[MikeW]

Im rather apalled, but not surprized that a relativly well known(amongst audiophiles) company like Shunyanta would have such insane ridiculous markups. You know this **** cost them less then 50$ to build when economies of scale come in. Unbelieveable.... Shunyanta is nothing more then a few high quality outlets a couple off the shelf 2$ noise suppression capacitors and a varistor

Reminds me of the great value that is Grado RA1 2$ of electornics in a 3$ wood box. With a 3000% markup

http://www.10audio.com/diy_power_conditioner.htm

 

[ooheadsoo]

Not surprised at all. Audio is a great market for the business inclined.

 

[Wodgy]

Yup, not surprising at all. Welcome to "high end" audio.

 

[riffer]

Some of them are just hollowed out blocks of wood with a nice case. At least Shunyata put $100 of parts in it with the $3000 case

Edit - Oops, wrong model. The model he copied is about $700

 

[saint.panda]

The deciding factor is the design and unless there are diy designs available, I suppose you'll have to go for what's commercially available.

I think the only reason how there can be a bigger diversity and number of hifi companies than in probably any other and much bigger electronics branches is solely due to the immense profit margin. Doesn't mean that audio is easy money but neither is it good value for the consumer. Everytime I go to a hifi-expo, I'm first of all surprised by the sheer number of hifi suppliers and secondly by how crappy most of the gear sounds in relation to the price. You can fare so much better with diy or even pro audio gear. I find it strange that most audio mags hardly mention diy or pro audio stuff. Makes you wonder who the articles are written for.

 

[ooheadsoo]

There's diy for everything out there. And there are 3000% markups for those not diy inclined. On the down side, you can't hardly sell any diy gear.

 

[AlanY]

Quote:

Originally Posted by saint.panda The deciding factor is the design and unless there are diy designs available, I suppose you'll have to go for what's commercially available.

The DIY versus not DIY thing is not really the point here. The Shunyata power conditioners are just as simple as (relatively) cheap Monster power conditioners, yet sell for much more. That's the "shocking" thing to some people. How the same exact thing can sell for seven to ten times more if it has some funky name and markets to the audiophile crowd rather than the home theatre crowd.

 

[ooheadsoo]

Monster's pc power conditioner and ht power conditioner sell for some few hundred dollars difference but are the exact same product with different stickers, for example. No surprise.

 

[saint.panda]

Quote:

Originally Posted by AlanY The DIY versus not DIY thing is not really the point here. The Shunyata power conditioners are just as simple as (relatively) cheap Monster power conditioners, yet sell for much more. That's the "shocking" thing to some people. How the same exact thing can sell for seven to ten times more if it has some funky name and markets to the audiophile crowd rather than the home theatre crowd.

Yes, you're right. I was trying to touch that point in the second part of my post with regards pro audio gear, which is often the same or a very similar product as the audiophile counterparts but without the marketing, fancy packaging, etc.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ooheadsoo There's diy for everything out there. And there are 3000% markups for those not diy inclined. On the down side, you can't hardly sell any diy gear.

And you have to spends lots of hours for research and to acquire the necessary skills, or know people who have them.

 

[LFF]

Quote:

Originally Posted by MikeW http://www.10audio.com/diy_power_conditioner.htm

Damn. I wish I had the skills and time to do these projects. It would save me so much $$$ in the long run.

 

[MikeW]

I refuse to purchase anything from Shunyata now, I dont' care how great it sounds. I'd rather use a 200$ APC unit like the H15 or H10, It may not sound as good but at least im not getting violated. Even used ps audio gear is a better value. I wonder how BPT's stuff stacks up from a value perspective. At least there's somthing in the damn box. ( a big ass transformer)

 

[markl]

Quote:

Monster's pc power conditioner and ht power conditioner sell for some few hundred dollars difference but are the exact same product with different stickers, for example. No surprise.

Quote:

The Shunyata power conditioners are just as simple as (relatively) cheap Monster power conditioners, yet sell for much more.

What are these statements based on? You can look inside the Monster units at your local Best Buy, they always have those display models with the clear tops. They don't look anything alike. I see a lot more "stuff" inside the Monster units (transformers, circuit boards, etc.) than I do inside the Shunyata.

 

[mshan]

http://www.shunyata.com/modeldriver.aspx?navitemid=2362

 

[dmichael]

I don't use any power conditioners at all since the manufacturer of most of my home gear (Ayre) recommends against it for their products, they claim everything sounds better plugged straight into the wall, and I have verified this to be true. That said, if your in need of a power conditioner, are you looking to buy a bunch of expensive parts neatly arranged in a beautiful case - OR - are you looking for a superior technology??? Would you base your buying decision on which product has a better ratio of parts cost to retail price, or would you buy the one that sounds better at a given price point?

IMHO a lot of money goes into R&D which can be more costly than the parts and labor to manufacture. Part of the R&D process includes discovery of a technology that can clean up your sound using a limited amount of labor and inexpensive parts. It has to be, otherwise the Hydra will have a price tag of $10,000 and not enough customers will be able to buy it to cover the R&D let alone make a profit.

I agree that some "high-end" companies out there are not spending on parts or R&D and are trying to put one over on consumers, but those are the companies that don't last very long.

I don't work in this industry, and I don't own any shunyata products, but I've A-B'd the Hydra and it made a significant difference in the system I heard it in(not mine).

 

[skyskraper]

the problem with that is the configuration used (a couple of caps and a varistor) is hardly ground breaking or unique. its a fairly commonplace arrangement in many things and has been for many years.

now they may claim that theyve r&d'd the setup to find the most "musical" (the most intangible of intangible's

) configuration but really, even if you did do that you'd spend a few hundred bucks on various parts (AT MOST) and a bit of time swapping stuff around.

high end audio is a gold mine for scam artists, its all completely legal too which is the best (or worst) part! think about how many other site's out there use non specific terms or big technical circular explanations or proprietery catch phrases or lots of descriptives without a huge deal of empirical support of their claims, shunyata are far from being an isolated case.

i'll stop at the risk of offending people who may not have the same point of view as me, but just remember that if claims can't be backed up (relatively) objectively or if things can't be explained in a clear and simple manner (if you enquire about them) you should probably be a bit more careful then you would normally.