[johnwmclean]

Uncle Erik, I’ve had more time to digest the sentiments within your post, I agree with most of what you stated. But there’s one thing that has left me in the lurch, what of the many people and hobbyists who do hear and swear by their cables, are they all delusional victims of marketing and profiteering? Is there not one scrap of validation within these numbers?
Maybe your right and it’s been one big snowball effect, mass indoctrination through marketing and hype. I’m finding it hard to digest though, surely there must be some merit to the value of cable based on perception through numbers alone.

 

[linuxworks]

entirely in the mind. like a lot of higher end audio, facts fade and its all about 'the sell'.

as builders, we are more grounded in reality than those that simply buy gear and listen to the sales pitches. when I build, I tend to grab whatever wire I have around at the time. good or average or even bad stuff; as long as it makes contact, it tends to work.

now, we are not talking microwave rf transmission lines here. its JUST AUDIO. its not hard. it was never hard. but you can't say that to 'believers'. they just don't want to hear the truth.

builders know there isn't magic pixie dust in transistors and chips and circuit boards.

analogy: doctors 'repair humans' (that's all; they are simply human being repairmen; with fancy titles and god-like self images). yet non-doctors look at amazement and wonder that a doctor can 'do what he does'. to the outsiders, medicine seems like magic. to those inside, its JUST science, nothing more. nothing godlike, nothing mystical, just a guy doing what he was trained to do; like all the others.

to those who are not in the field, it seems like magic. but its the farthest thing from magic to those of us who build and know about gear.

this is why many of us get annoyed at the 'believers'. we know what matters in a build and what is simply just eye dressing.

 

[music_man]

the best cord: one that carries power! ba-bing!

music_man

 

[Zerotohero]

Like John stated - If better cables was a scam - how do you argue with the shear numbers of "believers" as you put it?

Is every single one of them just experiencing the placebo effect?

 

[music_man]

they beileve. some people believe big bird is god. are you going to tell them they are wrong? go ahead, they won't listen!

i beileve in the cables as well. i just am smart enough to know the differences are present because i want to believe they are there. not because the cables are actually different!

music_man

 

[Zerotohero]

Ive tried various "tweaks" over the years with varying results.
Some examples below i cannot account to placebo;

# My friend and I tried vibrapods, both of us with a preconceived idea that they were just snake oil and weren't going to do anything to the sound. - when they made a big improvement we were both left staring at each other stunned!

# I changed a coax digital cable on my system without telling my wife that i had even bought a cable, expecting her not to notice anything different. Imagine my surprise when she asked me a couple of days later what I had done as the sound sounded "clearer" and had "more bass". This was the same change i had noted with the new cable.

# I replaced the internal speaker cable of my old speakers to prove to a friend that there would be no difference. I was shocked to hear a big improvement even when i subconsciously had convinced myself there wouldn't be any difference.

I've had it happen the other way around too, where Ive convinced myself i was going to hear a great improvement by buying some new cable or tweak and have had to accept that i couldn't hear a difference.
So, from my personal experience, I have experienced some good and bad changes in my systems over the years from things that cant be put down to placebo.
I'm not saying placebo doesn't happen at all, because it does, but just not every single time to every single person.

The best way to test this is by blind testing.
If you cant notice a difference without using your eyes then don't hand over the cash.

Just my two cents....

 

[music_man]

i wanted to mention something intresting. there is a cable company that states people have copied their cables and made "fakes". maybe there are fakes. the problem is that the cable they describe as being a fake is exactly what their cable looks like and says on it! the "fake" does not seem to exist. this has everyone wondering if they have a fake. to add to this they state that the construction is very poor and can cause a fire or electrocution. i have taken apart several, to find fine construction and assembly(i asumed they were real though). i tested them, fine. now, how would one know if they have a "dangerous" fake or a real one?
hmm. this seems to me like companies that create their own competition or do things to stir up intrest. more likely, they "lost" a lot of bulk cable as have many other companies and they are rather upset about it.
come to think of it this company has a cable called "bs"! oops, i gave it away. well, i think it is indeed bs!

music_man

 

[RickEC]

Quote:

Originally Posted by johnwmclean /img/forum/go_quote.gif But there’s one thing that has left me in the lurch, what of the many people and hobbyists who do hear and swear by their cables, are they all delusional victims of marketing and profiteering?

I think the answer is in the gray. Just experiment and trust our own ears.