[morbo667]

Hi everyone,

Something very weird happened to me. On Saturday I received my Opa627BP opamps on Browndog-adapters, so I put them instantly into my xcd-88. The modification was really easy with the help of some head-fi-threads

. Thanks guys =)!!!
Well I tried some listening (xcd->corda ha2 mk2 -> HD600) and it sounded awesome. The highs were beautyful like I have never heard them before and there was so much detail everywhere (except for bass maybe).
The next day I listened to a lot of my music and pretty much everything sounded great. It was very detailed and involving like I have never experienced before. Especially piano, which I never really liked with my HD600, got the much needed sparkle and became magical.

Then the next day. First I should tell you that during that time my corda ha2 was still burning in. It was quite darker than the ha1 and Jan Meier told me, that it would get brighter after about 150 hours of burn in. Well it got brighter! Suddenly the modded xcd sounded like treble-only. Too much and too harsh treble at normal listening volume, so I had to turn down the volume. The treble was nice then, but bass and mids sounded totally dead and veiled. I could not listen to any of my favourite cds for more than a couple of minutes. It just made me sick.

I thought some more burn in could help, but when nothing changed the next day, I gave up and put the stock-opamps into the player. Well, after doing this I was almost as happy as I had been after putting the 627’s in in the first place. The ha2 is now as bright as my ha1 (while having a lot more resolution). Theres not quite as much detail as I had on Sunday, but what the hell, I can listen to music again =).

I’m still wondering, if more burn in could help the brightness-problem? Or what a nice tube-amp might sound with the modded xcd? Maybe I’ll find out at a meet.

What I’m a bit concerned about is the SA5K, which should be coming any day now.
If its as bright with stock-opamps as the HD600 with the 627’s, it may be up for sale again very soon

.

 

[drarthurwells]

Quote:

Originally Posted by morbo667 Hi everyone, Something very weird happened to me. On Saturday I received my Opa627BP opamps on Browndog-adapters, so I put them instantly into my xcd-88. The modification was really easy with the help of some head-fi-threads . Thanks guys =)!!! Well I tried some listening (xcd->corda ha2 mk2 -> HD600) and it sounded awesome. The highs were beautyful like I have never heard them before and there was so much detail everywhere (except for bass maybe). The next day I listened to a lot of my music and pretty much everything sounded great. It was very detailed and involving like I have never experienced before. Especially piano, which I never really liked with my HD600, got the much needed sparkle and became magical. Then the next day. First I should tell you that during that time my corda ha2 was still burning in. It was quite darker than the ha1 and Jan Meier told me, that it would get brighter after about 150 hours of burn in. Well it got brighter! Suddenly the modded xcd sounded like treble-only. Too much and too harsh treble at normal listening volume, so I had to turn down the volume. The treble was nice then, but bass and mids sounded totally dead and veiled. I could not listen to any of my favourite cds for more than a couple of minutes. It just made me sick. I thought some more burn in could help, but when nothing changed the next day, I gave up and put the stock-opamps into the player. Well, after doing this I was almost as happy as I had been after putting the 627’s in in the first place. The ha2 is now as bright as my ha1 (while having a lot more resolution). Theres not quite as much detail as I had on Sunday, but what the hell, I can listen to music again =). I’m still wondering, if more burn in could help the brightness-problem? Or what a nice tube-amp might sound with the modded xcd? Maybe I’ll find out at a meet. What I’m a bit concerned about is the SA5K, which should be coming any day now. If its as bright with stock-opamps as the HD600 with the 627’s, it may be up for sale again very soon .

First impressions, good or bad, can be misleading, and often change with more listening experience. The change in perception, with experience of listening to a new or changed component, is is much more of a factor than burn-in - which changes sound only slightly if at all. People who report dramatic improvements with burn in are only reporting their changed perceptions rather than a changed reality. You need to accrue some listening memory with a new component or change in order to really understand sound differences it causes.

A problem component may sound great with some program material but less than great (or bad) with other program material.

A truly fine component will sound more consistently good, and as good as the program material permits, with any CD or other source, and even with distorted material will sound OK in many sections.

The Sony SA5000 is the best dynamic headphone for less than $2000. However it is neutral and revealing - it will show up problems in your other components. Brightness is not a problem when it is silky with sheen, like the SA 5000 is with the proper components - it is a real problem if brittle and harsh like much equipment is.

The E5 CD player is the best for under $3000 and is likewise neutral and revealing.

Match these two with a great amp, like the Bada PH12 (with the tubes I use) and you get extremely natural and realistic headphone sound that I would match with any system at a total price below $7,500 (even though it only costs 1/5 that).

Don't blame the SA 5000 if they don't sound good with your system. Take the SA 5000 as your core and upgrade the rest.

 

[fewtch]

Quote:

Originally Posted by drarthurwells The Sony SA5000 is the best dynamic headphone for less than $2000.

 

[tennisets]

Quote:

Originally Posted by drarthurwells The Sony SA5000 is the best dynamic headphone for less than $2000. The E5 CD player is the best for under $3000 and is likewise neutral and revealing. Match these two with a great amp, like the Bada PH12 (with the tubes I use) and you get extremely natural and realistic headphone sound that I would match with any system at a total price below $7,500 (even though it only costs 1/5 that).

You state these things like they might actually even be fact

.

Seriously, there is so much wrong with these few sentences I don't know where to begin. First of all, although you are entitled to your opinion that the SA5000 is the best dynamic headphone under $2000, you are problem the only person that has ever heard it and some of the real heavy hitters in that price range to think so.

What other headphones have you heard?

Second, yes, the Eastsound is reportedly a very good CD Player, which some people believe to be the best player under $3000. However, many people do not believe it is the best under $3000. At least this claim is significantly less ridiculous than your first one.

Third, there are just as many people who don't like the Bada as people who do like it. Moreover, even accepting your first two claims as true, you would have thousands of dollars to spend on an amp and still stay below the $7500 dollar mark. And would be willing to bet that just about all of the amps in that price range would absolutely slaughter the Bada. You can put together a way better system for $7500 than the one that you have listed. If you had actually heard a system like that I think you would agree.

But what really gets me is that every single recommendation you make ever is of the very equipment you own. I bet someone could say "I love the way my Sennheiser HD-650s sound" and you would come running to tell them that, no, they really aren't hearing music the way it's meant to be, and that the only thing for it is to get a pair of SA5000s, and E5, and a PH12.

Just get it through your head that not everyone likes the same kind of sound you do.

The original poster obviously likes the way his HD-600s sound. Then you go off telling him to ditch his Senns for the SA5000s? Where the heck are you coming from here, and why was the last 3/4 of your post even necessary, let alone the fact that the first part is something pretty controversial around these parts and shouldn't be stated as a fact?

With the amount of praise you give your own setup, I want to know: What other equipment have you heard?

Because I can tell you right now, I don't like the SA5000s no matter what associated components they're being run with. That doesn't mean you can't like them; you can even think they're "all that" if you really want to. But how did you come to this conclusion? I'm all ears.

Edit: I just saw that the OP did mention the SA5000 in his post, and that he's getting a pair. But my comments still stand.

 

[tkam]

Quote:

Originally Posted by drarthurwells The Sony SA5000 is the best dynamic headphone for less than $2000. However it is neutral and revealing - it will show up problems in your other components. Brightness is not a problem when it is silky with sheen, like the SA 5000 is with the proper components - it is a real problem if brittle and harsh like much equipment is. The E5 CD player is the best for under $3000 and is likewise neutral and revealing. Match these two with a great amp, like the Bada PH12 (with the tubes I use) and you get extremely natural and realistic headphone sound that I would match with any system at a total price below $7,500 (even though it only costs 1/5 that). Don't blame the SA 5000 if they don't sound good with your system. Take the SA 5000 as your core and upgrade the rest.

Haven't you learned not to make idiotic blanket statements yet?? Not everyone is going to like the same amp/cdp let alone headphones as you. Have you even heard the L3000 and PS-1's or some of the other high-end under $2k dynamic phones. While I don't doubt that the E5 is a very fine CDP (I'll get to hear one this weekend actually) your use of blanket statements is a poor idea and honestly you really come off like an ass in your posts. Your posts make it seem like everyone is wrong and doesn't know what they are talking about if they don't agree with you.

If he doesn't like the SA5K he doesn't like them get over it and move on. Your constant "my stuff is better than yours" attitude is getting very old, this is a subjective hobby we all don't agree get over it.

 

[drarthurwells]

What dynamic headphone for under $2000 is better than the SA5000?

Who doesn't like the Bada PH12 - that have heard it? No one. I have been trying to get people to come to Gainesville or Apopka, Florida to audition it with the right tubes and the proper associated equipment - no one is near me I suppose because none have emailed me.

The HD650 has a muddled and congested midrange in complex passages compared to the SA 5000, and has unnatural coloration relative the the SA5000 - both were used with the following headphone amps I have recently owned: Lehmann Black Cube linear, Ming Da (Meixing) MC 66AE, David Hafler 110 preamp and headphone amp, and the Bada PH12.

What CDP for $3000 or less beats the E5?

 

[Jasonharkin]

This post stinks of arrogance

Quote:

Originally Posted by drarthurwells What dynamic headphone for under $2000 is better than the SA5000? Who doesn't like the Bada PH12 - that have heard it? No one. I have been trying to get people to come to Gainesville or Apopka, Florida to audition it with the right tubes and the proper associated equipment - no one is near me I suppose because none have emailed me. The HD650 has a muddled and congested midrange in complex passages compared to the SA 5000, and has unnatural coloration relative the the SA5000 - both were used with the following headphone amps I have recently owned: Lehmann Black Cube linear, Ming Da (Meixing) MC 66AE, David Hafler 110 preamp and headphone amp, and the Bada PH12. What CDP for $3000 or less beats the E5?

 

[shplorgh]

Quote:

Originally Posted by drarthurwells What dynamic headphone for under $2000 is better than the SA5000? Who doesn't like the Bada PH12 - that have heard it? No one. I have been trying to get people to come to Gainesville or Apopka, Florida to audition it with the right tubes and the proper associated equipment - no one is near me I suppose because none have emailed me. The HD650 has a muddled and congested midrange in complex passages compared to the SA 5000, and has unnatural coloration relative the the SA5000 - both were used with the following headphone amps I have recently owned: Lehmann Black Cube linear, Ming Da (Meixing) MC 66AE, David Hafler 110 preamp and headphone amp, and the Bada PH12. What CDP for $3000 or less beats the E5?

NO. Everybody has different tastes in audio, there is no "best headphone under 2000". But, have you ever heard the rs-1, ps-1, L3000, AT Woodies, Staxes, HE60, etc? A blanket statement like this just shows your own arrogance and ingorance.

Now can we please get this thread back on track for the OP?

 

[tennisets]

You know, somehow I don't think that anything we say will change drarthurwells' ways. It's probably not even worth arguing with him anymore, except it worries me that he might mislead someone new and innocent in this hobby. I don't think it's even worth it to reply anymore, but this is just so wrong I can't help it.

drarthurwells: What about the PS-1, L3000, W1000, W2002, or RS-1? And by the way, in MY opinion the SA5000 is the one that is unnatural sounding. You HAVE to understand that everyone hears things differently and not everyone will like what you like? WHY IS THIS SO HARD TO UNDERSTAND?

Moreover, you've never heard a headphone amp costing more than about $600, and you say that what you have competes with products costing thousands? How can you POSSIBLY say this when you haven't even heard the products that you so assuredly state the Bada PH12 beats?

The E5 is a good CD player, but there are others that sound very, very good under $3000. Under $1000 I'd say yes, the E5 is probably one of the best out there, although according to sacd lover the Ack! dAck! 2.0 competes in the same league as well.

PLEASE DO NOT MAKE BLANKET STATEMENTS THAT ARE UNFOUNDED AND UNSUPPORTED BY COMPARISONS TO OTHER EQUIPMENT.

 

[tkam]

Quote:

Originally Posted by drarthurwells What dynamic headphone for under $2000 is better than the SA5000?

RS-1, PS-1, L3000, HP-2, K1000 do you need anymore? And yes I've heard them all and I did own the SA5000 at one point and would take any of them over the SA5K

Quote:

Originally Posted by drarthurwells both were used with the following headphone amps I have recently owned: Lehmann Black Cube linear, Ming Da (Meixing) MC 66AE, David Hafler 110 preamp and headphone amp, and the Bada PH12. What CDP for $3000 or less beats the E5?

You do realize that is quite a limited number of amps right? Did I say anything about the PH12? NO, as I haven't heard it and won't comment on anything unless I have. But that is exactly what you are doing by saying its the best amp ever under whatever price when you have not heard that many amps. As I said I have not heard the E5 and again like I said I've heard its very good for the money. I have heard that the sacdmods denon 2900 and sony 555es are equal to the E5 and both of those cost substantially less than $3K. I'll also go out on a limb and say that they my APL Hifi modded Philips SACD1000 ($1700) is better than the E5 and I'll get to do that very comparison this weekend.

What other CDP's have you heard under $3K??

 

[drarthurwells]

Quote:

Originally Posted by tkam Have you even heard the L3000 and PS-1's or some of the other high-end under $2k dynamic phones.

Yes. Some coloration to both. Same with all Stax systems - though coloration is slight with Stax there is still a subtle electronic veil over the music. Some people like coloration - it can be pleasing.

To me natural and realistic, with no coloration, is most pleasing. Been hard to obtain for me, at a low cost, over the last 50 years - I built my first hi-end Hi-Fi system at the age of 13 - AR speakers, Garaud 301 turntable and Shure cartrigdge, Dynakit 60 watt monoblock tube amps and a Dynakit pre-amp - fine early system.

Don't see how I can improve my present system except slightly, and only by spending many thousands more. What would you advise?

 

[shplorgh]

Quote:

Originally Posted by drarthurwells To me natural and realistic, with no coloration, is most pleasing. Been hard to obtain for me, at a low cost, over the last 50 years - I built my first hi-end Hi-Fi system at the age of 13 - AR speakers, Garaud 301 turntable and Shure cartrigdge, Dynakit 60 watt monoblock tube amps and a Dynakit pre-amp - fine early system.

That is an opinion!

You can't honestly say that it's better for everyone, because everyone has different ears and tastes.

I apologize to the OP for all this nonsense.

 

[drarthurwells]

This post stinks of arrogance


Quote:
Originally Posted by drarthurwells:
What dynamic headphone for under $2000 is better than the SA5000?

Who doesn't like the Bada PH12 - that have heard it? No one. I have been trying to get people to come to Gainesville or Apopka, Florida to audition it with the right tubes and the proper associated equipment - no one is near me I suppose because none have emailed me.

The HD650 has a muddled and congested midrange in complex passages compared to the SA 5000, and has unnatural coloration relative the the SA5000 - both were used with the following headphone amps I have recently owned: Lehmann Black Cube linear, Ming Da (Meixing) MC 66AE, David Hafler 110 preamp and headphone amp, and the Bada PH12.

What CDP for $3000 or less beats the E5?


Quote:

Originally Posted by Jasonharkin This post stinks of arrogance

Art: Can you be more specific? There is nothing arrogant about saying the HD650 has more midrange congestion and lack of clarity, in reproducing complex vocal and instrumental passages, than the Sony SA5000.

Take both and listen to a vocal with complex instrumental back-up and you can easily tell which one reproduces understandable words in the vocal and which does not.

Some people can not tolerate it when others extol the virutes of components they do not own. Instead, name me a system of source, headphone and headphone amp that each of you like best.

 

[tkam]

Quote:

Originally Posted by drarthurwells Yes. Some coloration to both. Same with all Stax systems - though coloration is slight with Stax there is still a subtle electronic veil over the music. Some people like coloration - it can be pleasing. To me natural and realistic, with no coloration, is most pleasing. Been hard to obtain for me, at a low cost, over the last 50 years - I built my first hi-end Hi-Fi system at the age of 13 - AR speakers, Garaud 301 turntable and Shure cartrigdge, Dynakit 60 watt monoblock tube amps and a Dynakit pre-amp - fine early system. Don't see how I can improve my present system except slightly, and only by spending many thousands more. What would you advise?

You seem to be completely missing the point here. You really like your system and that's great but that doesn't me any let alone all of us will agree with you. You think the SA5K are the most neutral headphones around thats fine that's your opinion. You get very agressive when anyone posts anything negative about them and that is the problem. IMO the SA5K are treble heavy, bright and sterile sounding headphones.

 

[NeilPeart]

Headphones under $2000 that I prefer to the SA5000:

K1000
MS-Pro
W11JPN
W2002
L3000
DT880
HP-1000
RS-1
PS-1 Pro
HD600
HD650
HE60
SR-404
SR-007

There are many ‘phones that others prefer to the SA5000, but at the same time I can appreciate why one would prefer the SA5000 to them as well (it exhibits a very airy, detailed sound that few headphones match, and it demonstrates nice impact). However I found the SA5000 somewhat artificial sounding with a variety of amplifiers, and I sold it within a couple months – perhaps system synergy played a large role in that decision. General fact-like statements involving price/performance and personal taste are too misleading and really don’t allow the underlying theme of personal choice to enter into the equation – that perspective can alienate others. I really don’t care about your personal audio opinions/taste as I have gleaned that your preferences differ from mine – neither of us are incorrect; we simply hear things differently. Just for the record: the HD650 trounces any other headphone under $5000!