XMOS XU208 USB BRIDGES - THE LATEST GEN HAS ARRIVED!
May 7, 2016 at 4:15 AM Post #1,261 of 3,865

Hi Gordon,

recognized this one before but decided to go for the F-1 because of the galvanic isolation design. We recognized with different setups and technology like LWL or cat that this is one key in sq, did'nt we.

F-1 is playing here since yesterday and effects are comparable to other setups I have had but much better. Orientation grows with the clearer bass structure provided and depth of the stage wins enourmous in distinct details of every instrument. As some have already said, it is like there is room added to every single instrument. Missing noise ends up with less irritation and the clearity helps our brain to get a much better picture of single instruments or voices and live music scenarios.

Great fun to listen and there is room for improvement feeding battery power etc. etc.

Take care
Thomas
 
May 7, 2016 at 4:18 AM Post #1,262 of 3,865
But for those considering the $483 PUC2 Lite (based on 10  yr old tech - right prot?) - how about a dollar of dollar comparison say a couple of choices:
 
2) F-1($179) + a iFi USB 3.0 nano($200)+DC iPurifier ($100)
or
3)F-1($179) + iPurifier2($100)+DC iPurifer($100) and save $100

 
Where would you use DC iPurifer when iPurifier2 doesn't need power and iFi USB 3.0 nano comes bundled with a iPower 9V?
 
May 7, 2016 at 6:29 AM Post #1,264 of 3,865
 
Cool, good info thanks for that... my concern at the moment is the Intona really does sound great and changing to USB>LAN might not achieve anything for me, but I do get that it might be a shade better due to the robustness of tcp/ip. It's a shame that rb2013 hasn't mbeen able to do this comparison but it's not right to expect him to have tried every permutation for our benefit - he's already gone the extra mile and then some in that respect = thanks again.
 
I would say that my current system sounds like a huge dollop of 3D crystalline gel (double cream that you can see through), but utterly controlled = for me, the holy grail sonic combo and one that I've searched for, for 20 years.
 
So, if it ain't broken don't fix it... or carry on the search by trying F-1 and USB>LAN???
 
:wink:

Also using a Intona in my F1 chain and really pleased with the SQ.
Think I´ll be happy for a while but keep watching this thread.
Maybe upgrade my speakers instead :)
 
May 7, 2016 at 7:13 AM Post #1,265 of 3,865
Hi !   sorry to jump in and if i have missed previous posts  ...  are you using the PUC2 Lite version or the other ?
with a usb external power supply maybe ? which one ?
Thanks and regards,  gino

The original Puc2 full edition. Ebay score for about €200 .. second hard and pre-burnedin for years, it can hardly get better than that :D
I sometimes use a LiPo battery as usb power .. very stable & clean power for about €20 (e.g. on amazon https://www.amazon.co.uk/RAVPower-16750mAh-Portable-External-Technology-Black-y/dp/B00OJXVDAU). Dont know if it makes an SQ diff and dont care .. just had it around the house. And the puc sounds excellent from the laptop Usb power with the included cables .. no need for any usb drama.
 
May 7, 2016 at 7:45 AM Post #1,266 of 3,865
 
The original Puc2 full edition.   Ebay score for about €200 .. second hard and pre-burnedin for years, it can hardly get better than that
biggrin.gif

I sometimes use a LiPo battery as usb power .. very stable & clean power for about €20 (e.g. on amazon https://www.amazon.co.uk/RAVPower-16750mAh-Portable-External-Technology-Black-y/dp/B00OJXVDAU). Dont know if it makes an SQ diff and dont care .. just had it around the house.   And the puc sounds excellent from the laptop Usb power with the included cables .. no need for any usb drama.

 
Hi thanks a lot for the kind and interesting reply.   Yes.  200 Euro is a very good price.  A guy here is asking 350.
Last question ... are you using its AES/EBU digital out or the XLR analog outs ? 
just to understand the quality of the internal clock circuit.
Regards,  gino
 
May 7, 2016 at 7:45 AM Post #1,267 of 3,865
I've sent these guys a message telling them that they must consider releasing a DC version so that people can use their own LPS, be interesting to see what the response is:
 
2016 Singxer SU-1 USB digital interface with XMOS XU208
 
... that box that makes quite a bit of sense to me but I would deffo want to use an external 'posh' LPS with it.I like Swagman Labs SE edition LPS's, they use top end parts.
 
:wink:
 
May 7, 2016 at 7:48 AM Post #1,268 of 3,865
  Also using a Intona in my F1 chain and really pleased with the SQ.
Think I´ll be happy for a while but keep watching this thread.
Maybe upgrade my speakers instead :)


Cool, bet that sounds v good... all I would say is use a good LPS with everything that accepts one, it often makes quite a big difference.
 
 
:wink:
 
May 7, 2016 at 7:59 AM Post #1,269 of 3,865
I've sent these guys a message telling them that they must consider releasing a DC version so that people can use their own LPS, be interesting to see what the response is:
2016 Singxer SU-1 USB digital interface with XMOS XU208
... that box that makes quite a bit of sense to me but I would deffo want to use an external 'posh' LPS with it.I like Swagman Labs SE edition LPS's, they use top end parts.
:wink:

 
Hi !  very smart idea.   They have no much to do by the way.   Just a connection with a suitable point on the board and a new dc socket on the rear panel. 
They could even provide the double option ... from the main or from a new dc socket. 
In general the idea to have the mains transformer out of the box is very very smart.  Very.
The quality of the power supply is of paramount importance in this case. I guess.
Bye,  gino
 
May 7, 2016 at 8:05 AM Post #1,270 of 3,865
Thanks - here is the SiTime Whitepaper on Jitter and Phase Noise - they are not the same thing.  Measured in different ways.  Phase noise measures are quoted in decibels not ps.  The guy who wrote that doesn't know much.  And there is more then one kind of jitter.

http://www.sitime.com/support2/documents/AN10007-Jitter-and-measurement.pdf
As you can see from figure 6. on page 8 - Phase Noise Plot

TXCO and OXCO clock manufacturers Like NDK and Crystek quote all Phase Noise in decibels.




Crystek CCHD-957 Datasheet:
http://www.crystek.com/crystal/spec-sheets/clock/cchd-957.pdf


In think you might have a point, but let me tell you my own understanding.

I think that both quantities are related, and that is what your paper says. 0 phase noise means 0 jitter and vice versa. But the chart in db/hz is interesting in that it characterizes the energy distribution over the frequency domain and tells you how that noise will affect the sound. Still, if jitter is miniscule, its energy distribution will not matter because you will not hear any sound degradation.

The phase noise is assumed to have gaussian distribution, meaning its peak value is around 7 times the stated global figure, which is a standard deviation. Again, the db/hz distribution indicates the frequency contents of noise plus the carrier. By integrating this chart, you get a global figure for phase noise and jitter. If everything is normal in the statistical sense, low jitter will translate into a satisfying frequency distribution graph.

In my understanding, you are right somehow in the sense that the low frequency contents could still be significant, for instance let's say -90db at 20hz. In an audio signal, it will translate into a degradation of the bass.

For audio transmission over usb, does the low frequency part of phase noise (and the rest of the noise, by the way) matter? Probably because asynch usb has no error correction (just transmission speed adjustments determined by the receiver) and jitter in the input means jitter in the output. In case of a ddc, it means jitter in the signal to the dac. But to dig deeper, that speed adjustment thing will create ponctual jitter in itself. So the ddc has to reclock the data because it will have high jitter anyway. So we are led to considerations like how does that the overall gaussian jitter affect the ability of the ddc to output a jitter-free signal. I can't answer that question.

But i believe asynch usb to transmit audio in not the best protocol for sure. It is just convenient, It seems very hard to decode the signal to obtain a jitter free output to the dac. And it prone to signal contamination.

In any case, i should get an f-1 board soon. In really like the overall design of this ddc. The fact that both the receiving and transmitting part are well isolated from each other and that they each have their own xmos processor.
 
May 7, 2016 at 8:25 AM Post #1,271 of 3,865
Hi thanks a lot for the kind and interesting reply.   Yes.  200 Euro is a very good price.  A guy here is asking 350.
Last question ... are you using its AES/EBU digital out or the XLR analog outs ? 
just to understand the quality of the internal clock circuit.
Regards,  gino

http://www.euphonia-audioforum.se/forums/index.php?showtopic=8273&hl=Yellowtec
Use google translate or just check the many pics of the internals. I only tested the Dac & analog out briefly and it's actually good. Around 2008-9 when it was released it was compared with the Benchmark1 Dac.
$300-350 is a good price, especially if you plan to use all its studio features.

sbgk
Dont get your hopes up :). I just use 'preschooler' to call anyone who wants to keep their brain in a pre-school state. Most kindergarten seniors already know that a ruler always 'knows' better than your eyes. But many so called audiophiles just wont 'believe' that an osciloscope knows better than their ears in the exact same way. And a lot of that "my dac is better than yours" siliness is not much more than the childish "my older brother can beat yours".
Oh well, it's a beatiful beach day here and hopefully everywhere.
 
May 7, 2016 at 8:49 AM Post #1,272 of 3,865
http://www.euphonia-audioforum.se/forums/index.php?showtopic=8273&hl=Yellowtec
Use google translate or just check the many pics of the internals. I only tested the Dac & analog out briefly and it's actually good. Around 2008-9 when it was released it was compared with the Benchmark1 Dac.
$300-350 is a good price, especially if you plan to use all its studio features.

@sbgk
Dont get your hopes up
smily_headphones1.gif
. I just use 'preschooler' to call anyone who wants to keep their brain in a pre-school state. Most kindergarten 'seniors' already know that a ruler always 'knows' better than your eyes. But many 'audiophiles' just wont 'believe' that an osciloscope knows better than their ears in the exact same way. And a lot of that "my dac is better than yours" siliness is not much more than the childish "my older brother can beat yours".
Oh well, it's a beatiful beach day here and hopefully everywhere.

 
Thanks a lot again for the very interesting information
Actually I was looking indeed for a usb to AES/EBU converter and this was very high on the most wanted units list
The Mutec MC-3 + USB  unit is also very very nice but at least twice the cost.  But it is very nice indeed.
But then i made a side move .. i bought a Tascam uh-7000
Maybe i made a mistake.
i am still thinking what way to go
Thanks a lot again,  gino
P.S.  yes ... a wonderful day.  Maybe too much.  
rolleyes.gif

 
May 7, 2016 at 9:28 AM Post #1,273 of 3,865
  Sadly, if he were born today he wouldn't even make it onto the Tonight Show because no-one cares about opera plus; no Tonight Show:frowning2:   Sigh.
 
 Back to background music break-in with the F-1.  Only 100 more hours to go...   Listen; neither converter is safely in the bulletproof limousine under the hotel... yet...  
 
 
Wait a minute--- Did you just INSULT my 70 dollar Teradak!!???    NOBODY puts baby in a corner! 
 


I have one!  Except I swapped out the caps for Nichcon HW in the X1 - running in my office system feeding the Regen.  The larger R-Core DC 30W are much better plus adding the DC iPurifier really helped.  BTW both are using the Cerious Tech Graphene Extreme Red power cords - that alone doubles thier performance - really remarkable power cords.
 
X1/X2  with Nichicons:

 
DC-30W

 
May 7, 2016 at 9:36 AM Post #1,274 of 3,865
  Congratulations on this great thread. If you are a USB fanatic and a DIY type then this is paradise.
 
I'm planning on ordering the F-1 this weekend. For some time I have been feeling that my trusty Audiophilleo is getting a bit outdated.
 
One thing, is there a FAQ for this with links to drivers and the various enclosures and power ideas?

Not that I'm aware of - just the 1000+ pages of this thread!
 
 
Cool, good info thanks for that... my concern at the moment is the Intona really does sound great and changing to USB>LAN might not achieve anything for me, but I do get that it might be a shade better due to the robustness of tcp/ip. It's a shame that rb2013 hasn't mbeen able to do this comparison but it's not right to expect him to have tried every permutation for our benefit - he's already gone the extra mile and then some in that respect = thanks again.
 
I would say that my current system sounds like a huge dollop of 3D crystalline gel (double cream that you can see through), but utterly controlled = for me, the holy grail sonic combo and one that I've searched for, for 20 years.
 
So, if it ain't broken don't fix it... or carry on the search by trying F-1 and USB>LAN???
 
:wink:

Thanks!  I never bought the Intona (mainly the issues @Superdad raised) but liked the idea of galvanic isolation.  Just waiting for the Uber Regen from Uptone or a second gen of the Intona.  Now I hear JCAT has one coming!  Yes a USB GI.  But when I heard Paul's LANRover Youtube that really had me intrigued...now more so reading @Superdad's post on the AOIP solution they were working on.  I have to say this ICRON/Regen did payoff HUGE!
 
  time to start a XU216 thread, what do you think of this ?
 
http://www.diyinhk.com/shop/audio-kits/107-xmos-dsd-dxd-768khz-high-quality-usb-to-i2sdsd-pcb.html#/xmos_option-xmos_768k_and_oled_0_96_pcb

Wondering if the upcoming next gen of DIYinHK  DXIO Pro4a will have the XU216 or the XU208?  I'm in line for one of the first ones off the production line.  I really don't see the big advantage - the 1000MIPS XU208 should be more then enough - twice the processing power of the U-8.  As for 768khz - who cares
 

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