[mbphotox]

I can tell the difference in dac signature between my Ares 2 and the wiim pro dac. R-2R Dac‘s have a different sound quality than a chip based dac imho. With chip based is harder to tell difference but there is some variation depending on chip used and also the rest of the components used to build each dac.

Recently they released new firmware for the Denafrips line of Dac that changed the sound so manufactures can add filter or even use firmware to effect the sound signature, there more than just the chip that affects the sound of a dac.

that would be very nasty business, tho!

if they don't just convert the digital signal into analog, they aren't really DACs anymore, are they?
they would be "sound processors" or "equalisers".

That's definitely something that someone into "hifi" (high fidelity to source material) would NOT want a device to do!

 

[Lvivske]

that would be very nasty business, tho!

if they don't just convert the digital signal into analog, they aren't really DACs anymore, are they?
they would be "sound processors" or "equalisers".

That's definitely something that someone into "hifi" (high fidelity to source material) would NOT want a device to do!

Analog reproduction, turning 1's and 0's into something previously organic, is not an exact art. The same reason your computer speakers and high end speakers don't reproduce analog sounds with the same quality.

 

[mbphotox]

Analog reproduction, turning 1's and 0's into something previously organic, is not an exact art. The same reason your computer speakers and high end speakers don't reproduce analog sounds with the same quality.

not what I meant!

My doubt is in the "quality" of the human perception.

Haven't seen any scientific proof whatsoever that would support the claim that people can tell different DACs apart.

16 bits of dynamic range is already WELL above the threshold of human hearing.
16 bits of resolution, too...

Compression artefacts.. that's a different story..But that happens at a different stage of production.

 

[Ferdinando1968]

16 bits of dynamic range is already WELL above the threshold of human hearing.
16 bits of resolution, too...

Yet I hear the difference between 16bit and 24bit tracks.
Is it the better quality recording that makes the difference?

 

[Dan DRC]

Yet I hear the difference between 16bit and 24bit tracks.
Is it the better quality recording that makes the difference?

For some I would bet the 24bit happens to have a better mastering which is what you are probably picking up on the most. This is defiantly not always true though. I have heard16/44 files that I believe are better than their 24/192 versions. As they say your mileage may vary and what is important is what you think sounds the best in your system, is the one you would want to go with. Live life and enjoy the music.

 

[Lvivske]

not what I meant!

My doubt is in the "quality" of the human perception.

Haven't seen any scientific proof whatsoever that would support the claim that people can tell different DACs apart.

16 bits of dynamic range is already WELL above the threshold of human hearing.
16 bits of resolution, too...

Compression artefacts.. that's a different story..But that happens at a different stage of production.

A single DAC can sound different from itself based on the filter or oversampling mode used, if you can't tell the difference between entirely different DACs that's entirely a you-problem

This is sounding like an ASR inspired troll...

 

[Lvivske]

For some I would bet the 24bit happens to have a better mastering which is what you are probably picking up on the most. This is defiantly not always true though. I have heard16/44 files that I believe are better than their 24/192 versions.

I agree, the likely culprit is different (re)masters, 24 is more common with modern hi-res files (ie, apple digital masters), while 16s can be old (quiet) originals or 2000s brickwalled monstrosities, both of which could sound inferior to a 24-bit file today. On the flip side like your example, there could be a 24/192 remaster that absolutely sucks compared to an early master.

(if it's a scenario of comparing the same track published with different specs. I can't think of an example where one would have access to the same track with the same mastering but with different bit depth options.)

 

[mbphotox]

A single DAC can sound different from itself based on the filter or oversampling mode used, if you can't tell the difference between entirely different DACs that's entirely a you-problem

This is sounding like an ASR inspired troll...

if you say so...
I'm glad there's people who generate revenue for audio companies.

the market would be awfully empty if everyone were just happy with solid quality gear that simply works as intended.

 

[Lvivske]

if you say so...
I'm glad there's people who generate revenue for audio companies.

the market would be awfully empty if everyone were just happy with solid quality gear that simply works as intended.

Gaslighting won't make your music sound better.

 

[mbphotox]

Gaslighting won't make your music sound better.

neither will wasting money on a DAC in 2023

we all agree that the quality of the recording matters a lot more, as does the ADC while recording and mastering.
But there's no scientific proof that ppl can differentiate between 16 bit and 24 bit, nor that two DACs can be told apart.
(not talking about testers with extensive training rapidly switching back and forth and listening for tiny differences in headroom and such.)

 

[marekm]

Spending money is fun, being a scrooge isn't

 

[mbphotox]

I'd rather spend money where I don't feel like I wasted it.

The WiiM streamer offers amazing bang for the buck, to the point where I'm convinced that any other more expensive streamer wouldn't feel like an upgrade to me.



I admit, I have the terrible hearing of a 30yo, so my chances of actually hearing all the audiophile mumbojumbo are diminished as it is.. that's why I seek refuge in the comfort of science.
Because I was never able to hear all those majestic things that people like JVS from Stereophile claim to hear after plugging in 50'000$ worth of cables (not a typo!)

 

[Ufanco]

The sound difference between DAC is one of those issues where people seem to disagree, if you don’t hear a difference great it saves you some money. Where those that do also great it gives you a better sound quality to appreciate music more.

This point has been discussed in other posts and recent polls point to most people hearing a difference. So it’s one of those issue where it’s best just to agree to disagree.

https://www.head-fi.org/threads/can-you-hear-a-difference-between-dacs.963072/

 

[timmo1]

WiiM Pro Plus for $219 now available on US Amazon store (includes remote, much better DAC, glossy black finish, Roon Ready status pending). Original WiiM Pro now $159 (includes remote, matte black finish, Roon Ready now).

 

[marekm]

Meanwhile in EU