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Audio-GD Master 9 - Page 27

post #391 of 1338
Quote:
Originally Posted by dan.gheorghe View Post

Ok, M9 did not like my Silver Streak Kimber cable. (tried with some other interconnects)  Indeed, with LCD-X on balanced there is no competition between soloist and m9 in any department, transparency, attack, details, etc. Must get a balanced cable for HD800 and fast :P

All my headphones are cabled for balanced operation. The M9 should be used balanced whenever possible. I have a couple of single ended adapters in case I ever need to plug any of my headphones into a single ended amp.
post #392 of 1338
Quote:
Originally Posted by dan.gheorghe View Post
 

Ok, M9 did not like my Silver Streak Kimber cable. (tried with some other interconnects)  Indeed, with LCD-X on balanced there is no competition between soloist and m9 in any department, transparency, attack, details, etc. Must get a balanced cable for HD800 and fast :P

 

Yes... then you will see what the M9 can do with the HD800's  :D 


Edited by nigeljames - 6/13/14 at 3:38am
post #393 of 1338

Dan, can you go full balanced? Connecting your DAC to the M9 XLR input?

 

Balanced DACs have doble output 5v would be great for the Master-9.

 

I think that to use the 7W from the Master-9  you'd need to use the XLR input and 7v input + high gain


Edited by mowglycdb - 6/13/14 at 5:42am
post #394 of 1338
Thank you guys for your support. I've just borrowed some xlr cables to use m9's balanced inputs. And indeed with lcd-x it sounds amazing. With hd800 i've tried some other custom cables and even on single ended it started to sound amazing. ( Toxic Black Widow, Norse Draug, Claire HPC mk2)
post #395 of 1338

You should not use HD800 with Master 9 in SE Mode, there's huge difference between SE and Balance mode.

I am using Acss connection for NFB 7.32 and Master 9, in this acss mode there is no high gain and low gain option, the normal volume i use is about 40-50 and it is still so far to the max output level of Master 9.

 

 

post #396 of 1338

I don't think I would recommend using the Balanced output of the Analog DAC. As you said it is an inherently single ended design and I am pretty sure it uses opamps to make the balanced signal, the single ended to balanced conversion in the master 9 would probably be better. Though i guess using your ears would be the best option to determine the best way to hook it up.

post #397 of 1338

I will buy a balanced cable for HD800 soon (trying to determine which one).

 

Yes, that is exactly my problem :)) . In theory, Analog DAC should sound better on RCA outputs. I didn't do the test yet to determine if that is true, or to see if the difference is noticeable, because I would have to get the exact same cables in rca and xlr mode.

post #398 of 1338

My opinion is that the Analog does indeed sound better in its native interface, single-ended. With speakers, the difference is pretty substantial, with headphones.. not as apparent. Still, when I used the M9 with my MSB, it was definitely better using RCA even though I feel the balanced input on the M9 is superior sounding if there was a choice. 

post #399 of 1338
Quote:
Originally Posted by Greed View Post
 

My opinion is that the Analog does indeed sound better in its native interface, single-ended. With speakers, the difference is pretty substantial, with headphones.. not as apparent. Still, when I used the M9 with my MSB, it was definitely better using RCA even though I feel the balanced input on the M9 is superior sounding if there was a choice. 

Thank you for the input. Greatly appreciated. So you felt the difference easily between the RCA and XLR outputs from Analog Dac. When you said that not with headphones,not even with HD800? (I feel that HD800 scales the most).

 

Is it a big difference between the rca and xlr inputs from M9? Will test it myself. For now I did not feel a huge difference, even if I had significantly better cables on xlr inputs than the rca ones. However, it might be because MSB is better on rca .... 

 

Damn it... :)) I suspected that because Analog dac is not balanced might be a problem :)) I liked it so much that I didn't care and bought it anyway.


Edited by dan.gheorghe - 6/14/14 at 2:44am
post #400 of 1338

I'm not sure there's really a difference in SQ between SE and Balanced.  Yes it's a difference in volume levels.  So if you level / volume match the two will there be a difference in SQ?  That's the million dollar question.

 

Some DAC designers feel a SE system will out perform a balanced system. 

post #401 of 1338
Quote:
Originally Posted by preproman View Post
 

I'm not sure there's really a difference in SQ between SE and Balanced.  Yes it's a difference in volume levels.  So if you level / volume match the two will there be a difference in SQ?  That's the million dollar question.

 

Hmm.... Maybe Kingwa can comment on this..if he is reading this thread.

post #402 of 1338
Quote:
Originally Posted by dan.gheorghe View Post
 

Thank you for the input. Greatly appreciated. So you felt the difference easily between the RCA and XLR outputs from Analog Dac. When you said that not with headphones,not even with HD800? (I feel that HD800 scales the most).

 

Is it a big difference between the rca and xlr inputs from M9? Will test it myself. For now I did not feel a huge difference, even if I had significantly better cables on xlr inputs than the rca ones. However, it might be because MSB is better on rca .... 

 

Damn it... :)) I suspected that because Analog dac is not balanced might be a problem :)) I liked it so much that I didn't care and bought it anyway.

 

Sorry if there was confusion from my previous post, but to answer your question.. yes there is a difference between using the RCA vs. XLR with the Analog. Note that the differences are more significant to my ears via speakers, but headphones (esp. the HD800) also sound better via SE outs. 

 

As for a "big" difference between the RCA and XLR inputs on the M9, slightly better focus, more depth, and detail but I'm talking small differences here (cables, etc.). Overall, other than the obvious power difference the XLR/RCA are very comparable. Put it this way, I wouldn't be afraid that I was losing bits of sound, etc. (plug in various opinions about SE vs BAL here) if my main setup was utilizing only half of what the M9 can do (via RCA).

 

The difference was definitely the Analog in that particular setup. The M9 paired with the PWD MKII, or my M7/OR5 I thought the balanced signal sounded better than the single-ended. That is not to say that is the case for all equipment.

 

Like Darryl has said, there are plenty of  valid arguments that single-ended can be equal a balanced design or better it in some respects both in theory and in real life. It really comes down to the individual gear and design. Some DACs (or AMPs) I've heard sound better using one over the other, other times they are identical. 


Edited by Greed - 6/14/14 at 12:27pm
post #403 of 1338

If the Analog DAC or any DAC is a SE DAC by design, using the XLR output on the Master 9 will not get you any more of anything.  


Edited by preproman - 6/14/14 at 11:03am
post #404 of 1338

From the website “Using RCA input, Master 9 can convert to balanced ACSS signal and output real balance signal from XLR and ACSS.” Looks different to me…

 

Balanced:

40 ohm:   9000MW
100 ohm: 3800MW
300 ohm: 1250MW
600 ohm:   630MW

SE:

40 ohm:   2500MW
100 ohm: 1050MW
300 ohm: 350MW
600 ohm:   175MW

post #405 of 1338

Talking about Sound Quality not mw's.  Unless you somehow think more mw or watts = to better SQ..

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