[jlingo]

I thought we already have a very advanced technology now. Why couldn't they make tubes which are more superior in sound quality compared to the ancient ones?

What seems to be the problem?

 

[928GTS]

This is because back in the day many companies had many fine,skilled craftsmen/women and managers who had special know how only learned from being around tubes and the respective manufacturing process for many years and they generally didn't write these secrets down and so at first when the industry began to switch it's focus to solid state components their expertise was lost at first by them being laid off and then later by their death. Its sort of like how we're still not sure how the Romans made certain things,a lot of their secrets weren't written down and so when they disappeared so did everything they knew.

Additionally since tube manufacturing isn't in the "mainstream" in the sense that a majority of today's products do not rely on tubes those who are still producing tubes do not have anywhere near the resources in both monetary or physical means to compare with the tube "giants" in the 40's and 50's and so they won't have quite the capability to produce tubes that were at the same caliber as those produced back in the golden age of tubes.

So the combination of the loss of "old world" secrets provided by the true tube geniuses of years past and the shift away from mainstream tube manufacture has caused today's tubes to not be manufactured to the same high standard as the tubes of yesteryear.

 

[IEATTEFLON]

My guess is no demand and most of the tooling and equipment to make them were either sold overseas or converted for other duties.

 

[braillediver]

It's probably as easy as making Coca Cola or Kentucky Fried Chicken without the recipes.

It’s only coke and fried chicken after all?


Ever watch some one who knows what they’re doing work compared to someone who is following instructions?


The huge volume of experience and the scale of production all played into making Old Stock tubes what they are.


Mitch

 

[jamato8]

I have a friend, retired now of course, who designed tubes for RCA. What a knowledge he has. What is needed to make tubes is art and science and without the two and many many years of dedicated experience and great need, you just don't get the same product. The cathode coating and even plate and metals and skill of the people on the line and distance of the wrapping and vaccuum (so very important to have a high hard vaccuum but often not even done well in times past).

 

[nikongod]

it should also be noted that the people who actually designed the tube are no longer even close to the production.

immagine what would happen if you stole the design for the Concorde airplane and tried to build one based on 2/3 of the "blueprints" and part designs....

yea, the new tubes are all built in the same country that did the above, or china...

 

[Jon L]

Quote:

Originally Posted by jlingo /img/forum/go_quote.gif I thought we already have a very advanced technology now. Why couldn't they make tubes which are more superior in sound quality compared to the ancient ones? What seems to be the problem?

On the contrary. New-production tubes CAN and DO sound better than "ancient" NOS ones.

I would say the new-production EML 45 tube is at least as good as any NOS 45 ever produced.

I can say the same about AVVT AV32B (300B) tube, which is a supreme tube.

The problem is there is so little demand compared to 1940-60's that the price of these super tubes have to be very high in order to break even or make a profit.

But even some of the "cheaper" new production tubes have great sound. The Shuagang Ecc83 is a rather nice-sounding tube, one which would embarrass many hyped NOS types, if perhaps not the truly great NOS ones.

Even the "lowly" Ei make some fine tubes, including the EL84 and 12AX7. They really do sound great compared to some really pricy NOS ones I have.

I just haven't found a very nice new-production tubes for 6SN7/VT231, but then again, I'm trying to outdo the incredible NoS tubes like National Union grey glass VT231..

 

[Konig]

im now in a dilemma.....

I thought tubes add their own distortion to the music. Im now considering an upgrade of my source to the transporter and maybe get a revelation audio precept power cord for the amp but i dont know if i will hear the difference with my stock tubes at all.

 

[braillediver]

"I would say the new-production EML 45 tube is at least as good as any NOS 45 ever produced."

But it's not the same. I haven't heard the tube but from reviews it's "different" from Old Stock 45's. I didn't say god or bad just different.


Mitch

 

[Jon L]

Quote:

Originally Posted by braillediver /img/forum/go_quote.gif But it's not the same. I haven't heard the tube but from reviews it's "different" from Old Stock 45's. I didn't say god or bad just different. Mitch

I suggest to you and anyone curious to try this. When you see any 45 amp playing anywhere, SET, PP, whatever, then try swapping out whatever unobtanium NOS 45's (or 245's) with EML solid plates.

I can understand if someone's preferences are different from mine, but IMO EML 45 is a new tube that preserves perfectly what's desirable about the "45-sound" while improving micro/macrodynamics, resolution, treble extension, bass power, PRAT, etc, etc.

 

[Solude]

Technically the newer tubes are better. But they are better in the way SS is better, meaning less tubey. Which kind of takes away the uniqueness of tubes to begin with.

So what you end up with a 'good tubes' that are actually poor tubes and 'poor tubes' which are actually good

But if you want good tubes... you'd prefer SS anyway since a good tube is still poor next to a SS on the bench.

Make sense?

 

[Duc]

Supply and Demand. There isn't exactly a big demand for actual new tubes. It is more ideal to mass produce cheap silicon transistors which take up little space than and last forever vs having to replace tubes every x ammount of hours. Most modern production tubes are going into guitar amps and aren't designed for critical use. Modern tubes that are actually being produced sound wonderful. I have a set of Ei Elites that I find very musical, colorful and fun to listen to, produced in Yugoslavia. I think Sovotec still makes current production tubes, along with a modern recreation on some Mullards. I have also heard good about Groove Tubes.

 

[jamato8]

I think the Yugo plant is shutting down for good and has already done so. Yes they produced some excellent tube and some that weren't so good, like everyone else but here good tubes are very good.