ZMF Atrium - new open-back co-flagship

[erics75]

how about the Abyss Joal--is the Atrium better?

That's totally preference based. The Joal is a planar magnetic driver vs the dynamic driver in the Atrium. The Joal is fast, precise, revealing, and resolving. Transients are very fast, with fast decay, like most planars. The fast decay takes some of the note weight away, leaving it thinner sounding than if it's decay were longer. The Atrium and it's biocellulose drivers is warm, smooth, euphonic, and moderate in speed. It trades in technical prowess for musicality. Bass is fuller and more prominent. The moderate decay gives the Atrium a wonderful weighty/dense response. Mids are smooth and dynamic. It's an easy listening headphone with a ton of musicality and engagement. They make better compliments to each other than competitors, as anyone looking at them would have to know what they want most. Are they looking for speed and resolution? Or are they looking for musicality and euphony? Those preferences will dictate which is better for the each individual. There is no blanket better to apply to all users. I personally like the Atrium far more than the Joal, especially on tubes. It just matches me best. The question is, what matches YOU best?

PS amplification is also vastly different with each set. The high impedance dynamic drivers in the Atrium thrive on high output impedance tube amps. You'll find the best synergy there. The Joal on the other hand thrives on high current output solid state amps with ultra low output impedance. When I cross the Joal over to my tube amps, or cross the Atrium over to my solid state amps, the performance suffers. The only amp currently in my stable that drives them both with aplomb is the rare DNA Stratus. Honestly it's rare any of my headphones doesn't sound their best on it for me. Just a beauty of an amp from all perspectives. Power and tube euphony all in one package, its my end game amp. Unfortunately it's at home and i do most of my listening at work, hence having smaller niche amps at work for each driver type (solid state for planars and OTC tubes for dynamics).

 

[JackarlTwo]

For purely instrumental music (jazz and classical) I like the Verite open more than the Atrium open (although I love them both). For music with vocals (rock, blues, folk), I prefer the Atrium and would also say the Atrium is the better all-arounder. But for instrumentals, I just love the direct and meaty presentation of the Verite.

I really need to get my hands on a pair of VO. Seems to be a great complement to the Atrium. I guess there's a reason why they're co-flagships after all.

 

[orbilius]

Is anyone using their Atrium primarily with an OTL amp? I know I am likely going to get hit with a torrent of OTC amp recommendations as they're all the rage these days, but what about pure OTL?

I got a Schiit Valhalla V1 for a hot $150 shipped, and... I am just addicted to it with the Atrium. VC, not so much. But the Atrium....

I am happy with the Valhalla for that 6N1P/6N6P life, but what about something like the Woo Audio WA2 or Feliks Elise? Bottlehead Crack, even??

I use my AO with a Eufonika H5 OTL amp. The pairing is magic, but the AO still sounds great on solid state.

 

[goldwerger]

Is anyone using their Atrium primarily with an OTL amp? I know I am likely going to get hit with a torrent of OTC amp recommendations as they're all the rage these days, but what about pure OTL?

By chance, as I'm reading your question I'm listening to the AO on the Decware/ZMF Reference OTL. It's one of my all-time favorite combos. The AO sounds wonderful with no output transformer and damped just right on this amp (not sure/can't recall spec, but I'd say output impedance likely hovers aounrd 50 ohms, give or take 10-15).

Quick real-time snapshot..

 

[sparty09]

By chance, as I'm reading your question I'm listening to the AO on the Decware/ZMF Reference OTL. It's one of my all-time favorite combos. The AO sounds wonderful with no output transformer and damped just right on this amp (not sure/can't recall spec, but I'd say output impedance likely hovers aounrd 50 ohms, give or take 10-15).

Quick real-time snapshot..

Agree wholeheartedly. Was neglecting my full size setup as of late for IEM's but popped the AO on the ZMF OTL the other night and it brought the biggest smile to my face. Sometimes it's good to step away for a little bit then come back to the magic and appreciate how amazing they sound together.

 

[betula]

By chance, as I'm reading your question I'm listening to the AO on the Decware/ZMF Reference OTL. It's one of my all-time favorite combos. The AO sounds wonderful with no output transformer and damped just right on this amp (not sure/can't recall spec, but I'd say output impedance likely hovers aounrd 50 ohms, give or take 10-15).

Quick real-time snapshot..

What is the cable on your Atrium? Is it silver?

 

[goldwerger]

What is the cable on your Atrium? Is it silver?

It's Viking Weave ISA 8-core (OCC Silver, PVC dialectric). My favorite for my ZMF headphones.

 

[Luckyleo]

baseball8793 said:
how about the Abyss Joal--is the Atrium better?

Imo, oh yes! I like the MR more than the JOAL too (even if you removed the cost difference). MR sells used at a nice price.

I currently am enjoying both the Joal and the Atrium Open. To say that unequivocally one is better than the other seems simplified. They are both great headphones. Soundstage size, Timbre, Tuning, are noticiable differences (IMHO). In my use case they both have something great to offer. So for me, the answer is no, the Atrium is not better than the Joal. Just different. YMMV

 

[Rhodey]

baseball8793 said:
how about the Abyss Joal--is the Atrium better?


I currently am enjoying both the Joal and the Atrium Open. To say that unequivocally one is better than the other seems simplified. They are both great headphones. Soundstage size, Timbre, Tuning, are noticiable differences (IMHO). In my use case they both have something great to offer. So for me, the answer is no, the Atrium is not better than the Joal. Just different. YMMV

Yeah, you’re free to disagree. I’d take the MR over the JOAL if we’re speaking similar signature or planars. And I don’t feel the JOALs technicalities are up to the Atriums. Sure JOAL is solid but it’s in a tier below it IMO.

 

[francerex]

Yeah, you’re free to disagree. I’d take the MR over the JOAL if we’re speaking similar signature or planars. And I don’t feel the JOALs technicalities are up to the Atriums. Sure JOAL is solid but it’s in a tier below it IMO.

How old are your ears? Given your headphones list I assume that you might need brighter headphones to fully appreciate the highs, and that results in the difference in perception of the technicalities. If that is the case, of course you disagree

I am fairly young and I am very treble sensitive. For reference, I could not listen to HE 1000 V2 for more than 20 minutes, and could only listen to Utopia 2020 during the day (which made me sell them since I mostly listen to open backs in the evening). I basically cannot use any IEM, except for APP2. JOAL never ever ever give me any discomfort. I would describe them as the APP2 of wired headphones.

baseball8793 said:
how about the Abyss Joal--is the Atrium better?


I currently am enjoying both the Joal and the Atrium Open. To say that unequivocally one is better than the other seems simplified. They are both great headphones. Soundstage size, Timbre, Tuning, are noticiable differences (IMHO). In my use case they both have something great to offer. So for me, the answer is no, the Atrium is not better than the Joal. Just different. YMMV

Agree completely.

The JOAL are incredibly small, comfy and stay firm on my head. They are just perfect for those couch (even with my PS5) and bed sessions.

As far as the sound goes, the JOAL are intimate. The music is just there. The bass is beefier than the Atrium, which suits you a few genres better. Details are there but are never overwhelming and thrown to your face. The Atrium stage is much larger and has a better (imo) natural timbre and middles. I have still have not made my mind as to which one I prefer, I might never do and simply enjoy both!

As an extra comparison point, I would never travel with the Atrium, while the JOAL carrying case fits nicely in a carry-on trolley. I flew back home for Easter and I could throw JOAL, cable and Mojo in the carrying case for a damn nice portable setup.

 

[Rhodey]

How old are your ears? Given your headphones list I assume that you might need brighter headphones to fully appreciate the highs, and that results in the difference in perception of the technicalities. If that is the case, of course you disagree

I am fairly young and I am very treble sensitive. For reference, I could not listen to HE 1000 V2 for more than 20 minutes, and could only listen to Utopia 2020 during the day (which made me sell them since I mostly listen to open backs in the evening). I basically cannot use any IEM, except for APP2. JOAL never ever ever give me any discomfort. I would describe them as the APP2 of wired headphones.



Agree completely.

The JOAL are incredibly small, comfy and stay firm on my head. They are just perfect for those couch (even with my PS5) and bed sessions.

As far as the sound goes, the JOAL are intimate. The music is just there. The bass is beefier than the Atrium, which suits you a few genres better. Details are there but are never overwhelming and thrown to your face. The Atrium stage is much larger and has a better (imo) natural timbre and middles. I have still have not made my mind as to which one I prefer, I might never do and simply enjoy both!

As an extra comparison point, I would never travel with the Atrium, while the JOAL carrying case fits nicely in a carry-on trolley. I flew back home for Easter and I could throw JOAL, cable and Mojo in the carrying case for a damn nice portable setup.

With all due respect, this basically made no sense lol.

First, brighter headphones don’t mean better technicalities. Thats like saying the DT1990 is more detailed and had better technicalities than the Atrium, D8000, Meze elite, Focal Clear (or Elex), etc. because it’s brighter. FWIW, wasn’t a fan of the DT1990 at all, it was grainy, and too bright for me.
Similarly, I owned the HEKse and felt it was too bright. After using it for a bit my ears hurt due to the upper FR. Never felt it was a Sus replacement as some try to do. I’m happy for them, I couldn’t get there.
And if I had old ears (which I don’t, I’m in my 30s) I would want brighter headphones because brighter headphones wouldn’t bother me in the upper FR . This is why many older folks like the HEK, HD800, etc. (most of the time, but not all older folks have bad hearing loss, no gross generalizations here).
And I own the 800S and like it, but mostly just on tubes. And not that it’s too much off SS, I just think it’s better off tubes. Synergy!
And what you mean by “given your headphone list”…? I’ve owned a lot of headphones, DACs, and amps (see my profile for a list of what I’ve owned in the past) and it’s not about just your headphones, it’s about the chain around it. For example, you mentioned the Utopia 2020. Well I agree here, it’s brighter and while I could listen to it for a decent amount of time, it would depend on the genre of music and the chain. I felt the Utopia 2022 was an improvement to my ears (better low end, smoother mids and highs, and it felt slightly more detailed in some ways). Again, this would be the opposite if I had older ears. And again, it’s the chain around it. I really only enjoyed the Utopia (OG or 22) off tubes (DNA Stellaris was my favorite), and it’ll really depends on what tube amp (didn’t enjoy it as much off the Envy or AIC10). The Utopia is a picky headphone, the 22 is less so but still picky.

Do you think the Susvara is bright? Maybe off certain chains or maybe when compared to a much warmer darker headphone but they’re basically neutral. And 1266 isn’t bright either off the right chain.

And never mentioned comfort being an issue with the JOAL. I actually love the Diana series fit and comfort (V2 with newer headband version, JOAL, MR and DZ). Additionally, I don’t dislike the JOAL. For the price it’s a solid headphone, but the MR is better for me and I think it’s just better all around. And it should be, it’s the next step up in their lineup. If the MR didn’t exist I’d say yes the JOAL is amazing and prob would still own it, but when you can pick up a used MR for around 1.5-1.7k on the used market, it’s a no brainer to me. Abyss prices are a bit higher than competitors when you’re strictly comparing SQ, but when you throw in the build quality and US made, I get it. I’d still buy them used tho.
And I tried the JOAL off the Woo tube mini, Mojo 2, element 4 boosted, AiC10, and still felt I had a better experience with the MR.
And to bring this back to the Atrium, I think the MR and Atrium are closer in their respective tiers (planar and dynamics) than the JOAL. This really comes down to tuning for me but still having enough detail and being engaging to listen to.

Oh and I don’t EQ… I say fix your chain or try a different headphone

 

[francerex]

With all due respect, this basically made no sense lol.

First, brighter headphones don’t mean better technicalities. Thats like saying the DT1990 is more detailed and had better technicalities than the Atrium, D8000, Meze elite, Focal Clear (or Elex), etc. because it’s brighter. FWIW, wasn’t a fan of the DT1990 at all, it was grainy, and too bright for me.
Similarly, I owned the HEKse and felt it was too bright. After using it for a bit my ears hurt due to the upper FR. Never felt it was a Sus replacement as some try to do. I’m happy for them, I couldn’t get there.
And if I had old ears (which I don’t, I’m in my 30s) I would want brighter headphones because brighter headphones wouldn’t bother me in the upper FR . This is why many older folks like the HEK, HD800, etc. (most of the time, but not all older folks have bad hearing loss, no gross generalizations here).
And I own the 800S and like it, but mostly just on tubes. And not that it’s too much off SS, I just think it’s better off tubes. Synergy!
And what you mean by “given your headphone list”…? I’ve owned a lot of headphones, DACs, and amps (see my profile for a list of what I’ve owned in the past) and it’s not about just your headphones, it’s about the chain around it. For example, you mentioned the Utopia 2020. Well I agree here, it’s brighter and while I could listen to it for a decent amount of time, it would depend on the genre of music and the chain. I felt the Utopia 2022 was an improvement to my ears (better low end, smoother mids and highs, and it felt slightly more detailed in some ways). Again, this would be the opposite if I had older ears. And again, it’s the chain around it. I really only enjoyed the Utopia (OG or 22) off tubes (DNA Stellaris was my favorite), and it’ll really depends on what tube amp (didn’t enjoy it as much off the Envy or AIC10). The Utopia is a picky headphone, the 22 is less so but still picky.

Do you think the Susvara is bright? Maybe off certain chains or maybe when compared to a much warmer darker headphone but they’re basically neutral. And 1266 isn’t bright either off the right chain.

And never mentioned comfort being an issue with the JOAL. I actually love the Diana series fit and comfort (V2 with newer headband version, JOAL, MR and DZ). Additionally, I don’t dislike the JOAL. For the price it’s a solid headphone, but the MR is better for me and I think it’s just better all around. And it should be, it’s the next step up in their lineup. If the MR didn’t exist I’d say yes the JOAL is amazing and prob would still own it, but when you can pick up a used MR for around 1.5-1.7k on the used market, it’s a no brainer to me. Abyss prices are a bit higher than competitors when you’re strictly comparing SQ, but when you throw in the build quality and US made, I get it. I’d still buy them used tho.
And I tried the JOAL off the Woo tube mini, Mojo 2, element 4 boosted, AiC10, and still felt I had a better experience with the MR.
And to bring this back to the Atrium, I think the MR and Atrium are closer in their respective tiers (planar and dynamics) than the JOAL. This really comes down to tuning for me but still having enough detail and being engaging to listen to.

Oh and I don’t EQ… I say fix your chain or try a different headphone

As I said, I was just making assumptions without knowing you. Not sure what does not make sense? My reasoning is quite simple and linear:
Earing loss >>> less hearing at higher frequencies >>> loss of high frequency sounds >>> possible lower perceived technicality. The latter is a broader term so it also depends a lot on your definition.

That said while I can agree partly to the rest of your lengthy post, you lost me at the chain sinergy and at the higher price = better headphones. Agree to disagree

PS would you please describe in detail why MR and Atrium are better? till now you just used empty words that could mean anything really.

 

[Rhodey]

As I said, I was just making assumptions without knowing you. Not sure what does not make sense? My reasoning is quite simple and linear:
Earing loss >>> less hearing at higher frequencies >>> loss of high frequency sounds >>> possible lower perceived technicality. The latter is a broader term so it also depends a lot on your definition.

That said while I can agree partly to the rest of your lengthy post, you lost me at the chain sinergy and at the higher price = better headphones. Agree to disagree

You looked at my headphone list and assumed I was older because I had a Susvara and 1266, while completely ignoring the senns and the fact I like the Atrium and MR more than the JOAL. And how does preferring the Atrium or MR over the JOAL lead to this conclusion? Thats where the confusion is haha.

Atrium, MR, and JOAL are all warmer headphones. It’s not as if the Atrium or MR are bright and the JOAL leans warm-dark so I need the Atrium or MR to hear the details in the upper FR. This is just odd to me.

Synergy is real. If you don’t know that then I don’t know what to tell you. Guess you have more to learn?

Never said higher price means better. I’d pick the HD650 over many other headphones but it’ll depend on the chain. Again, synergy. Ive also picked cheaper amps and dacs over more expensive ones. Price isn’t always an indicator.
However, you think Abyss would make the JOAL better than the MR and undercut themselves? Silly! The JOAL is basically a cheaper version of the MR with some tweaks. They saw the success the MR had and found ways to make it more affordable. Nothing wrong with that but they’re not going to undercut themselves.

 

[TechNICKal]

That's totally preference based. The Joal is a planar magnetic driver vs the dynamic driver in the Atrium. The Joal is fast, precise, revealing, and resolving. Transients are very fast, with fast decay, like most planars. The fast decay takes some of the note weight away, leaving it thinner sounding than if it's decay were longer. The Atrium and it's biocellulose drivers is warm, smooth, euphonic, and moderate in speed. It trades in technical prowess for musicality. Bass is fuller and more prominent. The moderate decay gives the Atrium a wonderful weighty/dense response. Mids are smooth and dynamic. It's an easy listening headphone with a ton of musicality and engagement. They make better compliments to each other than competitors, as anyone looking at them would have to know what they want most. Are they looking for speed and resolution? Or are they looking for musicality and euphony? Those preferences will dictate which is better for the each individual. There is no blanket better to apply to all users. I personally like the Atrium far more than the Joal, especially on tubes. It just matches me best. The question is, what matches YOU best?

Good description, this is my interpretation too when comparing both, only with the Atrium Closed.

I reach for them for different reasons though. If I want the thick, smooth, musical sound when I’m really listening.. I’ll reach for the Atrium. If I’m going to be wearing for them for a few hours and want something really light and comfy for background music while I’m working, or for gaming, I’ll reach for the JOAL. I think they compliment each other really well.

 

[veggiemight]

Acquired a matching stand for my atrium.
Also acquired the be2 perforated suede pads and my god it’s like a match made in heaven. Absolute perfection across the whole frequency response for my personal HRTF.

On an adjacent note, I’m potentially looking to upgrade my source gear to help really maximize my Atrium. I’m running it off XLR on my xduoo ta 22 tube hybrid dac pre amp + 12au7 mullard long nos tubes. It sounds phenomenal but people claim that ZMFs really sing on OTLs. Anybody have any OTLs they’d recommend that can take my atrium to the next level from what I’m using right now? I would also prefer to not break the bank, maybe something under $400-$500. Thanks in advance