CAMPFIRE AUDIO Australia - New Zealand Tour (Reviews and Impressions) ORION / LYRA / JUPITER / ANDROMEDA
Mar 8, 2016 at 6:23 PM Post #136 of 340
I have the Orions (?) now - (I'm in the office and don't have them with me, but the single BA driver model).
 
Early thoughts are less positive than with the Jupiters. Beautiful design, fit and finish and the technical SQ is very good, but subjectively I think the tuning is a bit of a let-down. More to come...
 
Mar 8, 2016 at 9:35 PM Post #138 of 340
Almost 4 days in with the Jupiters so far.  Unfortunately I'm not impressed.
 
I'll start with the positives first.
  1. The build quality is amazing - they're gorgeous to look at and the minimalist in me loves the clean looks.
  2. The cable is nice to wear, and I like how solid the connectors are (mmcx)
  3. The case is beautiful, a great size, and protects nicely
  4. The accessory package is very good - from the tips to the inclusion of the balanced cable (which is a great option)
  5. Sonically the bass is brilliant - fast, articulate, well balanced
  6. The lower treble is very good, very clear, and with good detail, and nice extension
  7. Imaging and stage seems to be pretty good so far - especially the imaging
 
And now the not so good
  1. While the overall shape and build might be good, the hard angles on the inside are terrible.  I never forget that I'm wearing them, and around an hour later my ears are actually hurting. I simply can't believe anyone looked at an angular design on the internal face, with rigid edges, and could think that would be comfortable.
  2. While I like the cables as far as fit and flexibility go (and they look nice too), they are very tangle prone, and quite microphonic as well.
 
And the downright awful
  1. The mid-range.  It is very incoherent, very forward, and quite brittle.  It's almost like the drivers are working against each other.  I've resisted measuring them so far - but I need to very soon just so I can see how to EQ them to make them enjoyable to listen to. And this isn't an exaggeration - I genuinely find this IEM unpleasant to listen to - to the point that I've been forcing myself to use them.
  2. Which leads us to price.  $899.  The elephant in the room.  The Oriveti Primacy I reviewed recently was $300, not quite my ideal signature, but very good build, very good comfort, and easy to find my sweet spot (a little less 1 kHz and a little more 2-3 kHz). It represents fantastic value and if the Jupiter had the same traits of comfort and coherence, I could at least understand the price tag. For $899 you can buy an Adel U6 (without discount) - I won't go further .......
 
I'll hopefully finish up with these by Friday.  And I'm really hoping the Orion and Lyra are more conventionally tuned.
 
Sorry guys - probably one of the worst IEMs I've heard for a long time.
 
Mar 8, 2016 at 9:52 PM Post #139 of 340
Thanks for the impressions Paul. Im quite surprised by what you're hearing because I didn't notice it in my brief time with the Jupiter. Is there a possibility that we may have an issue with this particular unit?

Hopefully Loquah can tell us if he's noticed anything similar to your experience.
 
Mar 8, 2016 at 10:32 PM Post #140 of 340
As some added perspective I heard the same pair Brooko has. I agree with the coherency issues he has mentioned.
 
And the little bit expensive part as well. (you will see this in my review)
 
Mar 8, 2016 at 11:14 PM Post #142 of 340
Yeah I'm wondering if this unit might be slightly broken.  The ALO guys know good sound, and I can't imagine anyone thinking this is "good sound"
 
Just FTR - Mark and I already discussing, and will be trying to get the unit back to Ken I think - so that it can get checked out.
 
Mar 8, 2016 at 11:45 PM Post #143 of 340
Thanks for your contribution Paul. Hopefully Ken and his team will be able to determine what's happened. Campfire Audio is taking this with great importance. They will let us know their findings.
 
Mar 9, 2016 at 3:01 AM Post #144 of 340
Update - measured them tonight.  Channel matching is brilliant,  Big hole in the presence area though. Finding out soon whether this is intentional or if this pair is defective.  Fingers crossed its not the default tuning.
 
EQ'd to fill the hole - quite enjoying them now.
 
Mar 9, 2016 at 3:04 AM Post #145 of 340
  Update - measured them tonight.  Channel matching is brilliant,  Big hole in the presence area though. Finding out soon whether this is intentional or if this pair is defective.  Fingers crossed its not the default tuning.
 
EQ'd to fill the hole - quite enjoying them now.

What bands did you change and by how much? I'm curious on the edited bands. I get mine tomorrow, so shout out from here in America!
 
Mar 9, 2016 at 3:06 AM Post #146 of 340
If it's Ok, I'll wait first to hear from Mark and Ken - as I need to hear (based on the graph I just sent) whether the tuning is intentional or something is wrong with them. 
 
Mar 9, 2016 at 3:06 AM Post #147 of 340
  Update - measured them tonight.  Channel matching is brilliant,  Big hole in the presence area though. Finding out soon whether this is intentional or if this pair is defective.  Fingers crossed its not the default tuning.
 
EQ'd to fill the hole - quite enjoying them now.

 
Did it look something like this?
 
http://www.head-fi.org/t/797685/campfire-audio-australia-new-zealand-tour-reviews-and-impressions-orion-lyra-jupiter/30#post_12344073
 
Mar 9, 2016 at 3:17 AM Post #148 of 340
Update - measured them tonight.  Channel matching is brilliant,  Big hole in the presence area though. Finding out soon whether this is intentional or if this pair is defective.  Fingers crossed its not the default tuning.

EQ'd to fill the hole - quite enjoying them now.


I think it's largely a matter of preferences? The Jupiter does not have a sound sig that is up my alley. however, it does certain things incredibly well, especially with regards to the staging and the imaging.

yet what I like about campfire is how they really understand earphone design. A lot of TOP Brand’s in the industry use plastic tubings and don't bother damping Drivers on the outside. Of course I'm no expert, but my limited understanding of physics tells me that these are things that can be changed for a better sound. Take for example dynamic Drivers, you don't see the best DD IEMs in a plastic chassis because of the poor resonant properties of plastic which can lead to a lot of midrange resonances especially, causing a lot of colouration, making things sound like you're talking through a pipe. I'm not saying they're all like that but there are enough BA IEMs on the market with that kind of sound

campfire takes a very different approach, using metal bores to prevent that colouration, damping each individual driver with epoxy and the likes, and while I agree with you that the tuning is not to my liking, It doesn't suffer from the plasticky colouration that I so often cannot stand in multi BA IEMs.

Whatever it is though, I would like you let you guys know that Ken has some seriously, seriously good stuff coming up. I can't and won't say much because of what I promised him, but this year will be a fantastic year for campfire. Their older models (I did like the Lyra though) piqued my interest, and got me seeing the potential in Ken's design philosophies, but I wouldn't dare say they're the best of the best. What's to come in 2016 though, now that's something you guys can really look forward to. I dare say, that campfire is now one of my two favourite IEM makers! :) And anyone who knows me knows that I don't like many things :)
 
Mar 9, 2016 at 3:17 AM Post #149 of 340
Oh - I didn't see that graph originally Luke.
 
Yep - similar except the drop is a lot steeper than theirs - around 10 dB - I may as well show you the graph
 

 
Now remember my gear isn't calibrated - and the data is raw - but yep, looks pretty similar.
 
For those who aren't aware, the 2-4 kHz areas is where a lot of vocal harmonics live, and is often called the presence area. If you want to hear what I was hearing try taking a reasonably neutral IEM, and then drop the 2 Khz slider by 5 dB and both 3 and 4kHz sliders by 9-10 dB.  That'll give you an idea of the issues I was hearing.
 
Mar 9, 2016 at 3:20 AM Post #150 of 340
Oh - I didn't see that graph originally Luke.

Yep - similar except the drop is a lot steeper than theirs - around 10 dB - I may as well show you the graph




Now remember my gear isn't calibrated - and the data is raw - but yep, looks pretty similar.

For those who aren't aware, the 2-4 kHz areas is where a lot of vocal harmonics live, and is often called the presence area. If you want to hear what I was hearing try taking a reasonably neutral IEM, and then drop the 2 Khz slider by 5 dB and both 3 and 4kHz sliders by 9-10 dB.  That'll give you an idea of the issues I was hearing.


This is exactly what I wanted to change in the Jupiters!
 

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