similar streaming service). But thanks to Euforia, CF kindly supplying me with an ASUS board to by-pass USB, and a good collection of high quality recommended tubes I am happy with where I am. I believe a Gumby will be a further improvement, but I suspect that my Bimby is already very good, and Gumby may not be a dramatic improvement. But we shall see.

I couldn't tell if this was your last big post for the day, the week or indefinitely. I certainly hope it wasn't some kind of swan song. WE NEED YOU SANE AND STEADY VOICE HERE!!!!

hypnos1 said:

I could say more, but I think I've already caused enough indigestion to last a lifetime lol! ...

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Verrry happy to see you, CJ!

Yup if left to my voice alone you would all be crazy soon.