[DaveBSC]

Quote:

Neither the ExactPower nor PS PPP are *battery* regenerators.  The Liebert regenerates new AC sine wave from battery 100% of the time.  The Exactpower is not even a regenerator.  It does not regenerate new AC sine wave from ground up.  It just "analyzes" and corrects the AC waveform from the wall by adding some voltage here and there, etc.  
 

PS makes the argument that using a battery is significantly worse as far as sonics are concerned than their method, which is essentially a power amplifier running at 60Hz. They claim that the battery method often produces worse AC line distortion than the wall.
 
In any case, I prefer the AR system to everything else I've heard, including the Hydras which are very similar to the Audience conditioners but I don't think sound as good. Unlike the massive transformers required for 1500+ watts, Auricaps are extremely lightweight and practical, there are no batteries to worry about replacing, and they handle both sensitive source components and the most power hungry amplifiers with ease. The latest versions with Teflon caps, OCC leads and the copper ground plane system are hyper expensive, but if I had a $50K+ system, that's what I'd be using.
 

 

[Jon L]

 
Quote:

PS makes the argument that using a battery is significantly worse as far as sonics are concerned than their method, which is essentially a power amplifier running at 60Hz. They claim that the battery method often produces worse AC line distortion than the wall.
 
In any case, I prefer the AR system to everything else I've heard, including the Hydras which are very similar to the Audience conditioners but I don't think sound as good. Unlike the massive transformers required for 1500+ watts, Auricaps are extremely lightweight and practical, there are no batteries to worry about replacing, and they handle both sensitive source components and the most power hungry amplifiers with ease. The latest versions with Teflon caps, OCC leads and the copper ground plane system are hyper expensive, but if I had a $50K+ system, that's what I'd be using.
 

Well, what else would PS Audio say?  Everything depends on implementation of specific products, including battery.  What I don't really like about PS PPP is the large inefficiency involved in taking an amplifier, reversing it to produce much less power than it consumes from the wall.  The heat, size, complexity, price all apply.  
 
I actually really like the Audience conditioners.  It's true their signature reminds me of Hydras but with less degree of veiling. They're quite musical and dynamic as well. My only problem with them are the price, with the lastest aR6TS costing $5000-6500 (with cord).  
 
The Liebert is $299 from that linked refurb store, and after putting in a quiet fan and better outlets, let's just say the audiophile in me does NOT yearn for the Audience...At All.
 

 

[Zorlac]

I'm very interested in a double-conversion online UPS now! I usually buy stuff new...is it pretty safe buying these refurbished units?

 

[Jon L]

Quote:

I'm very interested in a double-conversion online UPS now! I usually buy stuff new...is it pretty safe buying these refurbished units?

The store I linked is where I got mine, which is going very strong still.  These things are very heavy all-steel construction with huge battery inside, but they ship them in these extra-thick, extra-HUGE boxes which appear bullet-proof.  They actually have live persons answering phone calls, and if yours has issues, they will ship you a new one with blink of an eye.

 

[robm321]

The Chang Lightspeed 6400 is the cheapest option I found that doesn't mess with the sound and might improve it slightly. I tried the Monster one that Stereophile raved about, but it gave a smoothing effect to the sound which gave less detail overall. Tice makes a good one also. 
 
Those are the 2 that I found that are relatively cheap and leaves the sound alone. In fact, depending on your power situation, you may find an improvement. 

 

[DaveBSC]

 
Quote:

Well, what else would PS Audio say?  Everything depends on implementation of specific products, including battery.  What I don't really like about PS PPP is the large inefficiency involved in taking an amplifier, reversing it to produce much less power than it consumes from the wall.  The heat, size, complexity, price all apply.  
 
I actually really like the Audience conditioners.  It's true their signature reminds me of Hydras but with less degree of veiling. They're quite musical and dynamic as well. My only problem with them are the price, with the lastest aR6TS costing $5000-6500 (with cord).

The earlier P300, P600, P1000 etc. plants were based on linear amplifier design, and they were grossly inefficient. The current Premier uses a "digital" amplifier, and its efficiency is much more reasonable. When I used it I liked that it could pretty much completely eliminate the issue of day/night power quality variances, but the actual sound it produced was only good, not amazing. The other problems at least initially were serious quality control issues. Mine suffered the infamous "click of death" and I had to get a warranty replacement, as did a lot of others. I'm not surprised that PS went back to in house production for the Perfect Wave components.
 
I'm using an Ar2p in my headphone setup, which eliminates much of the cost of the multi-outlet versions. There's no fancy case to pay for, and since it plugs directly into the wall, I don't have to pay for the PowerChord that I would likely end up replacing with something else anyway. I do want to eventually upgrade to the Ar2p-T, which while expensive, is still considerably more affordable than an Ar6-T, Bybee Purifier, or RSA Dimitri which are generally considered the best of the best.

 

[Zorlac]

So what are the options if you run out of plugins on one of these UPS devices? (i.e. Can you plug a power strip into it? What about plugging in another dedicated surge suppressor / line conditioner unit that has several plugins?)
 
Is each plugin isolated?
 

 

[lag0a]

How long do these batteries usually last in these Liebert UPS? I'm not familiar with this type of UPS or any UPS for that matter. Can they clean the power without using the batteries? I don't wish to have to replace the batteries that often for these units.

 

[Zorlac]

I just ordered a new Liebert. Its from their latest double conversion online series. Should be here some time next week.
 
So here is my question. What if some of our equipment is rated for 120V and others state 110V or 115V? It is my understanding that the Liebert can only be set to one voltage rating (i.e. 120V).

 

[TheGhostWhoWalks]

Probably the best thing to do about line conditioning is to run two separate power lines from your fuse box to two separate outlets and plug your player and amp into each. It seems that most expensive conditioners, cleaners, isolation, etc. out there is basically designed to do just that in one form or another. If you can just do it straight from the box I seriously don't see much need to mess around with anything else, and as long as your box isn't too far from your gear it shouldn't be prohibitively expensive. About the only thing left to worry about after is keeping the power supply steady, since power companies often aren't reliable in that area, in which case you might look into something like a Monster voltage stabalizer or PS Audio Power Plant, but I haven't tried either.

 

[lag0a]

Does anyone know about the Delta Conversion type of UPS? It seems to have better power efficiency than Double conversion. It seems to have some added features ontop of what a Double conversion UPS does.
 
A nice article on the different types of UPS.
http://www.ptsdcs.com/whitepapers/1.pdf
 
LoL. Figure 6 – Analogy of Double Conversion vs. Delta Conversion. That analogy made me laugh for some reason.
 
Upon further reading about Delta Conversion online, it seems it is primary used for industries and not consumer I think.

 

[Zorlac]

I got my UPS and set it up last night. Lets just say I am not very happy with it. The unit is just fine and I am sure it does what is advertised, but it sounds like a hair dryer and the fan never stops. So much for those black backgrounds I was looking for...heh
 
I would almost consider selling it now with a bit of a loss. I just dont think a 80mm Noctua fan for example would really lower the noise floor that much.

 

[KingStyles]

I will throw this in, APS pure power. Supposedly better than the ps power plant. Expensive though.

 

[Jon L]

Quote:

Just add quiet fans (I used Nexus) and better outlets (I like Synergistic Teslaplex).  

 

 
Quote:

but it sounds like a hair dryer and the fan never stops. So much for those black backgrounds I was looking for...heh
 
I would almost consider selling it now with a bit of a loss. I just dont think a 80mm Noctua fan for example would really lower the noise floor that much.

 
I just don't understand when experienced people give specific advice, i.e. get a quiet fan, some people just don't seem willing to follow it, yet still order the unit?!
 
The 80 mm fans MUST be changed to quiet ones.  There is only one fan inside the 1000 VA unit, and I recommend Nexus 80 mm, which I have used many times in many places with fantastic results.  The fan noise HUGELY drops, since the stock fan is one of the Noisiest fans I have ever seen, purely made for flow rate.  
http://www.endpcnoise.com/cgi-bin/e/std/sku=nexus80mm
 
The Nexus 80 mm fan provides plenty of cooling; in fact the steel case gets cool to cold on top with Nexus.  If you want even quieter than Nexus (sitting right next to it, etc), than add a cheap Zalman fan controller to turn it down even more.  
http://www.avadirect.com/product_details_parts.asp?PRID=13259
When installing Zalman, one may need to find some 2-pin to 3-pin adapter or just cut off the connector and solder directly.  
 
While you have the Liebert open, I suggest changing out to some better outlets.  You can read all the audio forums to find your candidates.  I prefer Teslaplex, but recently there has been a lot of buzz about "Maestro" outlets.  Do not get Oyaide, even the vaunted R1's.  (yes, I have several sitting around)

 

[Zorlac]

I read your recommendations and I will probably switch the fan to a Nexus or Noctua if I dont return the unit first. I guess what I didnt realize was that the fan never turns off and doesnt even seem to slow down. I do thank you for all your help though and I will check out those Maestro outlets too.