Thoughts on a bunch of DACs (and why delta-sigma kinda sucks, just to get you to think about stuff)
May 10, 2015 at 2:20 PM Post #5,161 of 6,500
I'm not going to saturate this thread anymore with my opinions on R2R and the Theta DAC. But to me it is a testimony to build quality that this DAC from 1994 still works perfectly fine and yet in this day and age there are people who are having issues with their brand new **insert alternate name** Nerd Pulse extraspecial and have had to return the brand new space age product. Why does this thing from 94 work perfectly fine? It is built like a tank.. served with you get it as it is, don't need triple femto clocks here people to get "analog" sound
 
May 10, 2015 at 2:37 PM Post #5,165 of 6,500
  I'm pretty sure there's some back handed marketing arrangements going on.


I doubt it, at least not as how I think you mean it. Yes, purrin has made no bones about his appreciation for Schiit gear, well some of it, and he also enjoys the people behind the company. We all "market" the gear we believe in anytime we post our positive views. Why should purrin not be allowed to do the same thing? It isn't his fault that he has established his reputation as a knowledgeable and honest head-fier so your accusations are pretty baseless as far as I can tell.
 
May 10, 2015 at 2:38 PM Post #5,166 of 6,500
Thread title changed. Just so feelings aren't hurt.


This is absolutely absurd. It's your opinion, and certainly entitled to share it. It's beyond ridiculous the amount of effort and time you have put into this thread, and more wasted time "defending" your position.

I respect everyone's opinion and really do appreciate the efforts of those do do similar things. The amount of time one can spend going back and forth abing things is truly unbelievable.

I suggest to others that are complaining, especially about the title of the thread, do your own abing and summarize it. Also wondering if any of the critics of Purrin appreciate the time and effort of his work?

I've spent a few hours abing daps and it is not an enjoyable process, and certainly one that I wish never to do again. It's boring, tedious, time consuming, and frustrating at times. Perhaps a little gratitude towards others that take the time to help us is in order? Or, if you have nothing to add or nothing to do but complain, do your own testing.

I don't know if I'd agree with Purrin, but damn sure do respect then man and appreciate his effort, which is more than I can say for those complaining about a thread title... How petty can you get?
 
May 10, 2015 at 2:53 PM Post #5,169 of 6,500
Regarding filters, I've heard DACs with standard filters, either just a default/single option or with multiple options to choose from, and DACs with off-the-shelf or, better yet, custom filters. I'd like to say I prefer minimum phase over linear phase, but for most D/S designs, I generally found I just prefer less oversampling than more oversampling (i.e. 2x vs 8x, 2x being preferable to my ears). Slow roll-off vs sharp or fast roll-off. Etc. Then again, I most prefer a non-oversampled design, which I know for some is a quick way to disconnect them from the music. Just rolling with what resonates best with me.
 
On the other hand, I've heard 8x oversampling filters that were really quite pleasant. The Theta Gen Va has such a filter. No hint of glare, digital hash, or any other similar unpleasant characteristic. I've heard some standard 8x filters that weren't so bad either, usually from Wolfson-based designs.
 
Sure, most standard digital filters are probably nothing to write home about. I think some are better than others. For example, I like what Wolfson does, and I like DACs that utilize the variety of digital filter options available from Wolfson. Gamma2 and some of the Audio-GD DACs are good examples of this, with A-GD being awesome for having options ranging from 2x through 8x oversampling with various roll-off types. The PWD Mk1 I tried was a very poor example. All of the filters were 8x, and PS Audio ordered the filters differently on the DAC than what they specified in the manual, so I've never really trusted them to be competent after that despite some liking the PWD Mk2 (Mk1 -> 2 upgrade, that is). But, even then, 8x oversampling or not, I didn't care for the PWD Mk1's sound all that much. It robbed the Wolfson chip of what it did best compared to other D/S chips in terms of tone, liquidity, and so on.
 
Anyway, while I generally prefer less oversampling (or none) over more oversampling, clearly there are exceptions to this rule or certain options and implementation I don't mind using standard, off-the-shelf, or entirely custom digital filter designs. I don't think it's right to simplify it down to linear phase vs. minimum phase, more ringing vs. less ringing, pre-ringing vs. post-ringing, 0x through 8x oversampling, and so on. Way too many other variables to consider in the DAC.
 
But all this talk of digital filters, linearity and accuracy, resolution and detail extraction...none of this touches on where I think R2R/multi-bit really shines. I just have not heard a single D/S DAC that gives the three-dimensional, full-bodied sound, real sound that you get from R2R/multi-bit. And by full bodied, I don't mean warm or bassy, though R2R/multi-bit does usually seem to have better bass slam, texture, and pitch differentiation assuming good chips and a good implementation. I mean that each instrument, voice, and fart sounds like something that has some sort of real presence and body to it vs. some sort of flatter, 2D representation of said element. D/S generally just sounds like a cheap imitation, good detail or not, and I find it difficult to go back to D/S DACs now.
 
May 10, 2015 at 3:13 PM Post #5,171 of 6,500
  Thread title changed. Just so feelings aren't hurt.

 
It's your thread, Purrin -- call it whatever you want.  If someone else wants to start a thread supporting delta-sigma DACs they're free to do so.
 
Any arguments regarding the thread's title are a waste of time, energy and bandwidth.
 
May 10, 2015 at 3:13 PM Post #5,172 of 6,500
Baldr said:
3.  Because of this slow development, Schiit would offer this tech as available to existing users of our upgradable products without screwing them.  (Gungnir and Bifrost)


Just to clarify,
Will ther be an update to the lesser Schiit DACS that brings Yggy tech to them?

Thanks!
 
May 10, 2015 at 3:14 PM Post #5,173 of 6,500
[quote name="Baldr"
3.  Because of this slow development, Schiit would offer this tech as available to existing users of our upgradable products without screwing them.  (Gungnir and Bifrost)

Just to clarify,
Will ther be an update to the lesser Schiit DACS that brings Yggy tech to them?

Thanks![/quote]

My $1 bet is on USB Gen 3 upgrade board.
 
May 10, 2015 at 3:16 PM Post #5,174 of 6,500
Instead of crying that he change the title, why don't people unsubscribe and make their own thread where they can make the title whatever they want to counteract this one.

This is an Internet forum, people have opinions. If you can't seem to get that simple concept down, you need to get off the Internet for your own good.
 

Users who are viewing this thread

Back
Top