[XpanD]

Hi all, first post on here.

I was wondering whether you guys could help me out with the choice of a new sound card. I have been working with an old onboard Realtek ALC888 for a while now, and while it does produce sound the quality is far from great. That's why I'm looking for an upgrade. I saw some really knowledgeable people on here regarding sound cards, so that's why I decided to ask here.

I am a gamer, though I use my computer to listen to music a lot too. I also watch movies every once in a while, but not that often.

My headphones are a pair of Creative Aurvana X-Fi ones, fed through my JVC amplifier. I like the sound the Crystallizer gives me on most songs, though I do not mind barely processed sound either.

My speaker setup is powered by a Denon PMA-520a (4x70w,8 ohm) with a JVC A-X3 (2x75w I think, 4ohm) daisy-chained to it, granting me a total of 6 speakers and 2 dedicated tweeters all pumping out a stereo signal over RCA. The Denon drives 4 Philips 22AH489 speakers, whereas the JVC drives 2 Philips 22AH482 speakers and 2 Hepta Tweety tweeters over the same output.

I will be needing a PCIe or USB sound card, with a preference for USB. I will be upgrading my entire computer soon, so an USB sound card would be the safest way to go considering I am going to be using 3 dual-slot video cards together.

I mostly use my speakers on my computer, though my headphones do see some good use at the darker hours of the day, as well as when I just feel like listening to them. Good speaker sound quality is the most important to me though.

I am from the Netherlands, so I might not be able to get every product that's mentioned. Auzentech, Creative and Asus cards are surely available though. My budget is about 150 euros max (about $220), though if need be I'll pay more. I'd rather pay much less though, if it gives me good quality as well.

And finally, I do not want a Creative product. I have an old X-Fi XtremeMusic laying around here, which is just crap. It doesn't even work on my current motherboard, but I never liked the quality much anyways. I also got the infamous screech of death quite a few times, and the drivers never wanted to work properly. Creative's customer "support" is a pile of crap as well.

I've heard Auzentech actually makes good X-Fi based products, and EAX5 would be nice, but I can't shake off the thoughts I'd just be getting another bad card with it. On the other hand Asus' Xonar series appeals to me for the supposed great audio quality, and they also have an USB-based product with good reviews (U1), which I have been interested in. However the lack of proper EAX support might not be great for when I play games...

So yeah... Sorry for the long post, I just really hope to finally get a proper answer to this question. What should I go with?

Thanks in advance!

 

[RobLikesBrunch]

The STX or the ST are pretty much unmatched at the $200 price point, especially considering the built-in amp.

I realize that three GPUs will take up a lot of space (and to me, really don't make sense whatsoever due to the high inefficiency of both CrossFireX and SLI...the third card will barely contribute and really isn't worth it...and given the longer console life times [and the fact we're in the middle of that life time], PC games haven't been radically improving in graphics lately such that even a year old 4870 HD can pretty much max every game on the market at the moment...so buying three GPUs at the moment is absurd) but you SHOULD be able to free up at least one PCI Express x1 slot or a PCI slot (the STX uses the x1 slot, the ST uses a simple PCI slot...it's argued the ST sounds better although I haven't been following it at all...the cards are highly similar, though).

 

[XpanD]

Hmm... Will the ST or STX do for gaming though? I heard there's a good few sound issues with EAX-supported games, which kinda scares me off there. Music and movie quality seems to be awesome though (though I'm wondering whether I'll notice that much difference over, say, a Xonar D2X on my current setup).

Also, what's the difference between the ST and STX apart from the slot? And why go for the ST considering PCI will probably disappear off of the consumer market sooner? I do want a sound card that lasts through a few builds...

Oh, by the way, that triple card setup will actually be two Crossfire'd GPUs (2x5770) and a NVIDIA GPU (either GT9800, GT240, GTS240 or GTS250) with custom drivers for dedicated PhysX - two-card Crossfire seems to perform pretty well, and I already have one card. I like ramping up the details to the limits on all the games I play, though I can't keep up with the market at all times so I'm gonna do it good while I have the chance.

PS. Does anybody here have any experience with the U1? Specifications don't look that special, but I like how it combines USB with a (to me at least) proven audio chip. Also, the price is really low at 58 euros.

 

[RobLikesBrunch]

Quote:

Originally Posted by XpanD /img/forum/go_quote.gif Hmm... Will the ST or STX do for gaming though? I heard there's a good few sound issues with EAX-supported games, which kinda scares me off there. Music and movie quality seems to be awesome though (though I'm wondering whether I'll notice that much difference over, say, a Xonar D2X on my current setup). Also, what's the difference between the ST and STX apart from the slot? And why go for the ST considering PCI will probably disappear off of the consumer market sooner? I do want a sound card that lasts through a few builds... And finally, that triple card setup will actually be two Crossfire'd GPUs (2x5770) and a NVIDIA GPU (either GT9800, GT240, GTS240 or GTS250) with custom drivers for dedicated PhysX - two-card Crossfire seems to perform pretty well, and I already have one card.

I can't comment on compatibility with games as I use Linux, but most people seem to be at the consensus that the card performs quite well in games...although the top of the line Creative X-Fi seems better suited...but is quite inferior in terms of music.

As for the differences between the STX and ST...they are subtle from the little snippets of info I've picked up. The ST can be expanded or something with a new board--I forget...I haven't been following it at all. I suppose you could look through this: http://www.head-fi.org/forums/f46/xo...k-peak-414322/. But if you're worried about compatibility, I say that your ability to reuse the card throughout builds far outweighs the minor improvements that the ST may have.

I didn't realize you were dedicating one card to PhysX...I had two 4870s briefly (while I still had Windows) and two other expansion cards as well as my Xonar STX plugged into an ASUS Rampage Formula and while it was so stuffed full of hardware that you couldn't see the motherboard, it all still fit...so you should be okay if you get a motherboard that has slots that cater to your needs.


....but I'd be weary on following any of my advice since I generally have no idea what I'm talking about compared to these crazy audiophiles.

Edit:
Here's my comp:

I replaced the top card with the STX...and it all fit fine still. If you get a single-slot Nvidia card for the PhysX card...you should be just fine with the right motherboard (as I still have two other slots taken up...one is a WiFi card, the other is a fan controller).

 

[Ra97oR]

I think that PCI really is not gonna go away anytime soon. So really up to you.

I take the ST as my PCI slot is far away from my GFX card and enable me to install a 3 slot cooler on it. Instead of STX, where it will block the third slot.

 

[XpanD]

Thanks for those replies.

I saw something earlier today by looking at the layouts of quite a few popular s1156/1366 motherboards - there's actually a good few that have 3 PCIe x16 slots, and an x1 slot right above the first one, which should work just fine for a good sound card as long as there are no big chipset heatsinks or memory modules in the way. I still like the idea of USB, but PCIe should not be a problem either.

As for PCI, I'd rather not want to risk it. PCI is an aging standard, and finding a suitable card for it while not having the GPUs blocked off for my next and possible future builds would be a big challenge, again looking at the layouts newer motherboards generally use.

If anybody has anything else to add to what has been said, whether it'd be experiences, recommendations, or just discussion, then please do!

 

[Bmac]

I'd also recommend the STX/ST. I just sold my STX, but I enjoyed it while I had it. I used it as my benchmark to A/B it with some much more expensive stand-alone DAC's and the STX was never embarrassed by any of them. In fact there were times when I would forget which source I was listening to and confuse them. The highs were slightly less natural than on some, and the bass not quite as well-defined as some, but on the whole, and especially given the price, it's a great card.

 

[XpanD]

Hmm... I have another question by the way - I just found two old Akai ADM-20 microphones, complete with a 6.3mm jack, and was wondering whether I could hook one of those up to the STX, and what the quality would be like.

They feel solid and have a small filter over the recording bit (I don't know about the proper terminology), but I don't have anything to test them with/on at the moment. Here are some specs I found:

- Directivity: Non-directional
- Output impedance: 600 Ohms
- Sensitivity: -78dB +-3dB (0dB = 1V/uBar)

I don't know much about these things, but if I could hook one of them up to the STX and get a fully functional mic that'd be another plus for it, especially since I don't have a proper mic at the moment.

 

[ROBSCIX]

You need to decide what is most imporant to you and decide from there.
Many new games are coming with their own audio engines.
Xonars fully support EAX 1,2 and have GX2.X drivers for higher level.
If gaming is of extreme importance to you then go for a Auzentech X-fi Forte or new HTHD. Both also have headphones amplifiers and replacable opamps.

Good Luck on your decision.

 

[XpanD]

Just wondering... How's the quality of the Auzentech X-Fi Forte? And how are the drivers? Does it work well under Windows 7 Ultimate x64? And would it fit the needs I outlined in the first post?

From how I see it now, the Xonar D2X, Xonar Essence STX and Auzentech X-Fi Forte all look like great cards. The price on the D2X and the Forte seems right, too, with the Forte being the cheapest one while seemingly offering decent sound and good game support. Looks like a good offer to me, even though I still have those X-Fi "traumas"...

Oh, and for a bit of a harder question: How do these 3 cards sound to you? As in, how much bass, mids, highs and distortion is heard? I personally like a nice pounding bass, as well as proper mids and highs - I don't like it when the highs are too shrill or when they even approach that. What card would fit my style the most?

I know I'm asking a lot, but I really do want to get this over with properly - I want to pick the card that'll give me the best overall experience, without having to doubt whether I made the right choice afterwards.

Once again, thanks in advance.

 

[XpanD]

Bumping...

I just read up a bit about the opamp swapping thing on the Essence STX, and even found a Dutch shop which has quite a few opamps for what seems to be pretty cheap. I can't be arsed reading through all the pages of that giant Essence STX thread though, so...

To start this off, I like deep bass. I listen to a lot of songs with a lot of bass (trance, hardtrance, hardstyle) and I really want to be able to feel the music. I also like well-pronounced (perhaps slightly deeper than usual) mid tones, though not over the top or anything. I am not a big fan of high sounds, though I do like it when it sounds natural to me. However, when it even approaches shrillness, I won't like it. I like spaciousness in my sound, but I do not want to lose my immersion in games.

I am not an audiophile by any means, but from what I've read I do think I would be able to hear the changes different opamps would give me, and they're pretty cheap anyways. So yeah, what would you recommend?

Also, is it easy to swap these things out? And what should I be looking out for? I have a small flat-head screwdriver if need be, and I have swapped BIOS chips on older motherboards before, but... I don't want a 160 euro paperweight if I mess something up.

If all of this is possible and it will make a big difference, I will be going with the STX. I only have a stereo speaker setup and a pair of stereo headphones anyways, so I doubt I'll miss much with the EAX5 game immersion. Besides, it looks like EAX is dying off anyways, so yeah...

Still want to know about the mic thing too, by the way.


PS. Does anybody here know farnell.com? That's the place I found for these opamps, so...