[xxmastaxx]

Why did you return them? What was the problem?
Quote:

In my humble opinion if you have 400 save up and get some good speakers, you will be glad you did.
Another month or two of saving and you will probably be happier longer. Cheap speakers are just that.
I have heard the BX5A, actually had them in my house for a few weeks cranked up, etc. They were returned,
for just the reasons I first enumerated.

 

[AhhHoNG]

Quote:

Blind test or it's placebo.

Serious. you shuld try picking up a 2nd hand x-fi xtremegamer or xtrememusic someday and try it for yourself. set everything flat, no creative enhancement bullshts, its nt listenable at all. Pure muddy. however on essence ST flat, there are bass and highs which cant be found on the xtremegamer w/o any enhancement or eq. I tried 1 last time before i remove and rest my x-fi and was glad i had the ST on my table.

 

[Dalamar]

I had an Audigy 2 and it was perfectly fine. Until it started the crackling and went in the bin anyway. Setting aside the fact I stopped using onboard due to interference in games, the difference between my onboard (which measure worse than any x fi) and STX is completely marginal, certainly not worth the price difference.
 
If a card's response is not flat then it's perfectly logical to eq it - but audiophiles and religious are not logical.

 

[xxmastaxx]

bump

 

[mckinetic]

I returned the BX5A's for the exact reason I'm telling you to wait, ie., they are cheap speakers
which will need to be replaced sooner rather than later. If you buy try to get something used
or even reputable custom as there is real value there, often without spending much more. 
BX5A's are just big loud, heavy speakers that's my evaluation. 400 is your budget add another
400 and you may not have to replace them for a long, long time.

 

[xxmastaxx]

What if i dont want to spend that much money, remember this is a hobby to me, but i wouldnt spend that much money on it.
Quote:

I returned the BX5A's for the exact reason I'm telling you to wait, ie., they are cheap speakers
which will need to be replaced sooner rather than later. If you buy try to get something used
or even reputable custom as there is real value there, often without spending much more. 
BX5A's are just big loud, heavy speakers that's my evaluation. 400 is your budget add another
400 and you may not have to replace them for a long, long time.

 

[mckinetic]

Well if a hobby, I guess you are going to hobby along on shabby speakers for
a while. Buy what you can afford, when you can. There are real advantages in buying
quality, not so much buying too cheap, unless after saving for a few extra weeks, etc,
you absolutely can't afford it which truth would render this argument meaningless.

 

[mochimon]

Quote:

What if i dont want to spend that much money, remember this is a hobby to me, but i wouldnt spend that much money on it.

 

Just remembered something: the Adam Audio A5's have recently been discontinued and can easily be found for 500 dollars, brand new.  THESE ARE AMAZING SPEAKERS!!!!!!!!!!!  they do not need a sub.  they have absolutely astounding clarity, range, soundstage, dynamics and presence.  buy these.  you will have an awesome system.  buy these, or i will hate you.
 
also, IMHO, you need a dac.  Im not saying you need to drop thousands of dollars on one, but you do need SOMETHING.  the reason for this, beyond any SQ improvement (which i do think there is) is that computer audio-outs usually have polluted signals from all the other components in the machine.  often u will hear little bleeps and blips, just stray voltage running through the circuits.  I supposed its not something you need RIGHT THIS MINUTE, but eventually you should get one.  just look for something on auiogon.

 

[mckinetic]

I second the DAC, and also agree with not spending a great deal on it. I have the Apogee Duet,
which is pretty great from reviews and in my personal experience. There are cheaper units, I
went with the Duet as I also do some recording and also the Genelec 8020's terminate into 1/4 inch plugs which
the Duet accommodates nicely.
 
Adam Audio features ribbon tweeters I believe which you may appreciate.

 

[mochimon]

Quote:

I second the DAC, and also agree with not spending a great deal on it. I have the Apogee Duet,
which is pretty great from reviews and in my personal experience. There are cheaper units, I
went with the Duet as I also do some recording and also the Genelec 8020's terminate into 1/4 inch plugs which
the Duet accommodates nicely.
 
Adam Audio features ribbon tweeters I believe which you may appreciate.

lol, i use a Duet too.  It's a great piece of equipment.  The Apogee One is also something worth checking out. I have heard (but not researched for myself) that it uses the same DAC, so if all you intend to do is use it as a source, it could be a great component for you.  It also has a handy little built in mic of pretty high quality, that could come in very useful.  They can be had for 200 bucks, new.
 
edit: You might also want to look into something from HRT.  can't really say much about their stuff myself, but i remember there being quite a bit of hype a while back and them being fairly cheap. 

 

[rocknrolldoctor]

Check ebay they are some great deals on OK speakers you just have to wait of be flexable on what you want..

 

[BlackbeardBen]

Better yet, don't waste your money on shipping and get something from Craigslist or a local thrift or used record/CD store.  I picked up a pair of Polk Monitor 7 speakers for $40 and a Caver TFM-15CB amp (the third I've got) for $80 from Flat Black and Circular, a popular music store in East Lansing.
 
The Polks were a ridiculous steal at that price - but apparently nobody even knows what they are anymore, even at a vintage record shop.  You'd probably have to pay around $500 for a new pair of speakers to equal them.
 
I've heard stories of people finding Klipschorns (or was it some other Heritage Klipsch?) in thrift stores, McIntoshes free by the side of the road, etc.  You're probably not going to find anything like that, but there's lots of deals out there all the time.  One thing to keep an eye out for is Klipsch Heresys - they're all over the place used because pretty much every church and auditorium used them at one point.
 
Of course, all of those are really too big for what you want - desktop speakers.  I don't have much experience with monitors, but I do think you should look out for vintage models.  I'm a big fan of vintage Infinities - the EMIT tweeter is superb.  I wish I had a pair of Infinity Infinitesimal (the originals with a Watkins woofer), Modulus, or Kappa 5 bookshelf speakers.  All of those are somewhat rare but usually go for $400 or less (except the Infinitesimals in very good condition).
 
I've always wanted to try a pair of Boston Acoustic A40 bookshelf speakers, but I've never had a chance.  They're a lot cheaper, but with a good amp will probably perform as well or better than any of those computer monitors for a fraction of the price.
 
You'll need a decent amp to go with any of them, and unlike some here I agree that the DAC makes enough of a difference.  If you really can't tell the difference between a PC sound card's combined headphone jack & line out, you ought to upgrade the rest of your system or get your hearing checked.
 
I'm a big skeptic with audio, as an engineer.  Unfortunately, I don't have the means of setting up a meaningful blind test (no dB meter and rarely anyone willing to assist), let alone a rigorous double blind test.  I do think that many things make a big enough difference to be obvious without a blind test - like switching between most speakers, an under-powered amp, or with a poor performing source.
 
I had high hopes when hooking up my uDAC to my stereo as a source.  I had been pretty impressed with the uDAC so far as a DAC/headphone amp, but I wanted to see how it performed on my main system.  I have a pair of Infinity Renaissance 90s, powered by an Adcom GFA-555 on bottom and a Carver TFM-15CB on top, fed through a Carver C-11 preamp and with an NAD 5325 CD player with upgraded caps as a source.  The R90s are absolutely amazing - read the reviews at audioreview.com if you doubt me.  They don't have a perfect 5-star rating on that site with 33 reviews for no reason.  As a whole, the entire system is dynamic yet extremely neutral - it gives almost no distinct sound signature to reproduced sound.
 
Anyway, the NAD 5325 was NAD's first budget CD player - it's from the early nineties if memory serves me correct.  I bought it used with the upgraded caps, so I have no idea how it sounded stock.  As is, I've never noticed any flaws in it as a source - even through the Infinities.  I've often wondered if upgrading to a modern CD player would make a noticeable or even drastic difference, but as long as I'm able to keep it running I doubt I'll get a newer/better one.
 
So I figured that hey, the uDAC is a modern DAC - and at $100 and 20 years newer it ought to perform very well - if not handily exceed the performance of the NAD.
 
Well, I hooked it up to my preamp, using my Thinkpad as the transport.  Well, I was disappointed to say the least.  Compared to the NAD, it's quite muddy in the bass and lacks the same level of detail in the highs.  There is much less separation in the soundstage as well.  You can go ahead and call it the placebo effect if you'd like.  I don't really care.  There was definitely a big difference in how the two sounded.  And it's not what I expected.
 
Now, once you get past the point of neutral sounding DACs, I do seriously question the level of improvement.  It's the same thing with cables, I think.  Get speaker cables as short as possible with low enough resistance and there's no difference past that.  The difference between 20 year old, 30' long 16 Ga wire and brand new 10' long 12 Ga wire when driving a pair of 4 ohm speakers is quite noticeable.
 
Anyway, I hope you find something you like.  If you have the space and the time to find a pair of vintage bookshelf speakers and an amp to power them (I recommend sub-100 Watt amps from Carver, NAD, or Adcom to start with).  An external USB DAC would help but is definitely less important than the speakers.- the transducer that actually produces the sound is by far the most influential component in the system.  Spending an extra $100 now on the speakers/amp is much better than spending the money on a cheap DAC and wishing you had bought better speakers.
 
-Ben

 

[mckinetic]

Before purchasing the Duet, I had the ONE, and let me say, it is kinda spindly. The connectors
are very loose and just do not seem very likely to stand up to much use at all, kind odd for a
portable type device. On the subject of the Duet, I briefly considered the ONE's onboard mic,
and realized the Duet was the right way to go. The Duet is solid, easy, dare I say practical?

 

[mckinetic]

Also I want to plug Magnepan. If you are able to, at least go and listen to some. Even the middle of
the road Maggies are amazing! They are to this day still considered one of the best bang for buck
purchases. Not so much desktop speakers, but I'm just saying...

 

[kite7]

Quote:

I returned the BX5A's for the exact reason I'm telling you to wait, ie., they are cheap speakers
which will need to be replaced sooner rather than later.

You say it is a fact that they will fail without a doubt. Mine has yet to fail. I still wonder what sounds better than the BX5a at $200