[iGig]

"When the time is right, you will find the answer within your heart."
Quote:

Originally Posted by jjcha I think Ken's right. I don't know what's different with this girl, versus the ones I've dated in the past. I've had relatively serious relationships (2 - 3 years) with some girls that I certainly could have happily lived the rest of my life with. But I don't know. It didn't feel right. I suspect I just wasn't ready. Maybe only now after having gone through those relationships and being a little bit older (I'm 31), this time it feels right. The idea of sharing the rest of my life with this girl is very comforting to me. Not because of ephemeral love or anything. There is that. But as that there is a person I want to have a deep, committed, relationship with. That life is no longer just about me (and believe me, life was very good when it was just about me), but it's about us. It's going to be hard, because to a large degree, I'm used to being a selfish, spoiled, self-centered brat (heh, if you haven't noticed). But my life is just richer and more rewarding with her in it and I don't feel that will change. I feel it will be even richer and more rewarding commiting to that on a permanent basis...

This is exactly the way I feel about my husband and the commitment we’ve made to each other by getting married. I’m very spoiled too (another surprise

) and I wouldn’t think of changing my selfish ways if it wasn’t for my guy. Thinking in terms of “us” was very challenging until I met him, he made it easy just by being a good man, I was ready for a commitment and everything fell into place. I used to think I'd be single forever and now I love being married.
Same with kids, I didn't want any and I hated how my family was always pressuring me to get pregnant. Like being a childless woman is wrong or something.

We were happily married for five years before we had our son, that's how I know that couples can be happy without kids. Well, we had a happy accident and now I'm growing motherly instincts I never suspected I had. Mom+dad working together to raise kids with strong family values as the nucleus of society with God's approval and blessings.

Bowraboy: not afraid to get old alone, although "growing old together" sounds romantic to me.

I also agree with Tyll about eHarmony. I found my husband on the yahoo personals, back when it was free.

I had a chance to pick and choose among many good guys and I don’t have any buyer’s remorse. Good deal.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tyll Marriage is much more about warm, comfy slippers, than about hot monkey sex---IMHO.

Sounds a little boring but is true.

 

[KYTGuy]

First, the caveats: I am on my second marriage; I am an Engineer, and a strange one at that (some women say that disables me from opining on this subject); and I am an old fart, so young'uns say that makes anything I say suspect!

Originally, I think in a village based culture, it was (besides the legal and religous reasons) duofold: to announce that this woman was off the market - that this man would be defending her, and to announce to the villagers who loved the two of them to give the couple helper gifts and money to begin their new life.

In later times, it came to be a "goodbye" party for the Bride, as the men were from elsewhere, and the bride may seldom or never visit the village of her birth again, and to ask for gifts to help them get going.

All of the elements from the preceeding were still functioning to one extent or another in each of my two marriages.

A few quick notes about me, sorry: I didn't date at all in early years, and had only a very few (like three) during High School, due to me being a geek and being busy with Football, Sportscars, Band, and Radio/Electronics pursiuts. When i was in College, it was a Male Only Military Academy, with limited contact with the opposite sex. Late in the College experience, I was allowed to Cruise the World on Merchant Ships, where the Engineering crew (the 'Black Gang" - an old term for engine room workers) sold all the scrap Brass, threw two parties in Bars in far off countries, and bought me the best whore avaailable, then sent me off with too much money in my pocket, and too much beer in my belly. It was for my 21st birthday, and she showed me what that thing was for... (please remember this was many years ago).

I followed her up with many "Ladies of the Evening", for a period of maybe four years, foreign and domestic - this was just before public awareness of AIDS.

My first marriage was to a girl who later said "I didn't want to let a good thing get away". She was barely making it as a shop girl, and was the first woman I had a long term relationship with...after 22 months of living together (my first at that) I figured that I "loved her" and that we "Should" get Married. It lasted 19 months, during which her culture and upbringing told her it was maybe OK, and surely was spicy to go dancing and getting high and drunk at Discos, while I was away earning a living for us. I guess, in light of her later statements, she knew it wasn't Love, and eventually tired of me/got a better offer/decided she wanted her freedom.

After that, I then did the Bachelor and dating scene right: dating, enjoying a variety of women in a more conventional (to our society) manner...

Then I met my now wife (25 years and still getting better).

It was SOO different!! I knew right away that thiis was a relationship better in every way than any before. I met her in february, never lived with her during courtship, and married her that October.

Even though I had lots of partners and friends during the dating period, and many sexual partners, there was no comparison how it was with my present wife. I then really knew Love. I am so happy she is my partner.

I completely believe that those who live with a partner before marriage, they are training themselves to think in their minds "this doesn't have to be forever' - and "I can always go with a better offer, a prettier/richer/sexier partner, if I want" Thus are the seeds of their own destruction sown. Even after they marry, those thoughts/attitudes are already built in to the relationship. That pushes them to split. Marriage adds pressure to stay together, as little or as much as the partners honor Marriage.

There are so many temptations and troubles that come at everybody in the course of their lives, that could tempt people just living together to say "I don't want to continue this", Marriage is another bond to help keep you together.

There are always Marriages that should never have been (like my first) and there are surely uncountable numbers of "living together" arrangements that work as well and as long as Marriages.

I believe that Marriage enables/encourages children. I really really love being a Daddy/Father. When the children get old enough to notice, what would I have had to say to a Daughter who asked me "Why aren't you married, Dad?" "Are you planning on leaving us? Don't you love Mom?" "Is something wrong with her/me/us? Do you love somebody more?"

 

[plainsong]

I can only approach the question from a personal standpoint, but my opinion would be if you have to ask, then now isn't the time. For myself and my husband, it was a natural next step, but anticlimatic in a way. My moving here after us being apart so long was the real "they lived happily ever after" ending. The marriage just made it "legal."

OTOH, my brother in-law never married his gf. They formed a partnership instead, so that legally they had all the spousal rights without actually being married, and that worked for them, they had a beautiful daughter and were trying for a second child before he died. They were as much partners as we were.

So I think whatever works for you, and try not to over-think it too much.

 

[felixkrull6]

Quote:

Originally Posted by DieInAFire If Evolution had its way, every man would own his own harem.

You might want to amend it to: If the male evolutionary line had its way, every man would own his own harem.

To add to what Scotty said about evolution, the fact that men and women are physically relatively similar in size also suggests that monogamy has been much more a part of our history than polygyny ever has been. Our testicle size compared to other primates also suggests that we are not the philanderers that some would have us believe.


From what I've read, marriage really started out as a financial arrangement between two families. Creating financial commitments more readily ensured that men would stay with women; thereby creating a more stable society. Women who think that outlawing polygyny was good for women are crazy; it really helped the young males trying to establish themselves. This is the only explanation that really makes sense to me, even more than the influence of religion. As for love, that's just modern hooey.


As to why people get married today, my personal favorites in order of what I consider to be most important are:

1) Fear of dying alone
2) Social pressures (includes religion)
3) Financial Stability

 

[PhilS]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scotty757 Oh, and per head-fi rules, lets not talk about the religious stuff. Don't want to get deleted!

Then the question can't be answered, or at a minimum, important information or points of view can't be offered without potentially violating forum rules.

That's the problem with these types of questions. It raises a issue that is semi-religious/political, and due to the forum rules, many of us cannot offer any advice or opinions.

 

[rock\]

I don't really have an answer to your question, but I will just tell you don't ever get married unless you're 100% sure that's what you want. It is one of the most challenging things you will ever do in life, even if you love that person more than anything.

 

[Torm]

If i remember my Dawkins right we are (mostly) monogamous because this ensures that the male is investing into his own offsprings future and not somebody elses offspring.

Interestingly - according to this theory it can pay to be a cheater. But only as long as there are very few cheaters around. Reason is that as a cheater (as in you try to mate with somebody elses female) you have a good chance to get another male to invest unknowingly into your offspring!

However if too many become cheaters, it swings back and it now starts to pay being monogamous and stop cheating as there are so many cheaters that nobody can even be sure if they have offspring (of the males). And you have a better chance of raising any offspring being monogamous.

This could swing back and forth forever but should stabilize at a ratio - says the theory (Evolutionary Stable System).

This stable monogamous to cheater ratio was calculated and matched statistical data terrifingly well (as far as i remember).

 

[cvince]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Azure But do you have to get "married" in order to do this? Why can't you be with someone forever without being "married" to them? Is marriage some sort of means that ultimately proves whether or not you and your lover actually love each other (So do you have to get married in order to be re-assured that your lover really loves you and wants to spend the rest of his/her life with you?)?

I'm unmarried, but that sounds right.

Marriage is supposed to be authentic, but seeing how many divorces there are nowadays, it's really not as sacred as it used to be.

 

[Edwood]

Quote:

Originally Posted by plainsong I can only approach the question from a personal standpoint, but my opinion would be if you have to ask, then now isn't the time. For myself and my husband, it was a natural next step, but anticlimatic in a way. My moving here after us being apart so long was the real "they lived happily ever after" ending. The marriage just made it "legal." OTOH, my brother in-law never married his gf. They formed a partnership instead, so that legally they had all the spousal rights without actually being married, and that worked for them, they had a beautiful daughter and were trying for a second child before he died. They were as much partners as we were. So I think whatever works for you, and try not to over-think it too much.

This is exactly how my marriage ended up. In fact we even eloped to avoid the whole ginormous ceremony. My wife was a very good friend of mine first, then we "lived in sin" together for many years. We travelled from city to city until we ended up in California. Marriage came about after the commitment was already there. Personally, the most important part was the legal protection of our shared assets. (of course, incorporating my company is better protection)

I will admit, the first time wearing our rings and calling each other husband and wife did have a bit of excitement to it. Perhaps because it is ingrained in our minds since childhood.

-Ed

 

[Scotty757]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Torm If i remember my Dawkins right we are (mostly) monogamous because this ensures that the male is investing into his own offsprings future and not somebody elses offspring. Interestingly - according to this theory it can pay to be a cheater. But only as long as there are very few cheaters around. Reason is that as a cheater (as in you try to mate with somebody elses female) you have a good chance to get another male to invest unknowingly into your offspring! However if too many become cheaters, it swings back and it now starts to pay being monogamous and stop cheating as there are so many cheaters that nobody can even be sure if they have offspring (of the males). And you have a better chance of raising any offspring being monogamous. This could swing back and forth forever but should stabilize at a ratio - says the theory (Evolutionary Stable System). This stable monogamous to cheater ratio was calculated and matched statistical data terrifingly well (as far as i remember).

QFT

 

[LFF]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tyll Hertsens Marriage is much more about warm, comfy slippers, than about hot monkey sex---IMHO.

BLASPHEMY!!!!!!!!























Aside from the immature comment - I would like to say...nah...hot monkey sex!!!!!!

 

[BRBJackson]

My wife and I got married LITERALLY so we could sleep in the same bed while visiting her relatives, and to shelter them from the public embarassement of having their daughter living in sin. We get royally screwed on our income taxes (2 large salaries, no kids), and have no other need to prove to anyone that we belong together for life. That said, her family thing was a strong influence, one I was willing to acquiesce to. Such is life.

 

[wallstreet]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scotty757 I think it is almost wholly genetic and evolutionary. It benefits the offspring greatly to have both male and female present throughout development (i.e. the male for protection and the female for nurture). I think it was hardwired into our genomes millions of years ago. Ultimately, our biological role is to reproduce and rear healthy offspring, and having two parents increases relative biologic fitness. Social constructs were, IMHO, built around this principle, even if none of them recognize it.

Actually committed/monogamous relationships do not make sense as a result of natural selection. The survival of a species depends upon them being able to reproduce, and the best way to do this is to mate with as many strong mates as possible.
Committed relationships only began to make sense when humans began to 'specialize' and form communities. Fighting for control of mates in a specialized society could cause great instability.
As for marriage specifically, it is a transformation of the above usually combined with cultural or spiritual/religious beliefs (which i wont get into for obvious reasons).

 

[chadbang]

Marriage is more than a word...it's a sentence.

 

[DanG]

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