[Zerotohero]

Music man -

What is your system?

I have used different cables in different systems with varying results.

 

[music_man]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zerotohero /img/forum/go_quote.gif Music man - What is your system? I have used different cables in different systems with varying results.

electronics are, yba passion integre 300,mark levinson 31.5,lavry da924,rel q208 mk II,cullen gcha headamp. fed by furman it reference 20i power conditioner. this is the system i "was" messing with power cords on.

i have another system in a dedicated listening room run off an ac-dc-ac battery grid and all cables are odin. i am happy with that system lol.

i just got the urge to start messing with power cords on my bedroom system for some reason. i do not really know why. anyhow guys i am pretty much settled on the cables i have purchased. every one is different. they are fairly high end cables and i am done. maybe i could have done better but to be honest i drove all over the place getting cables on deep clearance.

i am done messing around with this. i am sorry i made such a big deal out of it here. btw, for the transport in question(31.5) i just happened upon a tara labs "the one" for about 80% off list. it was used of course,ie burnt in. i don't know if it is the best cable for the job but for the price i am not complaining. it is a pretty nice cable imo. did it make a difference over the volex it replaced, i don't know!

it is amazing if you are keen you can pick up lot's of audio equipment for pennies on the dollar. mostly used,demos and closeouts. i was just in luck that a few places were blowing out power cords. of course they were no where near eachother but for the money i saved i am not complaining.

thank you all for the advice you offered in this thread.

music_man

 

[Currawong]

Since the only reasonable explanation that makes sence to me for power cables having an effect would be their capacitance filtering out noise I can't help thinking. That some kind of power conditioning would be better value. You can get a Juice Box Jr from ttvj.com for under $200 even.

 

[music_man]

the intresting thing is i just recently happened upon a very high end power conditioner. what is of super intrest is that cables coming out of it sound each a very little different(maybe even placebo). whatever cable you put into it, so long as it is a 20amp cable makes no difference! the cables coming out of it have a lot less effect then they did out of a $200 conditioner as well. i guess that would suggest it is doing it's thing? i checked it on both the dmm and scope and my wall. my wall is real nasty. after it goes through the reference furman the power is squeaky clean and nosie free. this is like the deluxe car wash of power conditioning!

music_man

 

[Zerotohero]

Did you hear a sound improvement after using the conditioner?

Quote:

Originally Posted by music_man /img/forum/go_quote.gif the intresting thing is i just recently happened upon a very high end power conditioner. what is of super intrest is that cables coming out of it sound each a very little different(maybe even placebo). whatever cable you put into it, so long as it is a 20amp cable makes no difference! the cables coming out of it have a lot less effect then they did out of a $200 conditioner as well. i guess that would suggest it is doing it's thing? i checked it on both the dmm and scope and my wall. my wall is real nasty. after it goes through the reference furman the power is squeaky clean and nosie free. this is like the deluxe car wash of power conditioning! music_man

 

[music_man]

this is the very strange thing. the system sounds really poor for what it is for about the first 20 minutes i play it. then all of the sudden i hear 3 loud "clicks" from the power conditioner and instantly the system sounds wonderful! i don't know why the thing does not start conditioning immediately. i called furman and they explained it needs to charge up by pulling current current through it for a little while before it is able to release current. the clicks, they explained are relays kicking it into "balanced power" once it is able to release it's charge. that sounds reasonable but i wish it did it's thing sooner. i guess you can't have everything. it works like a charm really.

the intresting thing is i never tested my wall power at the outlet before i got this thing. the power is really nosiy and way over voltage. coming out of the furman after it "warms up" the waveform is nearly perfect and it is at exactly 115vac on the dmm and it stays there as long as i keep putting a load on the furman. if you release the load for about 2 hours it has to warm up again next time you use the system. the huge problem is with the headphone amp. i have to run the power amp to "charge" it so i can use the headamp. it was honestly not designed for small loads though. it's specs are "provides up to an addional 80 amps instantaneously" i do not need anywhere near 80 amps to run my little stereo. it still has to charge up for the filtering to work though apparently. all the thing is, is a 90 pound toroid transformer(and what ever other components takes to run that xformer). it is not like some other types of active or even passive filtering. it really does make a huge difference though. i did not even know what i was missing before. the difference is night and day. this is the truth and not placebo simply because my ac is very poor quality. it did make a huge difference on the headamp as well but only after i charge it by using the power amp.

of course if you have decent ac i doubt you would realise this type of difference.

power cords change the sonic signature of a component slightly. the furman made the system go from rather poor(which i did not even know) to as good as it probably can be.

i plugged in a 20 amp hair dryer into it and tested the other outlets. nearly perfect wavefrom and maintained 115vac.

to think that i just stumbled upon this thing because of a special favor from a friend that got it for me. i hate to say this but i had a smaller bpt and running springs that did not clean the trash ac like this thing does. this is the home version of their top of the line studio power delivery system. people plug 5 million dollars of equipment into that thing. so it is understandable that is does work. i guess my power was just too bad for the bpt and running springs. i had a hydra but that is really just a "surge protector" it does not offer much in the way of filtering but i mentioned that here a long time ago.

music_man

 

[Zerotohero]

Wat model is your furman and how much did it cost?

 

[music_man]

it is a furman "it-reference 20i". it retails for about $3,500. let's just say i did not pay that,ok? it was a favor at cost. i promised as a condition of that favor i would not reveal what the actual cost is on the internet. i am sorry about that. do not expect to get one at cost anyways. the salespeople have to feed there families as well,ok? however, do expect to get one at a pretty decent discount if you haggle. i am told that happens regularly. don't get it at a stereo shop. if you are in the market for a furman product get it at a musicians store to receive the discount.

i do not know if the lower models do the same thing since they are based on completely different technology. however, furman is real soild stuff known for it's no bs quality. as i said earlier, the other companies list no specs. my furman has two pages of specs! it is made for working people who rely on it for a living, not solely a hobby.

music_man

 

[.Sup]

does it need a better PSU?

 

[music_man]

.sup, if you are asking me i don't understand what you are asking me! does "what" need a better psu? you mean a better supply out of my wall? if that is what you mean, well that is the whole job of the conditioner! the furman does not have a "psu" it IS a psu!

music_man

 

[linuxworks]

I would not call a power conditioner a PSU. a PSU (power supply unit) converts from wall voltage down to 'user voltage' whatever that is (5v, 12v, whatever). and it maintains regulation and of course converts ac to dc.

conditioners do none of those things.

I might add, if you *need* a conditioner then one might question the quality of the PSUs in the gear you own. any self respecting PSU will be able to keep inside the regulation curve under all usual line variations.

sloppy or cheap PSUs in products are not cured by upstream 'conditioners'.

they're cured by putting proper PSUs in products and not buying products that are fussy at the PSU level.

any PSU that changes its behavior by an upstream power cord is a badly designed PSU. there, I said it.

 

[9pintube]

OF COURSE........IF YOU "BELIEVE YOU HEAR" A DIFFERENCE.....But I do believe, like so many have stated above, start with a good (doesn't mean $$$) power conditioner!!!

 

[music_man]

indeed, if your ac is "in spec" you are fine right out of the wall with decent gear. my ac is not in spec however. the power company does not care.

the furman outputs perfect ac. as i imagine most other similar products do. products are not expected by anyone to deal with improper power delivery. would a 120vac amp run on 20vac? i think not.

also, yes if you "believe" in something it makes a difference to you. that does not mean that it technically makes any difference. sorry i just said it as well. for the record i like to believe in lots of things. i think if you put your favorite beanie baby on your amplifier it will sound better because it brings you good luck! does it really? that's up to ones imagination. to mention albert einstein again, you all know what he said about imagination! so there you go.

music_man

 

[music_man]

i am sorry to repeat myself but i am dumbfounded. the system sounds aweful untill the machine decides to make the three loud clicks. then the transformation is beyond belief to me. it is not placebo because i left my scope on it and dmm on it. before it went into balanced power it simply pushed through my trash ac. once it turned on it made the waveform,noise and voltage nearly perfect.

the prat and overall sq goes from like a 2 or 3 to a 10 in respect to this systems abilities.

again i would only figure you will realise this type of improvement if your ac is way out of spec.

i am just very happy.

music_man

 

[Uncle Erik]

Quote:

Originally Posted by linuxworks /img/forum/go_quote.gif I would not call a power conditioner a PSU. a PSU (power supply unit) converts from wall voltage down to 'user voltage' whatever that is (5v, 12v, whatever). and it maintains regulation and of course converts ac to dc. conditioners do none of those things. I might add, if you *need* a conditioner then one might question the quality of the PSUs in the gear you own. any self respecting PSU will be able to keep inside the regulation curve under all usual line variations. sloppy or cheap PSUs in products are not cured by upstream 'conditioners'. they're cured by putting proper PSUs in products and not buying products that are fussy at the PSU level. any PSU that changes its behavior by an upstream power cord is a badly designed PSU. there, I said it.

X2

Most people have no idea how important the power supply is.

A quality power supply removes all the nasties off the line and turns AC into very clean DC.

If you need some magical mystery power cord to "help" a device, then it probably has a crap power supply. That goes no matter what the MSRP of the device is - even some kilobuck devices have awful power supplies.