[sling5s]

I love how open sounding this is but even with the upgraded tubes it sounds lean (to me) at times. I wish it had a little more lower mids.  
Will these sound different at all with more burn in?
If not, I'm thinking of complementing the Zotl2-S with some Elise Feliks which has the more typical tube sound. 

 

[willsw]

  I love how open sounding this is but even with the upgraded tubes it sounds lean (to me) at times. I wish it had a little more lower mids.  
Will these sound different at all with more burn in?
If not, I'm thinking of complementing the Zotl2-S with some Elise Feliks which has the more typical tube sound. 

 
You could try swapping out the 12AT7 tubes for some Mullards or another British brand, or RCAs, according to http://www.audiotubes.com/12at7.htm
 
The MZ2-S (or any ZOTL amp) won't have a typical tube sound, as, in addition to not being coupled to a transformer, it's a unique tube circuit that only Berning-designed amps have. 

 

[sling5s]

   
You could try swapping out the 12AT7 tubes for some Mullards or another British brand, or RCAs, according to http://www.audiotubes.com/12at7.htm
 
The MZ2-S (or any ZOTL amp) won't have a typical tube sound, as, in addition to not being coupled to a transformer, it's a unique tube circuit that only Berning-designed amps have. 

Thanks
I wasn't expecting the tube lush/richness but it sounded really thin and bright/edgy this morning. 
I left it on all day and returned and now it seems better. I guess I'll just have to be patient and let it burn in before rushing too early conclusions. 

 

[hrq12345]

 
Thanks
I wasn't expecting the tube lush/richness but it sounded really thin and bright/edgy this morning. 
I left it on all day and returned and now it seems better. I guess I'll just have to be patient and let it burn in before rushing too early conclusions. 

Try switching the Mullard 12AU7, which is what I am using. The sound is still open and clear but with more lushness.

 

[sling5s]

  Try switching the Mullard 12AU7, which is what I am using. The sound is still open and clear but with more lushness.

Will they work on mine? Did you mean Mullard 12AT7?
I have the upgraded Zotl2-S version which comes with RCA 12SN7 and a pair of 6201 tubes, a military-spec version of the 12AT7.

 

[jamato8]

 
Will they work on mine? Did you mean Mullard 12AT7?
I have the upgraded Zotl2-S version which comes with RCA 12SN7 and a pair of 6201 tubes, a military-spec version of the 12AT7.

You can also try the 7062 which is a very nice tube. It has a long box plate design and they last a very long time. Also, depending on how much time you have on your amp, you may need more on time. I think it needs around 150 to 200 hours to totally settle, which in my experience is common among many amps and electronics as the caps have to form and everything else needs to settle. I also think the amp, once burned in sounds best from around 1 hour on after being turned on. The tubes that you got with the S version are very good and you got some nice NOS 12SN7's, which provide great sound. 

 

[hrq12345]

 
Will they work on mine? Did you mean Mullard 12AT7?
I have the upgraded Zotl2-S version which comes with RCA 12SN7 and a pair of 6201 tubes, a military-spec version of the 12AT7.

12AU7 and 12AT7 are equivalent. I don't know if Mullard has 12AT7 though because I searched a lot and there was only 12AU7.

 

[sling5s]

Selling my Cavalli Carbon and placed an order for the Elise Feliks. I wanted a full, lush and euphonic (yes harmonically distorted) sounding tube amp to complement my more ultra clear and clean (harmonically undistorted) microZOTL2-S.  

 

[doctorjazz]

I haven't heard the Elise, but my impression of the LC is that it does that euphonic tube sound without tubes...

 

[sling5s]

I haven't heard the Elise, but my impression of the LC is that it does that euphonic tube sound without tubes...

There's a subtle hints of it (slight forward lower mids) but it still lacks that lushness and open 3D holographic nature of tubes (at least to my ears).
I wanted a Solid State that sounded like tubes with the convenience of Solid State so I got the Cavalli Carbon, but now the Zotl2-S fits that bill.
It's a tube amp for sure, but it has the convenience of Solid State in that I don't have to worry about leaving it on for longer periods.
I figured I try the Elise and get the tubey sound without trying to tube roll the Zotl2. I don't think the Zotl2 will ever have the tubey harmonically distorted sound no matter what tube I roll. Because it's just not designed that way. 
If anything, I wanted another tube amp for the bedroom and once you get used to the tube sound (had Lyr2 and WA-6 and MAD EAR), solid state doesn't really do it. 

 

[jamato8]

  12AU7 and 12AT7 are equivalent. I don't know if Mullard has 12AT7 though because I searched a lot and there was only 12AU7.

Who told you they are equivalent? They have different operating points and different resistance and their gain is totally different with the 12aT7 around 60 and the 12AU7 about 20. 

 

[RedBull]

Mullard equivalent for 12AT7 is CV4024.

 

[hrq12345]

 
Who told you they are equivalent? They have different operating points and different resistance and their gain is totally different with the 12aT7 around 60 and the 12AU7 about 20. 

Some friend told me that they are mostly equivalent. Maybe he was wrong.

 

[mjm6]

Folks,
 
I'm looking for a new amp for my phones, and I think the micro ZOTL2 may be a good one to consider, but I have a few questions...
 
I've read all the posts (except the somewhat frenetic posts of the Mojo guy, which seemed out of place here and should have been in a different thread).
 
I'm currently running a Fiios X5 into a Lyr2 to a new pair of HiFiMan Edition Xv2 phones. Before that, it was into a pair of HE-400i phones.
 
I just purchased a Metrum Musette to put into the stream as the DAC, and I wanted to upgrade the Lyr2 to something a bit better, and was thinking of the Mjolnir2 because it uses the same tubes, which I can then carry over to them (I have some great NOS Siemens in the lyr2 ATM).
 
Anyway, I have been reading the posts on this new amp and am very impressed with the discussion and overall feedback, along with the reviews I've read, so I thought it may be a good alternate.
 
The New 's' version is a bit of a stretch for me, as I was hoping to keep it around $1000 or so. Not sure what it cost during the Massdrop promo, but it probably would have been able to talk myself into it at a discount. Too bad I missed it...
 
Anyway, I need some thoughts on the new 's' version vs. the older version. Since they are supposedly similarly sounding, is there a compelling reason to choose one over the other?
 
It seems that I can get a 'tweaked' HP amp in the 's' version, with NOS tubes, etc., but at what expense? Does the more limited tube selection present a drawback?
 
While I'm not a huge tube roller, I will happily do some, so I am wondering if I should go for the non-'s' version in favor of doing some tube rolling.
 
Beyond that, are there any other compelling differences I should consider?
 
 
 
Thanks,
 
 
---Michael

 

[zachawry]

  Folks,
 
I'm looking for a new amp for my phones, and I think the micro ZOTL2 may be a good one to consider, but I have a few questions...
 
I've read all the posts (except the somewhat frenetic posts of the Mojo guy, which seemed out of place here and should have been in a different thread).
 
I'm currently running a Fiios X5 into a Lyr2 to a new pair of HiFiMan Edition Xv2 phones. Before that, it was into a pair of HE-400i phones.
 
I just purchased a Metrum Musette to put into the stream as the DAC, and I wanted to upgrade the Lyr2 to something a bit better, and was thinking of the Mjolnir2 because it uses the same tubes, which I can then carry over to them (I have some great NOS Siemens in the lyr2 ATM).
 
Anyway, I have been reading the posts on this new amp and am very impressed with the discussion and overall feedback, along with the reviews I've read, so I thought it may be a good alternate.
 
The New 's' version is a bit of a stretch for me, as I was hoping to keep it around $1000 or so. Not sure what it cost during the Massdrop promo, but it probably would have been able to talk myself into it at a discount. Too bad I missed it...
 
Anyway, I need some thoughts on the new 's' version vs. the older version. Since they are supposedly similarly sounding, is there a compelling reason to choose one over the other?
 
It seems that I can get a 'tweaked' HP amp in the 's' version, with NOS tubes, etc., but at what expense? Does the more limited tube selection present a drawback?
 
While I'm not a huge tube roller, I will happily do some, so I am wondering if I should go for the non-'s' version in favor of doing some tube rolling.
 
Beyond that, are there any other compelling differences I should consider?
 
 
 
Thanks,
 
 
---Michael

Michael,
 
My experience is that the base MZ2, with stock power supply and stock tubes, is excellent. It provides a transparent, clear sound, with a large soundstage. 
 
My impression is that the Mjolnir 2 is more of a "fun" sounding amp. I don't have it, but I was researching it for a while myself. 
 
However, the MZ2 also has amazing room for growth, from power supplies (I would start out with the LPS from LTA) to tubes to internal modifications. 
 
So, you can get the stock version and be totally happy with it. I was, for a long time. 
 
But then, if you have some money laying around and want to improve your sound, you can buy a new power supply or some tubes. Repeat, ad nauseam....
 
BTW, I bought mine and used it for a long time solely as a headphone amp. But, because of life changes, I don't listen to headphones as much any more. But I'm enjoying my MZ2 just as much (or more) as a pre-amp. So, it's incredibly flexible. I think of the MZ2 more of a platform than anything else. Its stock configuration is great, but you can play with it and expand it in so many directions. One of my all-time favorite purchases ever. And no, they don't pay me anything.
 
Edit: To clarify, the "S" version just has the upgraded power supply, which you can buy at any time later, and some different tubes. You can buy the regular version and then upgrade later if you feel like it. I don't know the extent to which the 12SN7 tubes are harder to find than 6SN7s. I've been able to find lots of good 12AT7s, but not so many 6SN7s....