[Maitre Renard]

Well if someone in EU have some parts for the hd 540 for sale , or probably the headset with burned drivers I would like to consider

 

[sennsay]

Interesting now hearing the refreshed HD430s with the Mogami cable; a fuller and more intimate balance, with none of the slight upper mid constriction despite the very fine focus that can bring. There is more immersion now, a more relaxed expression akin to the HD540, yet without that headphone's utterly beguiling refinement.
However .... and this is a biggie for me, I still prefer the HD430s with the stock cable and the leather Orhpolsters. There is a natural speed and life, dynamics are more alive, a clean unfettered freedom of expression, despite the slight upper-mid exposure which is nevertheless still clean, if with a little grain, a function of the steel cable just as it was 34 years ago. And, even while there is not the micro level textural detailing in the top end, such as with fine cymbal detail, the HD540 is quite superior here ... as a Reference ought to be. The Mogami loses the stock cable's grain, being utterly even from top to bottom in tonal balance and immerses me more into the soundfield, if with still a background touch of the slightest hifi-sounding fatigue, which doesn't exist at all with the HD540 Reference. I take it that may just be a feature of the drivers themselves. The Mogami may be a better match for the new DT770 velour pads when they arrive.
My main HD540s Ref1s have taken me quite some years to get just right and everything is very synergistic, even down to some minor treatment to the magnet of each driver, so they sound refined as well as detailed and dynamic.
For now, the HD430s sound like less refined brothers and are still damned fine to listen to, they 'come at me' more and for some music that is just perfect.

 

[ArChaos]

Considering the preciousness of those rings, maybe someone ought to be 3D printing them. If it can be done for the little cog wheel in my Sony Walkman Pro, then it can be done with these Senn rings. Now there's a thought!

I make my own rings, sort of "simplified" version without the inner ridge, but they're fine to safely keep the ear pads in place. I cut them from stiff plastic folders using an NT1500 Circles Cutter. I also use it for cutting all kind of foams/paper towels, felt rings and so on...

https://www.amazon.com/NT-Cutter-h1310508-Coupe-CERCLES-Multicoloured/dp/B001OYA8C6?th=1

Here is a pick of the one row back holes ear pads (Black1), with a red ring I made out of a plastic file folder sheet to safely keep them in place.

and here's a pic of an original HD540 Ref.2 Senn's velour ear pad (right side) near the Black1 velours
Unfortunately, the distortion in the rings thickness, (because of the wide angle camera of the phone when taking a close-up at small distance) shows here very exaggerated on the Senns' ear pad, so I add a pic with the real proportions on my HD540nRef.2

and for dessert, I add here two pics showing the the ring and some felt rings cutting process

 

[lantian]

Interesting now hearing the refreshed HD430s with the Mogami cable; a fuller and more intimate balance, with none of the slight upper mid constriction despite the very fine focus that can bring. There is more immersion now, a more relaxed expression akin to the HD540, yet without that headphone's utterly beguiling refinement.
However .... and this is a biggie for me, I still prefer the HD430s with the stock cable and the leather Orhpolsters. There is a natural speed and life, dynamics are more alive, a clean unfettered freedom of expression, despite the slight upper-mid exposure which is nevertheless still clean, if with a little grain, a function of the steel cable just as it was 34 years ago. And, even while there is not the micro level textural detailing in the top end, such as with fine cymbal detail, the HD540 is quite superior here ... as a Reference ought to be. The Mogami loses the stock cable's grain, being utterly even from top to bottom in tonal balance and immerses me more into the soundfield, if with still a background touch of the slightest hifi-sounding fatigue, which doesn't exist at all with the HD540 Reference. I take it that may just be a feature of the drivers themselves. The Mogami may be a better match for the new DT770 velour pads when they arrive.
My main HD540s Ref1s have taken me quite some years to get just right and everything is very synergistic, even down to some minor treatment to the magnet of each driver, so they sound refined as well as detailed and dynamic.
For now, the HD430s sound like less refined brothers and are still damned fine to listen to, they 'come at me' more and for some music that is just perfect.

Biggest differences between 540 line and previous 430s are aluminium voice coils for 540, while 430 used copper and tuning went from open field with 430s to diffusion field loudness with 540.
Believe membrane is made of mylar on both.
Loved what 430s offered, but general tuning is not for me, atleast not since I heard 540 line, prefer speaker like presentation.
They also have closed back version of 430s if your interested, that would be hd 222 and hd 230. If you like 430 tuning presentation might enjoy those aswell.

 

[ArChaos]

Well, they're certainly damn fine now! No matter the pads, it was the rotting outer foams that were causing them to sound thin and edgy and with almost no bass at all, plus they could overload easily on heavy bass notes. It seems the new foams allow for a much better backload for the 430's drivers and now they really sound like very good headphones, the focus on vocals is exceptional, extremely articulate and detailed and even sounds outside the ear cups are pinpoint, so a very good lateral soundstage then. It's only today that I can hear how good these HD430s actually are, they really are amazing cans, if a little different than the sheer organic and immersive fluidity of the HD540 Reference. A great pair of headphones and I'm so happy that the 430s can now take their proper place in the Sennheiser family here. Thanks to your inspiration to reinvestigate the Orhpolsters, they are complete once again, brilliant that I had kept the pads and they had literally only a few hours of use previously.

I am now listening to some of Genesis' Lamb Lies Down (Live) with them, Gabriels' voice sublimely articulate, as is Phil's drumming behind him, no problems at all with the complex rhythms, so much so that it seems quite effortless. Sibilances are superbly controlled if there, easy peasy. Skin tone on the kickdrum at the beginning of In The Cage is top notch, the rippling keyboards are crystal clear, though don't have the gorgeous liquidity of the HD540s. This could, in part, be to do with the original cables and might be improved with the Mogami cable, which will be tomorrow's play time. Phil's dynamics on the drums are fast and a thrill to hear, nothing is missed, including his backing vocals. Crowd ambience is well out in space and various crowd calls are pinpoint. Hand claps are extremely natural. Gabriel's into to 'Back In NYC' is utterly hypnotic in it's clarity and articulation, the following drums are verging on spectacular, what a dynamic piece!
You are right too in that the BD pads are a superb fit around the ears and overall the cans and pads are extremely comfortable and never move on the head, yet are not tight but light and stable. Perfect.

Well wha'do'ya know, I went into Narnia (what we call our storage container) and found a box of pads, including two basically brand new leather/pleather Orhpolsters, I thought they'd gone during a big cleanout .. and yes, I had cut the cloth away to use with thin foams. So, now they are on the HD430s, including the original cable (like new) and other than the gold fleck outer foams - now with new black ones - they look very smart. They're very comfortable too. And boy do they sound better than the Wang velours (!), bass is so much better too (if not quite in the HD540's league) and the balance even with these HD430s is more like what you find, lantian. There even appears to be a broader soundstage too .... so far. Excellent focus.This original cable even seems to sound better than my utterly thrashed HD540 original steel cable ... which has the channel wires separated for much of it's length, they'd been danced-with to almost death, torn out of the capsules in wild moves for many hundreds of hours over several years I shall try them with a second set of Mogami cable I also found with the pads.
So far, very happy with the resto on these cans now, they look great and sound fine. Heck, there's even some bottom end thump now playing The 2 Bears dance track, Take A Look Around, still missing the deepest bass, but much better balanced now. Despite being 600 ohms impedance like the HD540s, the drivers seem to need extra ergs to drive them. Maybe the drive coils are a different material than the Reference HD540's aluminium coils.
Seems I have some listening hours to come! A literal transformation in sound compared to yesterday with the velour pads.
Thanks for sharing your experience with the Orhpolsters, lantian, it's led to the renewed HD430s, now better than ever! The leather pads actually control the drivers so much more so than velour. 'Jelly Legs' from Children Collide has all the energy it is supposed to have but without strain and distortion. Quite remarkable. I may even leave the original cable on for a while, it's rare for me to listen to Children Collide's Rocketship without going, "yeah ok, that's enough of that" but it's all so alive without making me cringe, brilliant. Seems the old HD430s need a good warm up, they've been rarely used and are now becoming a good alternative with these pads to the HD540s, if without the sheer effortless openness that can be both relaxing and organically detailed at the same time. The steel cables still all have a small element of upper mid exposure that can lead to some fatigue with some music (more like a pressure push on the ears) ... however, the overall musical experience is so enjoyable that I am fondly reminded of the HD540s from way back in the day I have a feeling I may be buying another set of the leather Orhpolsters for HD540 No2.
And yes, they DO sit very nicely around the ears, especially as the leather warms up.
Thrilled.

I so much agree with you about the HD430. They definitely do not receive the justice they deserve - spend too much time in the closet because of the 250 and 540 twosome. Your last sentence: "The HD430s sound like less refined brothers and are still damned fine to listen to, they 'come at me' more and for some music that is just perfect." sums it all great. I also love your vivid and detailed music descriptions - they do not leave much to add...
Only, perhaps, a few words regarding the pleather/velour use: I try to stick to the originals, not because I take Sennheisser's choices as the Bible, but mostly because to my ears, I found them to really sound the best.

 

[Maitre Renard]

I make my own rings, sort of "simplified" version without the inner ridge, but they're fine to safely keep the ear pads in place. I cut them from stiff plastic folders using an NT1500 Circles Cutter. I also use it for cutting all kind of foam/paper and felt rings.

https://www.amazon.com/NT-Cutter-h1310508-Coupe-CERCLES-Multicoloured/dp/B001OYA8C6?th=1

Here is a pick of the one row back holes ear pads (Black1), with a red ring I made out of a plastic file folder sheet to safely keep them in place.



and here's a pic of an original HD540 Ref.2 Senn's velour ear pad (right side) near the Black1 velours
Unfortunately, the distortion in the rings thickness, (because of the wide angle camera of the phone when taking a close-up at small distance) shows here very exaggerated on the Senns' ear pad, so I add a pic with the real proportions on my HD540nRef.2





and for dessert, I add here two pics showing the the ring and some felt rings cutting process

Bravo !
And how could you determine the diameter of new (red) rings ? Based only on the pads or you used another par of the rings as the template?

 

[pappy97]

I haven't A/B'ed them yet with the regular Ref I, but I will do that soon and report back.

Okay, I've had the chance now to A/B HD540 Ref I 600 Ohms vs. HD540 Ref I Gold 600 Ohms. I use "Sunrise" by Norah Jones, played via Tidal app on PC + Zen Dac + Schiit Heresy.

Not really much difference. MAYBE the Gold's have a tad bit better vocal separation, and vocal clarity. Otherwise, I didn't get any discernible difference to me. If I was budget conscious, I'd just sell off these Golds I just got and stick with the Ref I 600 Ohms. But I'm more likely to sell off the non-Golds, if and when I decide to sell.

 

[sennsay]

Biggest differences between 540 line and previous 430s are aluminium voice coils for 540, while 430 used copper and tuning went from open field with 430s to diffusion field loudness with 540.
Believe membrane is made of mylar on both.
Loved what 430s offered, but general tuning is not for me, atleast not since I heard 540 line, prefer speaker like presentation.
They also have closed back version of 430s if your interested, that would be hd 222 and hd 230. If you like 430 tuning presentation might enjoy those aswell.

I did not know that the 430's had closed back brothers, that's great to know, thank you. I too prefer the slightly more diffuse and intimate speaker-like presentation of the HD540s ... 90% of the time. Yes, the driver membranes at least look identical.
Happy to have the now rejuvenated HD430s back in the family as a fully functioning alternative, I still suspect that they had little use in their previous European life ... I think I bought them from Germany. Those aluminium voice coils and the different loading sure make the HD540s a lot more efficient than the HD430s! On my Magni 3+ amp, there is a difference between a track played 12:30 on the dial with the 540s and at least 2-2:30 on the 430s. I actually had to turn a piece of music down that much when going from the 430s to 540s and even then I could have gone even lower in volume without losing presence and impact.

 

[sennsay]

I so much agree with you about the HD430. They definitely do not receive the justice they deserve - spend too much time in the closet because of the 250 and 540 twosome. Your last sentence: "The HD430s sound like less refined brothers and are still damned fine to listen to, they 'come at me' more and for some music that is just perfect." sums it all great. I also love your vivid and detailed music descriptions - they do not leave much to add...
Only, perhaps, a few words regarding the pleather/velour use: I try to stick to the originals, not because I take Sennheisser's choices as the Bible, but mostly because to my ears, I found them to really sound the best.

Why thank you, Mr ArChaos I do love writing about what I hear, I've been asked by a more local(ish) friend here in QLD, OZ, to do a blog on the Australian Vintage Hifi pages of Darpa Book - that would be Face Book, for those who didn't know - on the rejuvenation of my headphones, as it would 'make a refreshing change' over all the old amps and turntables and tape decks that usually take precedent.
Meantime, I will enjoy the HD430s as they are and await the arrival of the BD velour pads as mentioned previously. I will be keen to hear how they go on both the HD430s and my second HD540 Ref1s ... I'm still so impressed that both my pairs look almost as perfect as when they rolled off the German assembly line some 34 years ago.

 

[ArChaos]

Bravo !
And how could you determine the diameter of new (red) rings ? Based only on the pads or you used another par of the rings as the template?

Based on the headphones' inner opening diameter dimensions - they are approximately 102 mm. I measure them with a caliper. The HD560 are a bit smaller. One could also use dual sided glue tape strips as a simpler alternative...

 

[sennsay]

I make my own rings, sort of "simplified" version without the inner ridge, but they're fine to safely keep the ear pads in place. I cut them from stiff plastic folders using an NT1500 Circles Cutter. I also use it for cutting all kind of foams/paper towels, felt rings and so on...

https://www.amazon.com/NT-Cutter-h1310508-Coupe-CERCLES-Multicoloured/dp/B001OYA8C6?th=1

Here is a pick of the one row back holes ear pads (Black1), with a red ring I made out of a plastic file folder sheet to safely keep them in place.



and here's a pic of an original HD540 Ref.2 Senn's velour ear pad (right side) near the Black1 velours
Unfortunately, the distortion in the rings thickness, (because of the wide angle camera of the phone when taking a close-up at small distance) shows here very exaggerated on the Senns' ear pad, so I add a pic with the real proportions on my HD540nRef.2





and for dessert, I add here two pics showing the the ring and some felt rings cutting process

Excellent work there! And do I see a set of HD250 foams there at the bottom? I think I do, having an almost identical set-up for my own HD250s. I have a slightly rattly driver though and nothing I have done has been able to fix it. I'm considering selling the cup/drivers to someone who needs a spare. They came with no headband, so I had pinched the HD430's h'band for a time while they were out of action.
Does eBay have a circle cutter like you have there? Love the felts too, maybe not so easy to cut cleanly?

Ah, I see, your post came right as I was posting the question Amazon. Should be able to pick one up here in OZ.

 

[lantian]

Why thank you, Mr ArChaos I do love writing about what I hear, I've been asked by a more local(ish) friend here in QLD, OZ, to do a blog on the Australian Vintage Hifi pages of Darpa Book - that would be Face Book, for those who didn't know - on the rejuvenation of my headphones, as it would 'make a refreshing change' over all the old amps and turntables and tape decks that usually take precedent.
Meantime, I will enjoy the HD430s as they are and await the arrival of the BD velour pads as mentioned previously. I will be keen to hear how they go on both the HD430s and my second HD540 Ref1s ... I'm still so impressed that both my pairs look almost as perfect as when they rolled off the German assembly line some 34 years ago.

Build quality of these Sennheiser phones is impeccable, weight aswell. Should be golden standard for all.

 

[sennsay]

Build quality of these Sennheiser phones is impeccable, weight aswell. Should be golden standard for all.

I agree totally, there's just nothing else like them.
Currently using the HD430s with the Questyle QP1R DAP and AQ Carbon optical cable to the Schiit Modi Multibit DAC for extra refinement, same silver cables and Magni 3+, just moved 7' across the room. Stunning! I can barely believe that these are even remotely the same headphones that I bought a couple of years ago. Such vibrant articulation without brightness, the Live version of Orbital's Dr Who theme at Glastonbury is a virtual 3D concert, image placement is spectacular and instrument textures just wonderful. Alive, and riveting to hear!
Ani diFranco's Fuel doesn't go as low in the deep bass as the HD540s/wang pleathers, yet it's extremely articulate and and doesn't really sound as if anything is missing as such ... other than sub bass, forget it, the 430s are not going to go there. Her voice (as with others) is utterly articulate and expressive, the moisture on her lips easy to hear.
I can hardly wait to get into Richard Thompson's live version of Calvary Cross, the recording of the drum kit is the sound of the real thing heard live on stage, not over damped.

 

[sennsay]

A good hifi buddy with access to a 3D printer is going to give it a go printing some of the Senn pad rings. I sent him pics and all the dimensions I took yesterday with callipers. We'll see how it goes, ought to be interesting. He doesn't have black colour, but since the rings are tucked away it doesn't matter.
So, last night's sesh with the HD430s: Richard Thompson's live Calvary Cross was a cinch, no matter how complex the music got - and the middle stages of this 13 minute piece are full on - everything was effortless, no blurring of images, no distortion, the way Richard bent notes on his guitar was a revelation, every instrument stayed in place and focusing on any one of them took no more than a thought to tune in.
However, it was with a section of the wonderful Ricki Lee Jones live set(s) on the Naked Songs CD that revealed something I'd had a hint of over the last couple of days; just as the bass of the HD430's rolls off from maybe 30-40Hz on down, so does the top end! Most cymbals are fine, if lacking the fine textural detail of the HD540s as I've mentioned before, but in the higher reaches the response just 'greys out'. RLJ's live set is one I've heard countless times and literally been in jaw-dropped ecstasy with the HD540s, lost in immersive awe along with the audience, agreeing totally with one male audience member who, at the conclusion of Skeletons, can be heard to almost whisper in awe, "Oh my goodness" out in space in front and below me, so quietly that it can be missed if a thought takes me elsewhere. With the HD430s I could hear that voice quiet clearly, yet the ambience around it was completely greyed out, missing the real 3D layering of the auditorium. While so brilliant with other music, with this album the HD430s bring me too close. The stunning vocal range of Coolsville, so wide-eyed in utter appreciation with the HD540s, is too much in my face ... literally ... to truly sit back in awe and admire the artist in her glory. This is one album that is exclusively for the HD540s. Nothing else comes close to having me sit in the audience, surrounded in admiring fans of RLJ in all directions, as if seated in a sloping auditorium, murmurs and calls of love and appreciation coming from everywhere. No sonic pressures pushing at me to 'listen to this', just lost in space Organic, alive.
The HD430s are going nowhere! Within their slightly limited range they are exceptionally good at many aspects of musical reproduction, the way they sail through complex music with an air of almost contempt is surprising and most welcome. Love 'em .... but not for RLJ! And definitely not for lower Chesky recording levels either, I finished the night with a live jazz piece called Perdido, and the lack of drive and sheer vanishing of ambience around the crucial brushed cymbals simply lost the timing and joy in the music. The top end ambience just vanished into a grey fog and that was that. These headphones are seriously inefficient! I would love to hear them with something like a restored Sansui AU-2900 integrated amplifier (I had one for a while that I restored for a guy, simply lovely with the HD540 Ref1s), the extra oomph and a 330 ohm load may be something they would appreciate.

 

[moriez]

I have one of those original HD540/HD250 cables (DIN/würfelstecker & 6.35mm adapter) with black connectors. Anyone interested before I make a classified? Send me a PM

(now sold)