[kiteki]

 
Quote:

Does it need 24/96 flacs to shine???

You can upsample your music if you really want to.
 
Seems like you're looking for the absolute best you can get, if your music is all in CD quality FLAC and you're thinking about the HM-801.
 
Don't listen to these guys and buy a clip+, perhaps get the HM-601 or a different high-end DAP, you'll be happy.

 

[umvue]

Thanks for your reply. I think you answered my question and the answer is no.

 

[kiteki]

It's rare to find a thread with a simple "Yes" or "No" and case closed outcome, but I think the answer is unanimous "No, it doesn't need 24/96 to shine" orrrrr the other guys saying "No, it won't shine anyway".

 

[12345142]

I personally like my HM601, thanks. OP, if you don't need the DAC capability then you could get the HM-601, or the HM-602 for a cheaper alternative. The HM-801 is really, well, 'up there.' If you don't want any compromise, though, the HM801 is for you.

 

[EddieE]

Is there somewhere you can listen to a Hifiman DAP?
 
Pick up a Clip for a few quid and do a comparison, see if you think it's worth another few hundred of your quid.
 
If so, buy it and be happy you have the Clip as a "beater", if not then be happy you saved your self a lot of money and spend it on headphones!

 

[kiteki]

Or he could compare the Clip+ to the HM-601...?
 
Then if he likes the HM-601 a lot better, he could also also consider the HM-602 if he wants a USB DAC?

 

[wind016]

Quote:

I haven't heard it

I don't think Hifiman would make a crap DAP since they make great IEM's.

 
Quote:

 
Don't listen to these guys and buy a clip+, perhaps get the HM-601 or a different high-end DAP, you'll be happy.

Why do you think you have the right to recommend the HIFIMAN? You haven't heard it but it must be good because of what exactly? I haven't heard the Clip but the COWON J3/S9 beat out the HIFIMAN players. If you want to roll off your frequencies from 5K like the HIFIMAN, I suggest you just do it with an EQ instead and Cowon's BBE implemented hardware EQ is the best on the market. Just because HIFIMAN make great IEMS and headphones doesn't mean everything they make is all that it's cracked up to be. HIFIMAN has a better amplification system than most players, but that is all they have over other players. The COWON is good enough to power ALL portable headphones or any headphones with a 40 ohm impedance (or even an AKG K701). If the headphones were any bigger, it begs the question of portability and whether the player is worth 4 times the price or $600 more than the COWON.
 
Also, no matter how bright your headphones are, frequency roll-off in source equipment should absolutely never be an intention or aim. It's the same idea as running all your music files through a permanent filter rolling off frequencies from 5K, but people want absolutely perfect audio files, no? Get better balanced headphones for your needs or use an EQ if you want a darker sound. Needing 24/96 playback on the HIFIMAN? It can't even reproduce 16/44 treble.

 

[DaveBSC]

To suggest that the HM-801 sounds worse than a mass market DAP because of frequency response curves or crosstalk is ludicrous, that's like judging $10K monoblocks based on THD measurements. This one is 0.005% better, therefore it sounds better cause der measurement said so! I maintain that anyone that says the 801 sounds worse than a clip has not listened to it with headphones that cost more than $200.
 
I've done plenty of comparisons with my 801 and my Cowon S9 using the same FLAC files, with the Cowon both set for no EQ/enhancements for apples to apples, and set with my preferred settings to give it the best possible advantage. Here's what I've found. Sony MDR-7509: no real difference. AKG K601: no real difference. Denon NC-800: very slight improvement with the 801. Audio-Technica ES10: smoother, more refined sound from the 801 with less grain, particularly in the treble region. Denon D2000: considerable improvement with the 801, better bass control, less recessed mids, less treble harshness. Beyer DT880-32: night/day in favor of the 801. Honestly if you try the 880 on an HM-801 and a Clip or Cowon and can't hear a difference, you should give this hobby up and just go listen to some Apple earbuds.
 
I should make it clear that under no circumstances with any headphone did I prefer the sound of the Cowon to the 801. With my cheapest headphones there just wasn't I difference I could hear.
 
To actually answer the OPs question rather than just use this thread as an excuse to troll, no, you don't need 24/96 to get the most out of the Hifiman. I would say its performance is somewhere around the level of a $300 or $400 amp and equivalent DAC, and it's impressive that they were able to stuff that level of performance in a battery powered box, but it's not a competitive with an $800 amp and $800 DAC, which is where you might want to start thinking about high-res.

 

[wind016]

Quote:

To suggest that the HM-801 sounds worse than a mass market DAP because of frequency response curves or crosstalk is ludicrous, that's like judging $10K monoblocks based on THD measurements. This one is 0.005% better, therefore it sounds better cause der measurement said so! I maintain that anyone that says the 801 sounds worse than a clip has not listened to it with headphones that cost more than $200.
 
I've done plenty of comparisons with my 801 and my Cowon S9 using the same FLAC files, with the Cowon both set for no EQ/enhancements for apples to apples, and set with my preferred settings to give it the best possible advantage. Here's what I've found. Sony MDR-7509: no real difference. AKG K601: no real difference. Denon NC-800: very slight improvement with the 801. Audio-Technica ES10: smoother, more refined sound from the 801 with less grain, particularly in the treble region. Denon D2000: considerable improvement with the 801, better bass control, less recessed mids, less treble harshness. Beyer DT880-32: night/day in favor of the 801. Honestly if you try the 880 on an HM-801 and a Clip or Cowon and can't hear a difference, you should give this hobby up and just go listen to some Apple earbuds.
 
I should make it clear that under no circumstances with any headphone did I prefer the sound of the Cowon to the 801. With my cheapest headphones there just wasn't I difference I could hear.

You're welcome to your opinion, but I think you're exaggerating the audible difference. "if you... can't hear a difference, you should give this hobby up"  Come on now. How big is the difference in a portable on the move setting? Not big IMO. I don't consider a Beyer portable even if it's a night and day difference.

 

[Bojamijams]

I still get great chuckles from people on here bashing gear they don't understand and/or can't afford.
 
If I can't hear a difference then there must be none because my ears are the greatest in the world and I can tell the difference in everything!!!!!
 
Please people, get over yourselves.

 

[keyeman]

One day you may decide to listen to higher sample rates. It does make a difference. Like Bojamijams, I'm not sure what value you will get from reading comments from people that don't have the equipment or tell you it's no good based on their concept of "specs". Specs don't mean diddley. You have to listen to the equipment and then decide.

 

[DaveBSC]

Quote:

You're welcome to your opinion, but I think you're exaggerating the audible difference. "if you... can't hear a difference, you should give this hobby up"  Come on now. How big is the difference in a portable on the move setting? Not big IMO. I don't consider a Beyer portable even if it's a night and day difference.

I did my comparison testing in my office, which has a noise floor in the 30ish dB range. Obviously the more background noise there is, the smaller the differences will be. The low impedance version of the DT880 is intended to be portable friendly, but it demands current and the S9 simply ain't got it. With no EQ or enhancements the 880 had pretty much no bass to speak of, thin, reedy mids, and unrefined highs with no definition or detail. With all of the EQ stuff turned on, the bass was lumpy and bloated, mids were grainy, and highs were splashy, harsh, and overbearing. In either case the 880 was pretty much unlistenable out of the S9. The 250 Ohm version might've been better, I don't know. It would probably require maximum volume to hear much, but the current demand would be lower. The 120 Ohm K601 worked fine with the volume at 75-80%. Obviously the 600 Ohm isn't even worth trying.
 
That's not to say that the only thing the 801 gives you is a more powerful amp. The DAC section is a considerable step up from whatever dirt cheap crap is in a Cowon or Clip and I heard this with the ES10, even though those headphones have little in the way of refinement and one of the smallest soundstages I've experienced. The S9 has no trouble driving the ES10, and the sound out of the 801 was still better in every way. A better sounding portable like the DT1350 should be fantastic out of the 801. I have not done that comparison, but I found the 1350 to be merely above average out of my S9, and I suspect that they have much more to give than I heard.
 
If you want to listen on the subway or on a bus, the 801 is silly. I use my S9 and my NC-800s in that situation. I'm not interested in maximum fidelity there, I just want to get rid of as much background noise as possible. In situations where I'm away from my desktop Stax rig but I do want maximum fidelity, that's when I use the 801, and I will soon be getting a pair of LA7000s for that purpose. Driving the LA7000 out of a Clip is just brainless, and making the Clip louder by attaching a TTVJ Slim or ALO RX is not going to catch the 801. Using an iPod into one of the new portable iTransport style devices and THEN into a Slim or RX could very well beat the 801, but I like the one box solution that the 801 offers, as well as the FLAC and APE support.
 

 

[kiteki]

@wind016
 
TBH I don't recommend the clip+ nor the HM-801.
 
I think the HM-601 is reasonably priced, however if anyone asks me about a DAP, I say Teclast T51! and I'm anticipating the Teclast T59 coming soon.
 
I haven't heard the J3 but I sold the Cowon S9 within a week! It was my first high-end DAP and I was quite disappointed and put a negative review of it up on head-fi, I think that was my first post on head-fi I had to sign up to let people know not to buy the S9.
 
The Clip has a great price to performance ratio, but it doesn't compete with stuff like Teclast, in this case I have heard both.

 

[umvue]

Quote:

To suggest that the HM-801 sounds worse than a mass market DAP because of frequency response curves or crosstalk is ludicrous, that's like judging $10K monoblocks based on THD measurements. This one is 0.005% better, therefore it sounds better cause der measurement said so! I maintain that anyone that says the 801 sounds worse than a clip has not listened to it with headphones that cost more than $200.
 
I've done plenty of comparisons with my 801 and my Cowon S9 using the same FLAC files, with the Cowon both set for no EQ/enhancements for apples to apples, and set with my preferred settings to give it the best possible advantage. Here's what I've found. Sony MDR-7509: no real difference. AKG K601: no real difference. Denon NC-800: very slight improvement with the 801. Audio-Technica ES10: smoother, more refined sound from the 801 with less grain, particularly in the treble region. Denon D2000: considerable improvement with the 801, better bass control, less recessed mids, less treble harshness. Beyer DT880-32: night/day in favor of the 801. Honestly if you try the 880 on an HM-801 and a Clip or Cowon and can't hear a difference, you should give this hobby up and just go listen to some Apple earbuds.
 
I should make it clear that under no circumstances with any headphone did I prefer the sound of the Cowon to the 801. With my cheapest headphones there just wasn't I difference I could hear.
 
To actually answer the OPs question rather than just use this thread as an excuse to troll, no, you don't need 24/96 to get the most out of the Hifiman. I would say its performance is somewhere around the level of a $300 or $400 amp and equivalent DAC, and it's impressive that they were able to stuff that level of performance in a battery powered box, but it's not a competitive with an $800 amp and $800 DAC, which is where you might want to start thinking about high-res.

Thanks for your reply. That's what I inferred from the non-troll replies from this thread too.
 
I want to use the HM-801 to double as a desktop DAC/amp too. It takes much less space than the real things, so that is a plus.
 
 

 

[DaveBSC]

Quote:

The Clip has a great price to performance ratio, but it doesn't compete with stuff like Teclast, in this case I have heard both.

Another interesting portable player is the QLS Audio QA350 ModV2. It's not the most practical thing in the world as it's even bigger than the 801 (though I think thinner) and it only plays WAV files, but it's also around $200 if I recall. The ModV2 got a bunch of upgrades over the already pretty decent original, and I may buy one just to see how it compares to the 801.