Yamaha goes 11.2 with new receiver.
Aug 10, 2007 at 8:35 PM Post #31 of 62

virometal

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Quote:

Originally Posted by ooheadsoo /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Anyway, 2 subs, 2 separate lfe channels, doesn't mean that the content on each channel will be all that different.


Well if it's dual stereo (post #20), they shouldn't be different. And good point! Two is always better than one. Who wouldn't want two subs.

Quote:

Originally Posted by SilverTrumpet999
the last thing we need is ANOTHER format war!


Sorry, I just don't think that's something that valid to complain about where a receiver is concerned. In fact, I wonder what you're talking about. Are you mixing up media compression codec's with Yamaha's proprietary signal processing?

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On that point, if you suspend your outrage for a second, you'll notice the basic configuration is plain Jane 7.1 with the addition of "presence" channels.

Now, just what do those presence channels do? Why isn't anyone talking about that?

By their placement near the ceiling, it's as if they're almost an extension, another woofer if you like, added to L/R, and SBL/SBR. Maybe Yamaha has learned a thing or two from their soundbars and are going to use those additional speakers as reflection projectors. They are placed near the corners of the ceiling. They already have experience in auto equalizer set-ups akin to Audissey XT. Considering that experience, it could be something pretty special. Imagine a helicopter, not just to the back right, but overhead as well!

Am I nuts? Don't answer that.
wink.gif
Anyone want to shed some light or take a stab at the function of the presence channels?
 
Aug 10, 2007 at 9:14 PM Post #32 of 62

ooheadsoo

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I doubt the presence channels will be that fancy. That's a heck of a lot of sound engineering just for the home video market.
 
Aug 10, 2007 at 10:24 PM Post #33 of 62

Listen2this1

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This idea has been on the way for a while. You do not need to have the 7.1 signal to listen to it on a 7.1 speaker configuration Denon has been doing a simulated 9.1 for a while now on their higher end Recievers. I own one of their pieces that will allow me to have 9 speakers hooked up, and the Audyssey will time, phase and level each speaker. If the Yamaha is using the same Audyssey setup I believe that it will act the same way. I would like to see all multi channel amps have the option of using the un-used channels for different applications. Since I only have 5.1 Denon allows me to take the surround back channels and tell the reciever to send the power to tht fronts, which allow me to bi-amp the fronts, great feature.
 
Aug 10, 2007 at 10:40 PM Post #34 of 62

virometal

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Listen2this1 /img/forum/go_quote.gif
This idea has been on the way for a while. You do not need to have the 7.1 signal to listen to it on a 7.1 speaker configuration


That goes without saying. I hope everyone in this thread knows that. C'mon we aren't idiots here (well maybe I am). Someone really tell me something.
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Oh I use Audyssey with a Denon btw; love it.
 
Aug 11, 2007 at 1:58 PM Post #36 of 62

rsaavedra

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image_preview



Honestly, all those speakers for a Home Theater room with just one chair?...


I wonder if there will ever be a DVD that includes a binaureal recording of its multichannel sound. That would allow for a truly immersive soundfield. The receiver could just drive a bunch of headphones plus the subwoofer(s), and you could hardly get any more immersive than that.

A binaural+headphone-based home theater in my opinion is less weird than so many speakers for an attempt to achieve "immersive soundfields", particularly if it's for just for one chair, or in any case, a very small sweet spot.
 
Aug 12, 2007 at 7:37 PM Post #37 of 62

Prozakk

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The presence speakers are a basicly derrived from such:

Front: combination of front L/R and side surround L/R (left from left, right from right)
Rear: combination of side surround L/R and rear surround L/R (left from left, right from right)

Much in the way that the original Dolby Prologic made a center channel from the L/R stereo channels.

The auto calibration features of receivers are very good, but they should be checked manually to make sure errors did not occur (some things like mic direction, noises in the room during set-up, humans in the room, ceiling fans moving can throw it off). Newer, standalone (and in the future, built-in) eq's can/will/do have multiple room sweetspots calibrated.
 
Aug 13, 2007 at 12:28 AM Post #38 of 62

virometal

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From i4u.com:

"The 11.2 channel amp uses Yamaha’s proprietary cinema DSP HD3 processing which uses the front and read speakers’ algorithms to achieve 3-D surround sound height realism. It sounds to me that would mean you could hear for (correction) instance if a helicopter in a movie was above you to the right or left as rather than simply left or right."

I hadn't read that before post #34. I swears!
 
Aug 13, 2007 at 12:43 AM Post #39 of 62

Prozakk

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Quote:

Originally Posted by virometal /img/forum/go_quote.gif
From i4u.com:

"The 11.2 channel amp uses Yamaha’s proprietary cinema DSP HD3 processing which uses the front and read speakers’ algorithms to achieve 3-D surround sound height realism. It sounds to me that would mean you could hear for (correction) instance if a helicopter in a movie was above you to the right or left as rather than simply left or right."

I hadn't read that before post #34. I swears!



Which is derrived as I said in my last post, along with mounting said speakers near the ceiling.
 
Aug 13, 2007 at 1:18 AM Post #40 of 62

Denim

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I haven't listened to this setup, so Im not knocking it or promoting it either. (Just an observation or two)

It appears from the drawing that the mains and Surround L/R and full range speakers. Yet the back surrounds and bookshelf style. (As are the remaining presence speakers.) The L/R Surrounds are in the same spot the rears would be in a 5.1 setup. It's as if the drawing shows that you can take an existing 5.1 and upgrade to 11.2 by using smaller speakers (except for the sub). Seems like Sales & Marketing may have overrulled Engineering to promote the upgrade easier.

Based on the size, I am guessing that the L/R Surrounds are fed more info than the other rear speakers. Or it's more critical to the listening experience. Either way, I look at the drawing and think that the side walls need two more speakers. I'm surprised that this arrangement is superior to having 4 speakers on the side walls and 2 on the rear wall. I can accept the Presence on the front wall as an improvement, but somehow don't see the need for 4 speakers on a narrow back wall when you have a greater length side wall with only 2 speakers.

Anyone that knows their Home Theater stuff, enlighten me.
tongue.gif
 
Aug 13, 2007 at 1:24 AM Post #41 of 62

Prozakk

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Denim /img/forum/go_quote.gif
I haven't listened to this setup, so Im not knocking it or promoting it either. (Just an observation or two)

It appears from the drawing that the mains and Surround L/R and full range speakers. Yet the back surrounds and bookshelf style. (As are the remaining presence speakers.) The L/R Surrounds are in the same spot the rears would be in a 5.1 setup. It's as if the drawing shows that you can take an existing 5.1 and upgrade to 11.2 by using smaller speakers (except for the sub). Seems like Sales & Marketing may have overrulled Engineering to promote the upgrade easier.

Based on the size, I am guessing that the L/R Surrounds are fed more info than the other rear speakers. Or it's more critical to the listening experience. Either way, I look at the drawing and think that the side walls need two more speakers. I'm surprised that this arrangement is superior to having 4 speakers on the side walls and 2 on the rear wall. I can accept the Presence on the front wall as an improvement, but somehow don't see the need for 4 speakers on a narrow back wall when you have a greater length side wall with only 2 speakers.

Anyone that knows their Home Theater stuff, enlighten me.
tongue.gif



Dolby/DTS 5.1 recordings have 5 recorded, dedicated full-range channels, plus a dedicated LFE sub channel. The remainder of the channels, no matter how many, are derrived from summing/processing of the recorded channels. Ever seen a 6.1/7.1 etc. recorded dvd? I haven't.
 
Aug 13, 2007 at 1:31 AM Post #42 of 62

Denim

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Prozakk /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Dolby/DTS 5.1 recordings have 5 recorded, dedicated full-range channels, plus a dedicated LFE sub channel. The remainder of the channels, no matter how many, are derrived from summing/processing of the recorded channels. Ever seen a 6.1/7.1 etc. recorded dvd? I haven't.


So that's why they used smaller speakers at every location that wasn't in the original 5.1 spec? OK, I guess I can see that.

I still think the side walls need more speakers.
 
Aug 13, 2007 at 1:35 AM Post #43 of 62

xnothingpoetic

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So how many movies do you know that are recoded in 11.2?

Or even 7.1?
 
Aug 13, 2007 at 2:00 AM Post #45 of 62

Denim

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Quote:

Originally Posted by xnothingpoetic /img/forum/go_quote.gif
So how many movies do you know that are recoded in 11.2?

Or even 7.1?



All I know of is 5.1. And I don't know if anything else is in the works. I'm happy with my 5.1 setup and don't see a need to "upgrade" to 11.2 or anything else. But I look at the setups and questions come to mind.
 

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