[kimD]

drivers count does not mean it will sound better lol
a single carefully tuned driver can edge out multiple drivers

I just realized how good of Flc8s
Seem you're fully supported here

 

[nmatheis]

of all dunu iems, 1k and 2k impress me the most but flc8s gives me the edge

1k and 2k over 3001 and 4001? DN2KJ is a bit too sharp up top for my tastes...

So the 1 extra driver on the 2002 dont give it a edge over the FLC8s?

Funnily enough, not for me. I had a bit of back n forth with hifichris behind the scenes about this. I've got smaller ears, and 2002 doesn't fit well. This makes for a shallow fit and tenuous seal with lower bass response than DN2KJ, DK3001, DK4001, and FLC8S with red-gray-gold. Totally shocked me. Hifichris has larger ears and gets a better fit and more bass. Being a larger IEM is making 2002 a bit finicky, I guess...

 

[audio123]

1k and 2k over 3001 and 4001? DN2KJ is a bit too sharp up top for my tastes...


Funnily enough, not for me. I had a bit of back n forth with hifichris behind the scenes about this. I've got smaller ears, and 2002 doesn't fit well. This makes for a shallow fit and tenuous seal with lower bass response than DN2KJ, DK3001, DK4001, and FLC8S with red-gray-gold. Totally shocked me. Hifichris has larger ears and gets a better fit and more bass. Being a larger IEM is making 2002 a bit finicky, I guess...

yeap definitely for me. dunu has overachieved with the k series.

 

[seanwee]

 
drivers count does not mean it will sound better lol
a single carefully tuned driver can edge out multiple drivers
 

Etymotic ER4s

 

[meraias]

OK... bash me!
 
I mean, try it tonight!
 
Alien approved config :  Clear (ULF) Black(LF) and Green(M/HF) =P
 
Opens up all possible vents! Config sounds closest to ethereal!

 

[thatonenoob]

Etymotic ER4s

I agree a 100 and 20 percent

 

[audio123]

I agree a 100 and 20 percent

 

  Etymotic ER4s

agreed 1000% percent

er4s, dita, fibass are my top 3 for single driver
hum, aether, lab1 are my top 3 for dual drivers

 

 

 

[seanwee]

   
agreed 1000% percent

er4s, dita, fibass are my top 3 for single driver
hum, aether, lab2 are my top 3 for dual drivers

 

 

Other than the shell, any differences between lab 1 and 2?

 

[audio123]

  Other than the shell, any differences between lab 1 and 2?

sorry i put wrongly supposed to be lab1*

basically lab 1 is going in the heaven series direction while 2 is going in the pf series direction. If I heard correctly from the FAD ppl at the festival, lab2 uses a single dynamic driver. Sound is phenomenal but the price tag is quite hefty!
 
cheers
 

 

[seanwee]

  sorry i put wrongly supposed to be lab1*

basically lab 1 is going in the heaven series direction while 2 is going in the pf series direction. If I heard correctly from the FAD ppl at the festival, lab2 uses a single dynamic driver. Sound is phenomenal but the price tag is quite hefty!
 
cheers
 

That is to be expected from FAD.

 

[audio123]

  That is to be expected from FAD.

but their new series is more of the affordable side but not sure if they can deliver. lets not digress, pm if you want to continue.
back to flc8s, red grey gold forever
 

 

[dlayman]

  i think they should first
 
1, have an appropriate cable - the microphonics for the FLC8S is a disgrace for an IEM at this price - you basically can't walk anywhere with it if you want to enjoy any degree of quiet music
 
2, Invest a bit more time in tuning - the dynamic driver doesn't display any of the tight deep bass that I would expect from this type of driver. If they told me they had forgotten to wire it in in my headphones i genuinely would not be surprised!
 
The mids are sublime for sure and the seperation and imaging are lovely but the bass leaves a lot to be desired
The bass would be as expected for an armature driver, 1 or 2 and if the headphones was meant to be a more neutral flavor but...
 
I tried all the different combinations. Today I tried black LF filter with the clear one hoping this would allow a more defined punchy bass.
It sort of achieved this but the bass was very warm.
 
I still enjoy the IEM's with greys & red but its sad that they came SO close to making a 100% winning headphone
For old Verve Jazz recordings such as Billie Holiday though they do sound exceptional!

 I agree the cable is microphonic, but I don't mind it that much.  When walking, use a shirt clip and adjust the cable cinch as tightly as possible.  You can order the original FLC8 (not S) cable from lendmeurears.com, inexpensive.  Very supple and no microphonics whatsoever.  Its just a little generic and lower purity copper but it sounds quite good.  This way you are sure to get the correct pin size.
 
I haven't heard anyone in all these pages say the dynamic driver sounds like it isn't working.  IMO, its not a basshead IEM, but its bass is above average in quality and quantity.  What IEM are you comparing it to?  Good seal?  If it really sounds that weak to you, I would look into an exchange as that really isn't normal.

 

[jon parker]

 

i think they should first

1, have an appropriate cable - the microphonics for the FLC8S is a disgrace for an IEM at this price - you basically can't walk anywhere with it if you want to enjoy any degree of quiet music

2, Invest a bit more time in tuning - the dynamic driver doesn't display any of the tight deep bass that I would expect from this type of driver. If they told me they had forgotten to wire it in in my headphones i genuinely would not be surprised!

The mids are sublime for sure and the seperation and imaging are lovely but the bass leaves a lot to be desired

The bass would be as expected for an armature driver, 1 or 2 and if the headphones was meant to be a more neutral flavor but...

I tried all the different combinations. Today I tried black LF filter with the clear one hoping this would allow a more defined punchy bass.
It sort of achieved this but the bass was very warm.

I still enjoy the IEM's with greys & red but its sad that they came SO close to making a 100% winning headphone
For old Verve Jazz recordings such as Billie Holiday though they do sound exceptional!

Hi Jon, just curious on the usage time of your FLC8s. As some users have noticed the dynamic drivers improve over time with significant hours played.

With regards to the microphonics on the cable, it's not THAT bad as I've had worse cables. I do agree it's not as supple as it could be and that the slight rigidity lends the microphonics but maybe I'm not as sensitive as it's not bothersome to me during commutes

 
hi
they have had over 60 hours - anyway, its the tuning and the quality that leaves me a bit unimpressed. I understand sound quite well as I work as a sound enginner (im not the best in world but I do listen carefully to sound...sometimes even music!
I just know that you can get a better deeper & richer bass response with dynamic drivers. Its almost as if the dynamic-ness isn't really there / implimented fully
Now, to be fair, Im thinking they have deliberately tuned them like this because these iems are ALL about the liquid mids and clean highs.
I can hear how having a more dynamic sounding driver would tip the balance away from this and would produce a different over all experience
 
Im not saying this headphones isn't superb! It is! BUT if you are going to have a dynamic driver (used specifically for bass) then I would expect at some point to really be able to appreciate the bass.
Again, Im not saying the bass is 'bad' - its just not as dynamic as a having a dynamic driver should be. I do respect how they have tuned the headphones in that for female jazz for example the headphones sounds spectacular....But when I listen to rock - there is just not the bass impact [that there could be with a dynamic driver]
 
Another reason Im not overly impresssed with the dynamic driver is the quality of the bass using the different tuning filters -
increasing / decreasing the 'bass' using the filters does not improve the bass response...it changes it !! and not in an UN-interesting way (which is fun to play with)
its more that the tunings are a little immature to my ears  
 
As for the cable - the point of over ear is too counter act microphonics - every footstep produces a boom, even having the cable inside my jacket creates a lot of noise. Perhaps I have been spoiled with the A83 cable? 
i know you CAN have cables with no microphonics Im just a bit annoyed that [i imagine] they thought the added quality from the super copper they used was a good counter to the microphonics
To be fair, maybe I get more of this effect from using the large grey tips? I have large holes so it be the added pressure from the large tips??
 
In conclusion - The mids and highs, seperation and stereo  imaging are very good, at times breathtakingly good but I just dont think the bass is good enough - not bad, just not as good as it should/could have been

 

[Brooko]

   
Another reason Im not overly impresssed with the dynamic driver is the quality of the bass using the different tuning filters -
increasing / decreasing the 'bass' using the filters does not improve the bass response...it changes it !! and not in an UN-interesting way (which is fun to play with)
its more that the tunings are a little immature to my ears  
 
As for the cable - the point of over ear is too counter act microphonics - every footstep produces a boom, even having the cable inside my jacket creates a lot of noise. Perhaps I have been spoiled with the A83 cable? 
i know you CAN have cables with no microphonics Im just a bit annoyed that [i imagine] they thought the added quality from the super copper they used was a good counter to the microphonics
To be fair, maybe I get more of this effect from using the large grey tips? I have large holes so it be the added pressure from the large tips??
 
In conclusion - The mids and highs, seperation and stereo  imaging are very good, at times breathtakingly good but I just dont think the bass is good enough - not bad, just not as good as it should/could have been

 
Jon - do you think that maybe your judgement re bass may be slightly clouded because you are used to the A83 or similar IEMs (which has elevated bass)? I see you and I share a lot of gear in our profiles, and I know in the past when I've been reviewing, I've actually clouded my own judgement a couple of times by listening to too many triples with elevated bass responses.  It's on my list to write a blog post at some stage - "the mistakes I've made as a reviewer" type of thing. There is definitely enough sub bass with the red ULF plugs - reaches pretty low too.  Maybe it might just be a matter of dialing the mids back a bit to let the bass shine? 
 
The second thing is that the boom you talk about "from every footstep" isn't bone conduction is it? I agree that the cable could be a lot better on the FLC8S - but with cable management, I'm not noticing the same amount of microphonics you are (cinching + tucked under clothes).  If it's bone conduction - the boom - there isn't a lot you can do.  Maybe play around with different tips to alleviate it (porous tips like Comply Sports Tips may help).

 

[jon parker]

  Jon - do you think that maybe your judgement re bass may be slightly clouded because you are used to the A83 or similar IEMs (which has elevated bass)? I see you and I share a lot of gear in our profiles, and I know in the past when I've been reviewing, I've actually clouded my own judgement a couple of times by listening to too many triples with elevated bass responses.  It's on my list to write a blog post at some stage - "the mistakes I've made as a reviewer" type of thing. There is definitely enough sub bass with the red ULF plugs - reaches pretty low too.  Maybe it might just be a matter of dialing the mids back a bit to let the bass shine? 
 
The second thing is that the boom you talk about "from every footstep" isn't bone conduction is it? I agree that the cable could be a lot better on the FLC8S - but with cable management, I'm not noticing the same amount of microphonics you are (cinching + tucked under clothes).  If it's bone conduction - the boom - there isn't a lot you can do.  Maybe play around with different tips to alleviate it (porous tips like Comply Sports Tips may help).

hi Brooko
thanks so much for your input. good points
Hmmm maybe a first for me the bone thing? I dont like it
 
In a sense I feel you are right, in fact I would agree with you 100% . . .except  I work on a daily basis closely with sound and the subtlties of audio so when Im hearing the qualities of bass [I hope] i would be hearing the various characteristics of the bass in and off itself from an understanding of audio and not be too influenced from other sources. (I hope!)
Im not saying this qualifies my opinions in anyway Anyway, a little knowledge is dangerous !  :/  So i do appreciate others' views
 
your ears Brook  are one of a handful that I do trust on this forum though so I will take your points on board and think more deeply about what you have said
 
Its funny, the more I hear audio, the more I think its almost impossible to say with any sense of definity that 'it' sounds like 'this' or 'it' sounds like 'that'! because there are SO many different changeable causes and conditions that come together with each listen. The synergys that combine between audio quality, device played on, headphone used...even mood! can make a huge difference
 
Having said that - I very much take on board your board your points - I like the red ulf plugs. I'll try going back to a more grey set up there are still some more tips  need to try
 
> I should point out, the cause of my slight dissatisfaction is NOT because these iem's are at fault but that they are SO good and so close to being [for me] an all round great headphone !  
Oh, and to reiterate - listening to DSD Billie Holidays Verve recordings is like nothing I have ever heard