[Lightspeed12]

Regarding Signature — there is indeed channel imbalance at lower volume levels, by design … due to the analogue volume attenuator pot they are using… but it goes away around the 11 o’clock mark on my unit.

People who say there isn’t — just check with a decibel meter, it’s there for sure. Even iFi has a support article that advises to use the “working” volume range being 12 o’clock - 15:00 or so.

Adjusting volume on phone (at least an iPhone) doesn’t do anything actually when the Signature is connected, since the Signature takes over the volume control, not sure if it’s different on Android @JoshG1217.

With regards to IEMs… I would probably recommend you get the Gryphon, with Signature you are more likely run into channel imbalance issues unless you use ECO mode and IE Match (ie you would need to get your volume pot to be north of 11 o’clock or so to avoid channel imbalance).

Gryphon uses digital volume control (similar to xDSD), as opposed to an analog attenuator, so there are no concerns or issues with channel imbalance at lowest volume levels.

And yes, I have both the Signature and Gryphon on hand and find uses for both of them. Using the Signature for when I am sitting down, and Gryphon for pretty much everything else.

I would agree with @JoshG1217 that Signature does sound better, but in my case I only really notice it with my harder to drive headphones (eg HD600, HE1000) as they seem to open up more than on the Gryphon.

Channel imbalance is the only thing im worried about because i like listening to my iems at low sound levels most of the time.

 

[Verificateur]

Channel imbalance is the only thing im worried about because i like listening to my iems at low sound levels most of the time.

Signature offers 3 gain modes and IE match, chances are you can find a mode that works for your IEM where your working volume range will be > 11 o’clock.
For this, you would likely need to be on ECO gain mode and enable IE Match (High/Ultra). IE Match accomplishes what it does by changing the output impedance. I personally am not completely sold that IE Match doesn’t affect the sound in any way, as iFi seems to suggest. Not sure…

If it’s useful to you — I just tried Signature on ECO mode with IE Match High with JVC FDX1 and Shouer S12 and it sounded great, and I got a working volume range that was well past the channel imbalance point.

iFi Gryphon utilizes digital-volume control so channel-imbalance is a non issue, but it does have a different sound signature. Gryphon is more neutral/clean than the slightly warm Signature, to my ears.

 

[JoshG1217]

So it has significant sound over the Gryphon ?

It does. Pretty significant improvement with the signature. There is channel imbalance, but with android, you can still control volume, and you can also use eco mode. I actually used the regular mode for my z1r and would turn the volume up pretty much all the way on sig to. Maximize power putput and than have it down super low on my phone.

 

[electronicsdesign]

Thanks for your advice, I plan on either buying the gryphon or signature which I mainly want to use with my astell&kern sp1000m dap & sometimes my phone.
The only thing that worries me about the signature is the low listening problems & channel imbalance problems when using iems. Thanks.

It depends on how you want to connect your phone and the Astell&Kern SP1000M DAP to the DAC.
I maintain my opinion that the USB connector might prove problematic in this regard on the Signature, especially given you don't have the BT alternative.

Personally, when I use with phone, I always use Bluetooth.
Never used a DAC without Bluetooth with phone, despite I do have some that do not have BT (from other manufacturers).
However, the Gryphon is easier to connect to a phone/DAP even on USB and it even comes with cables in the box in that regard (very short ones).

The Signature, given the analog potentiometer, will indeed have imbalance. It's something unavoidable if analog potentiometer is used.

I think it's best that you listen to both devices to hear how they sound if you're still undecided.
Eventually buy both of them and return the one you don't like if you can't go in a showroom to listen to both.
I personally see the Signature more as a desktop DAC, while the Gryphon more of a combo unit, which can be used both as desktop and as portable.
Also consider the iDSD Signature is significantly bigger than the Gryphon (picture attached): in my opinion enough to not fit in a pocket especially with a cable.

 

[Lightspeed12]

Thanks for the replies, very much appreciated.
Since I will have to buy without getting the opportunity to hear these & returning them is not an option over here in Australia unless there's a fault i will have to take the plunge.lol
Since I get great sound on the go now from utws5 or qudelix 5k from my phone the best most enjoyable sound quality is what I will be chasing while immobile in the caravan or home & also i will be buying the ier-z1r sometime soon. I don't have a dac/amp of any kind at home & have also never heard one.
I am new to the audio world my iems consist of the sony ier-m9, Sennheiser ie600, ie300 & Shure846 for now. So maybe I should go for the signature. Thanks again.

 

[electronicsdesign]

Given you already have the UTWS5 and Qudelix 5k, then yes I would agree going with the Signature may make more sense.
The Qudelix is far more portable than any of the 2 iFi ones, so you can use that one in combination with the Fiio for maximum portability.

Advantage of the Signature is the alleged better sound (but this will come down to preference of more warm or more netural) and
the fact that you will have a lot of power reserve for almost any over-ear headphones that you may buy in the future.
For IEMs, there's no doubt power is a lot more than you actually need.

It is unfortunate that you can't listen to the devices nor return them, but it is what it is.

 

[Lightspeed12]

Given you already have the UTWS5 and Qudelix 5k, then yes I would agree going with the Signature may make more sense.
The Qudelix is far more portable than any of the 2 iFi ones, so you can use that one in combination with the Fiio for maximum portability.

Advantage of the Signature is the alleged better sound (but this will come down to preference of more warm or more netural) and
the fact that you will have a lot of power reserve for almost any over-ear headphones that you may buy in the future.
For IEMs, there's no doubt power is a lot more than you actually need.

It is unfortunate that you can't listen to the devices nor return them, but it is what it is.

Another problem is i Don't know what the difference is between warm & neutral. I thought they would be pretty much the same.
I enjoy absolute clarity. Bass & opening up the sound stage tweaks are good to have for something different. Really confusing this decision.
Have they sorted the volume problem they were having with the Gryphon yet as I am up to the pages where it has become a problem.
Thanks again.

 

[Johnfg465vd]

@Lightspeed12 for your use case, I'll recommend Signature too. I've got both. Like other users, I never found the channel imbalance an issue with IEM's. With the 3 power modes and IEMatch, pairing sensitive gear is not an issue.

Signatures sounds better to me but it's not a big difference unless you are trying to power hard to drive Headphones. Gryphon is super convenient to carry and use on the go but judging from your previous post, that's not an important requirement.

The liked xBass on Signature, it's got more punch and also it's xSpace.

 

[Johnfg465vd]

Another problem is i Don't know what the difference is between warm & neutral. I thought they would be pretty much the same.
I enjoy absolute clarity. Bass & opening up the sound stage tweaks are good to have for something different. Really confusing this decision.
Have they sorted the volume problem they were having with the Gryphon yet as I am up to the pages where it has become a problem.
Thanks again.

They have slightly different sound signatures.

Yes, with the latest firmware the volume issues are fixed.

 

[Lightspeed12]

They have slightly different sound signatures.

Yes, with the latest firmware the volume issues are fixed.

Ok thanks, Signature sounds like the go then.

 

[electronicsdesign]

In regard to the imbalance, don't expect huge problems.
You will just need to use the lowest gain setting (the ECO mode others have mentioned) in order for the pot to be in a higer position, as imbalance is a problem only
audible when pot is near the minimum setting.
Then, you can also use the IEMatch (already mentioned as well), which will reduce the output voltage even more, requiring you to crank the pot even higher.
My opinion, despite I don't have the Signature is imbalance shouldn't really be such big of a concern. If this one fits your needs a lot better, simply go for it.

In regard to volume issues being fixed, I want to clarify that statement is in regard to the Gryphon (and problem with volume jumping to max setting).
The imbalance of an analog stereo potentiometer (which is what the Signature has) cannot be fixed with a firmware update.

 

[Lightspeed12]

In regard to the imbalance, don't expect huge problems.
You will just need to use the lowest gain setting (the ECO mode others have mentioned) in order for the pot to be in a higer position, as imbalance is a problem only
audible when pot is near the minimum setting.
Then, you can also use the IEMatch (already mentioned as well), which will reduce the output voltage even more, requiring you to crank the pot even higher.
My opinion, despite I don't have the Signature is imbalance shouldn't really be such big of a concern. If this one fits your needs a lot better, simply go for it.

In regard to volume issues being fixed, I want to clarify that statement is in regard to the Gryphon (and problem with volume jumping to max setting).
The imbalance of an analog stereo potentiometer (which is what the Signature has) cannot be fixed with a firmware update.

Yes I have been following the Gryphon thread & are just past the software fix for the volume problem but a few were still having problems as yet. I might end up getting the Gryphon after the signature if I feel the need later on.
Owning 2 dac/amps may come in handy.
Thanks again.

 

[531412]

Since I do not want to read through all pages.
Is the problem with the jumping volume already fixed for all operation systems?
Because with the first firmware the Gryphon was able to destroy the connected IEM as well as your ears because out of the sudden the volume was jumping to +6db powermode.

 

[electronicsdesign]

Problem is completely fixed only if you disable the Volume Sync from the menu, otherwise it still happens when using exclusive mode on Windows (it happens on Tidal).
However, with Volume Sync on off and pairing on BT, volume of the device is at 0 needing to manually crank it up every single time.
This is happening on Android, don't know about iOS.
Don't know if more can be done about the volume issue apart from the Volume Sync feature, but the Android situation is annoying.

Besides that, the volume displayed in dB and selectable high/low brightness of screen when set to off are 2 features I am still expecting to be introduced in a future firmware version. I really hope that v1.45 is not the last version that iFi has made for this device.

 

[huythach83]

Problem is completely fixed only if you disable the Volume Sync from the menu, otherwise it still happens when using exclusive mode on Windows (it happens on Tidal).
However, with Volume Sync on off and pairing on BT, volume of the device is at 0 needing to manually crank it up every single time.
This is happening on Android, don't know about iOS.
Don't know if more can be done about the volume issue apart from the Volume Sync feature, but the Android situation is annoying.

Besides that, the volume displayed in dB and selectable high/low brightness of screen when set to off are 2 features I am still expecting to be introduced in a future firmware version. I really hope that v1.45 is not the last version that iFi has made for this device.

I think the BT situation on Android with volume sync off can be solved with the help of Tasker. Set the condition to BT connection, check the device name, and set media volume.
-------------------------
Edit:
I actually try on my device and here are the details:
- Using Tasker
- Trigger the profile using BT Connected state with the device name set to the Gryphon
- In the task, first set to wait about 10 second
- After the wait, change the Media volume to 1 (any number will do, as long as it is not 0)