[sennsay]

Thanks, I managed to separate drivers from the plastics with net in 300ohm version. There were 3 long strands of hair on the driver. I removed them and now bass no longer resonates. Presumed fungus in 600ohm version may not be fungus at all. Back foams in all HD540s get rusty color with time. Maybe it's from them.

I made some observations on the occasion of disassembly. 300ohm version - central element of the driver is white, main internal part is dark. 600ohm version (probably early one) - central element is black, main internal part is bright.
Also there is an important difference in how plastic element with driver fits in plastic element with net. 300ohm version is definitely improved because it lacks doubtful small plastic thingy that keeps falling out in 600ohm version. Anyway, you can just easily swap drivers between those 2 versions without any modding.

One more question - which models' headbands can be used for HD 540 shells? 430? 420? 560? Only 540?

Here is the driver of Reference I 300ohm version with new headband and velour pads after hair removal:

Thank you, good info. Just 3 little hairs, eh? That covering over the drivers can be replaced? Or is it ruined when taken off, I'd imagine so, probably glued on. Lovely looking drivers, wonderful design.

 

[homesicalien]

Thank you, good info. Just 3 little hairs, eh? That covering over the drivers can be replaced? Or is it ruined when taken off, I'd imagine so, probably glued on. Lovely looking drivers, wonderful design.

I think what you see in the picture is meant to be non-separable for user. I didn't measure them, but drivers are only about 40mm in diameter I think.

 

[sennsay]

I think what you see in the picture is meant to be non-separable for user. I didn't measure them, but drivers are only about 40mm in diameter I think.

I think the covering you took off is called a 'felt', it's what the tech I'm getting my HD250 Linear capsules from calls them. He's sending me a couple of felts for mine.
I had a fine listening session last night, sort of a shoot-out with two, then three headphones. I was feeling the need for a good blast of rock and roll, so The Who-Live In Leeds fulfilled the need admirably, as it so often has. My favourite parts of this great and classic album start from "I'm A Boy" and it's brilliant introduction at the end of it to the next piece, "A Quick One, While He's Away" and followed by the outstanding two piece track, "Amazing Journey-Sparks". If that last one doesn't get your blood moving and whole body air guitaring, bassing and drumming, I don't know what would! WOW is that a stunning piece of music! Keith Moon's drumming is spectacular, let alone the brilliant contributions from the rest of the band. Hardly have they finished that rip-snorting pace they are straight into Summertime Blues and Shakin' All Over. However, despite those brilliant spectacles, it was the 15 minute+ My Generation medley that brought in all three of the headphones involved in my involuntary shoot-out. The Ref1s, HD6XX and later the HifiMAN HE400S with it's non-stock cable. 8 min 40s into the medley, from a quiet moment, Pete Townsend then hammers out the 5 chord intro repeat into the "See Me, Feel Me" refrain and it's amazing how telling just this little section is. Both the HD6XX and HE400S have slightly greater transparency and instrument detail, focus is tighter and 'smaller', greater initial string attack. It's the Ref1s though that bring me the joy, the sheer weight and presence and intent as Pete powers into those chords, the removal of any barrier between me and the performance. Coherence. Whole, like a real live performance is whole. The following 4 minutes or so is exhilarating in it's energy, totally consuming.
The other cans let me hear the recorded detail to a greater extent, but that doesn't mean I enjoy the music any more because of that. The Ref1s also let me really hear, feel and almost roll in ecstasy at John Entwhistle's bass playing, the other two headphones lighten that presence significantly, yes, the HD6XX included - they are improved with the Mogami cable, but nowhere near as delicious as the Ref1s with either Mogami or the HD6XX cable, with which they are well suited too and this is how I used them last night, the Mogami filling out the HD6XX somewhat.
All in all, an interesting experience. The Ref1s always leave me feeling like I've been to the live performance, thrilled and almost exhausted with pleasure, complete with sweat and accelerated heart rate. The others .... stepped back from the live event a bit, a little more detail to listen too and while absorbing in itself, foot-tapping and enjoyable in their own right, the 'smaller' images leading to a lessened 'presence' and the reduction of John Entwhistle's extraordinary bass playing commitment to the whole, just leaves me a little wanting - you simply must NOT reduce his contribution of the crucial bass solos on "My Generation", let alone any of the other pieces! Yes, the HD6XX play the bass just fine, tuneful and easy to hear that the treble is wound up on the guitar, as John usually did, yet it lacks the deeper presence, the grumbling, twanging, snapping feel of John and bass guitar energy that is an essential part of the whole.
It's quite possible that even now, the HD6XX/HD650 are more admirable with the likes of the Little Dot MkIII/IVSE valve amps, but while they can be very good with the Mimby/Magni 3 combo, maybe they need something from the old stomping ground to really sing at their best? They appear to have a rather weird distribution pattern, as if they have more focused imaging in front and to the sides, but a slight gap in presence in-between. Imagine a flattened 'W' laid out in front of you, more centre/left/right. The Ref1s have only an all-encompassing sound field that's noticeably different from any of my other headphones. No gaps, sound everywhere. No skull bones, no headphones, just music. Strangely, the HD6XX were rather good with a recording of Beethoven's Violin Symphony, better than with rock music, actually, though I was still aware of wearing something on my head.
I am really looking forward to hearing my upcoming Linear 1s with this fabulous concert when I can build them!
PS I went back to that Who concert a few moments ago, this morning now, a few minutes with the HD6XX - good - then back to the Ref1s and into the sheer energy of a live concert. Stunning show. Very hard to take the Ref1s of my head and have Mooned - that's Keith Mooned - myself into a frenzy in Amazing Journey/Sparks. That's why we do this, right? Heh heh.

 

[homesicalien]

I'd like to sum up my thoughts about HD 540 versions and pads.

I'm not that sensitive listener as most of you. I hear differences between versions of 540s, between versions of 580s and of course huge differences between various models of headphones. But I fail to hear noticable difference between cables and desktop headphone amps. I use Matrix Mini-i DAC/Amp and I'm satisfied since it performs better than most of consumer sources (tablets, sound cards, phones). I've also tried Musical Fidelity X-Cans, but didn't noticed anything getting better or worse.

I'm now a proud owner of 4 pairs of HD 540 Reference I:
1. 300ohm, new (plain) headband, velour pads (worn out a little bit), cable with flat plugs (righ red and left black) on the headphones side and PX1 on the amp side.
2. 600ohm, new (plain) headband, material pads (fresh and springy like new) finished with goat leather (mod/repair by previous user), cable with flat plugs (righ red and left black) on the headphones side and PX1 on the amp side.
3. 600ohm, old (HD430-like) headband, velour pads (very slightly worn-out), cable with round plugs (righ red and left yellow) on the headphones side and PX1 on the amp side.
4. 600ohm, old (HD430-like) headband, material pads (very slightly worn-out) without any leather finish, cable with round plugs (righ black and left black) on the headphones side and PX1 on the amp side.

The biggest difference is made by pads type - material and/or distance from ear.
2 and 4 sound identical. Sound is more distant, soundstage is bigger. Bass is less present, comparing to most of modern headphones bass is really thin and vestigal. It doesn't ruin overall reception of sound, because there's no gap in frequency response, this is just a way they present music. As long as you don't desire full bodied, powerful bass, it's not a problem. Vocals are very airy. These version (600ohm, material pads) is definitely bright sounding, but there's no harshness between midrange and treble. They are the opposite of "Sennheiser veil". There's nothing between you and music, but also nothing makes midrange warm, which some people like. Speed, precision and separation - that's where they shine. Best for: rock, classical.
1 and 3 sound similar. Maybe 1 (300ohm version) are a little less peaky in upper midrange, that's all. Soundstage is more intimate (drivers are closer to ears). Bass is present, so overall sound is fuller, but you can also hear some veil (nowhere near HD 580 veil though). Vocals are warmer, less dry. In absolute scale, they are still bright headphones, but compared with 2 and 4, they are significantly more balanced (do not confuse with "more natural", they just present wider range of frequencies with better balance between bass and midrange). With fast, complex music with a lot of intruments at the same time, they can be quite muddy. Best for: slowcore, soul, music focused on vocals, pop, house.
EDIT: sometimes with velour pads you can hear a peak in upper midrange, it's not so smooth as with material pads. I'm 90% sure it's due to the distance to ears.

2 and 4 are perfect for everything once you get used to or don't mind the brightness (not harshness, there's none) and lack of warmth in midrange.
1 and 3 are magic for chamber, intimate, calm music. Magic.

Now, how pleather replacement pads compare to those two original ones? Which pads should I try? HM5 hybrids? And how do I attach those pads?

 

[sennsay]

I'd like to sum up my thoughts about HD 540 versions and pads.

I'm not that sensitive listener as most of you. I hear differences between versions of 540s, between versions of 580s and of course huge differences between various models of headphones. But I fail to hear noticable difference between cables and desktop headphone amps. I use Matrix Mini-i DAC/Amp and I'm satisfied since it performs better than most of consumer sources (tablets, sound cards, phones). I've also tried Musical Fidelity X-Cans, but didn't noticed anything getting better or worse.

I'm now a proud owner of 4 pairs of HD 540 Reference I:
1. 300ohm, new (plain) headband, velour pads (worn out a little bit), cable with flat plugs (righ red and left black) on the headphones side and PX1 on the amp side.
2. 600ohm, new (plain) headband, material pads (fresh and springy like new) finished with goat leather (mod/repair by previous user), cable with flat plugs (righ red and left black) on the headphones side and PX1 on the amp side.
3. 600ohm, old (HD430-like) headband, velour pads (very slightly worn-out), cable with round plugs (righ red and left yellow) on the headphones side and PX1 on the amp side.
4. 600ohm, old (HD430-like) headband, material pads (very slightly worn-out) without any leather finish, cable with round plugs (righ black and left black) on the headphones side and PX1 on the amp side.

The biggest difference is made by pads type - material and/or distance from ear.
2 and 4 sound identical. Sound is more distant, soundstage is bigger. Bass is less present, comparing to most of modern headphones bass is really thin and vestigal. It doesn't ruin overall reception of sound, because there's no gap in frequency response, this is just a way they present music. As long as you don't desire full bodied, powerful bass, it's not a problem. Vocals are very airy. These version (600ohm, material pads) is definitely bright sounding, but there's no harshness between midrange and treble. They are the opposite of "Sennheiser veil". There's nothing between you and music, but also nothing makes midrange warm, which some people like. Speed, precision and separation - that's where they shine. Best for: rock, classical.
1 and 3 sound similar. Maybe 1 (300ohm version) are a little less peaky in upper midrange, that's all. Soundstage is more intimate (drivers are closer to ears). Bass is present, so overall sound is fuller, but you can also hear some veil (nowhere near HD 580 veil though). Vocals are warmer, less dry. In absolute scale, they are still bright headphones, but compared with 2 and 4, they are significantly more balanced (do not confuse with "more natural", they just present wider range of frequencies with better balance between bass and midrange). With fast, complex music with a lot of intruments at the same time, they can be quite muddy. Best for: slowcore, soul, music focused on vocals, pop, house.

2 and 4 are perfect for everything once you get used to or don't mind the brightness (not harshness, there's none) and lack of warmth in midrange.
1 and 3 are magic for chamber, intimate, calm music. Magic.

Now, how pleather replacement pads compare to those two original ones? Which pads should I try? HM5 hybrids? And how do I attach those pads?

Well now, that's a pretty good precis of fairly stock HD540s, homesicalien! It's a lot like my own 2nd series of Ref1s sounded like pre new pleather pads and inner driver covers, with or without Mogami cable. You described the 'lack of warmth' well. Mine had an upper mid peak ... shall we say exposed upper mids. Like that since new in 1989, I loved everything they brought to the musical table despite the exaggerated upper mids with some music and although they appeared to lack sheer bass impact, the openness and depth of the bass they had was extraordinary. I believe you described it fairly well. The number of times though that I could have sworn I left the speakers on or I thought I heard sounds coming from behind me in the room was uncanny and often.
The pleather pads mentioned a number of times in this thread have transformed the Ref1s, completely removing the upper mid peak and extending the bass in both frequency and impact. They are now the most organically alive headphones in the bass I've ever heard. With the new thinner driver covers that came with some DT880 pads (velour), the balance is ever so slightly on the dark side of neutral (less so than the thicker ones that come with the pads!), as if the house lights have been dimmed just a little, certainly in comparison to the new HD6XX, which are somewhat 'brighter'. Same goes for the HifiMAN HE400S. Treble is 'sweet' but not soft, still detailed, yet a tad rolled compared to the others. It could be the pleather pads which do this, though I'm usually so deeply involved with the music I'm not in the least bit bothered. I'll take that over bright and/or edgy any day! The pleather pads are less deep than the velour pads, either stock or replacement, hence requiring the shallower inner covers - half the thickness of those which came with the pleather pads. Sorry if this is repetition for some of you. Thin felt could be used instead and I may try that sometime.
Mate, try both types of pads and see which you like! You've got plenty of headphones to choose from Wow, four of them .... good to have spares!
Attaching the pads is very simple, you may or may not have to cut the plastic ring from the old pads and use it with the new ones, which will then just simply fit inside the back of the new pads and clip right onto the capsules. Personally, I really didn't like the inner covers that came with the pleather pads, they dampen the sound too much and reduce ear space. You might have some there with your older pads that you can use instead. Fortunately, experimentation is simple.

 

[homesicalien]

With the new thinner driver covers that came with some DT880 pads (velour)

You mean foam discs? I completely forgot about this element. None of my pairs have them. I executed some blind A/B testing with/without those foam disc with HD 580. No differences heard...
So you recommend DT-880 velour pads with included foam discs, right? And the other option is pleather pads like HM5 hybrids?
How you attach DT-880 pads to HD 540?

 

[seanc6441]

You mean foam discs? I completely forgot about this element. None of my pairs have them. I executed some blind A/B testing with/without those foam disc with HD 580. No differences heard...
So you recommend DT-880 velour pads with included foam discs, right? And the other option is pleather pads like HM5 hybrids?
How you attach DT-880 pads to HD 540?

In my experience foam disks also fill out the sound on thinner sounding headphones. I guess because the sound wave is dispersed through the foam. It also brings forward vocals slightly at the cost of slightly less space in the soundstage. For my 540 II’s it will be 100% worth it to soften/darken the sound and add more lush qualities to the mids. I’ll also use a thin paper filter to tame the treble/upper mids which can be a little hot at times. Although I do love the extension these things put out so I won’t be taming at too much.

Next stop is to get my balanced cable from venus audio and pair it with the hiby R6 when it arrives. That dap outputs impressive power in balanced mode, I’m sure it will drive these headphones nicely.

Cannot wait to hear this combo.

 

[sennsay]

You mean foam discs? I completely forgot about this element. None of my pairs have them. I executed some blind A/B testing with/without those foam disc with HD 580. No differences heard...
So you recommend DT-880 velour pads with included foam discs, right? And the other option is pleather pads like HM5 hybrids?
How you attach DT-880 pads to HD 540?

The DT880 pads attach exactly the same way as the stock pads or the pleather. No, I didn't like the DT880 pads in the slightest, finding them dull and constricting and they lasted less than half an hour on my Ref1s! It was a brainwave a little later that found me using the thinner foam discs (yes, that's what I meant) from the DT880s and using them with the pleather pads. Tah dah! As they say Bingo, et voila. The pleather pads I'm using are not the hybrids, it's these ones: https://www.ebay.com.au/i/261338110308?chn=ps&dispItem=1
Seems like there aren't too many left, might have to get another pair myself. You can select either velour or pleather, choose pleather ... or both
My ears are particularly sensitive to sharpness and edge, so I prefer the slightly smoother Ref1s as they are now. Heck, I can listen to the Who at full belt and get fully lost in it, even though I can hear that there is some vocal edge and forwardness at times, it's still easily listened through.

 

[sennsay]

In my experience foam disks also fill out the sound on thinner sounding headphones. I guess because the sound wave is dispersed through the foam. It also brings forward vocals slightly at the cost of slightly less space in the soundstage. For my 540 II’s it will be 100% worth it to soften/darken the sound and add more lush qualities to the mids. I’ll also use a thin paper filter to tame the treble/upper mids which can be a little hot at times. Although I do love the extension these things put out so I won’t be taming at too much.

Next stop is to get my balanced cable from venus audio and pair it with the hiby R6 when it arrives. That dap outputs impressive power in balanced mode, I’m sure it will drive these headphones nicely.

Cannot wait to hear this combo.

You may not need the thin paper filter with something like the pleather pads at all. All peakiness has completely vanished from my Ref1s, without reducing their stunning timing qualities one jot. Mids are probably far more like what you are looking for, seanc6441. I'll look forward to hearing of your balanced cable journey!

 

[homesicalien]

The DT880 pads attach exactly the same way as the stock pads or the pleather.

Stock pads (either velour or material ones) are glued to a plastic ring which makes "click click" when pads are pressed into shells. How any replacement pads can be locked in the shells without glueing them to the plastic ring from the stock pads?

 

[jon parker]

I have a pair of Brainwavz pads for sale if anyone is interested. They are the nearest to the original 540 pads - leather sides and velour on top
Will save you a few $ as they are not cheap new! (I haven't used them, only for testing)

 

[jon parker]

Stock pads (either velour or material ones) are glued to a plastic ring which makes "click click" when pads are pressed into shells. How any replacement pads can be locked in the shells without glueing them to the plastic ring from the stock pads?

Easy peesey - 3 rolled up pieces of electrical tape on the back of the pad. Push the pad in and they stay in perfectly

 

[homesicalien]

I have a pair of Brainwavz pads for sale if anyone is interested. They are the nearest to the original 540 pads - leather sides and velour on top
Will save you a few $ as they are not cheap new! (I haven't used them, only for testing)

I can't argue with outcome of this mod, but how are any pleather pads anywhere near original pads? Neither of original pads used leather or pleather in space which is significant for sound.

 

[jon parker]

I can't argue with outcome of this mod, but how are any pleather pads anywhere near original pads? Neither of original pads used leather or pleather in space which is significant for sound.

Some people have reported that these specific pads are the closest modern produced pad to the original - Look up HD 540 review on YouTube to see a review using these pads
You cannot buy the original pads anymore hence there is so much discussion here about after market pads.
End of the day you just have to try and listen and see whether you like the sound or not
There are general rules for audio but results can often be surprising!

 

[seanc6441]

Got back in touch with Venus Audio. The mogami 2534 won’t fit in the 2.5mm plug so I would need to go for 2893.

I see both of these cables are ‘mogami star quad’ which I assume is a 4 wire configuration. However I’ve seen that mogami sell other types of cable.

Anyone here have experience with mogami cable for 2.5mm balanced custom cables?

Would appreciate some pointers so I can get an order in before my hiby R6 arrives