[EsthetiX]

I tried to put this in the speaker section but it keeps saying I have limited access and cannot go there.

I have a new 2 door civic and I want to get set up with some decent speakers. I do not care about car rattling extreme bass or how loud it can go. All I'm interested in is clarity over the entire frequency spectrum and I listen at reasonable volumes. Not too loud but enough to hear all the detail easily.

So I'm looking into 4 speakers, 10" subs, and some kind of cheap amp that doesn't color the sound too much. Also, I need bass that has a really tight fast punchy response.

Directed Audio was recommended to me. Anyone have any experience?

My budget is $300-400 lower the better though. What's my best bet?

 

[oicdn]

You don't need 2 subs. Two is just nonsense if all you're after is SQ and clarity. Grab one, and save yourself the cost of a higher wattage amp, thicker gauge wires, and trunkspace.

As for brand...$400....Sony X-Plod can get you a decent sound. MUCH MUCH better than stock, but $400 isn't going to get you much when you need a complete system. Seriously though, for low end car Audio X-plod is OK, especially for your pricerange, you could get your subs, headunit and speakers for that much if you goto walmart.

I used to be sponsored by Boston Acoustics and was always surprised by the people who ran X-Plod at how decent it sounded for the price paid. Also, it's readily available.

 

[EsthetiX]

I only meant one sub. but yah, im not a fan of ridiculous bass.. (although I did enjoy my dt7770's but that's a whole different story).

You're the first audiophile person I have heard recommend those sonys though. Some other people told me that for the money they're not really a good choice. I guess I'll go give them a listen, might as well now.

 

[oicdn]

Well, I was going based on your budget. And IMO, looking in retrospect, you're doing it right.

I spent thousands upon thousands just keeping my car rig current and for what? That car has been long sold. It's nice to have all that, but honestly, it's not worth it at all seeing as how LITTLE time you're in your car by comparison. Now, if you are like a taxi driver or something where you're driving ALL DAY, MAYBE it'de be worth it, but when you factor in the added insurance premiums, and possible theft, it boils back down to it not being worth it IMO.

But for the budget you have, I'de go with the Sony's hands down. It beats any of the Optimus, Pyle, and other junk out there. And you can give it a listen in Walmart and likely find a package deal that Sony offers to Wally world only. Believe it or not, it sounds MUCH better in your car than it does on that crap wall set-up.

 

[Basil101]

The biggest problem with expensive car audio setups is that they are vulnerable to theft, so turn this to your advantage, most police forces will have a dispersal auction of all lost property and recovered stolen goods were the owner couldn't be traced. They will turn up the odd gem (ie Sony headunit cost me £20 with RRP of over £120) and are well worth it.

 

[Electro Point]

There is a lot you can do for a budget system that has great sound.

First, just replacing the speakers will not do that much if your using the factory stereo because the factory stereo cannot supply enough power to make the speakers perform to the fullest; Aftermarket stereo with stock speakers is about the same. You get a bit improved performance but still not that big of a difference.

To start off one tip is to forget about your rear speakers, you want the sound in front of you and your rear speakers are just to fill in some ambient sound behind you.
Spend your money on a more expensive set of high quality front speakers rather then 4 low-end speakers.

Your headunit is the life of your system or rather very important. Buy one that has the sound adjustment features that are useful and one that sounds good instead of one just for looks. I recommend Pioneer or Alpine.

Then for your amplifier to power your front speakers, try to get the "best" you can buy. Look for one that is CEA-2006 compliant for it's power rating.
I myself have wasted on a cheap 2-channel amp and it was horrible, had to upgrade.

After you have this, See if your speakers alone have enough bass before adding a subwoofer into your stereo. (Seeing that you do not want a booming loud bass system)

 

[oicdn]

^ you have to remember, most cars, the REAR speakers are the ones that are driven harder.

Example? Take a Civic or Cavalier, or even Mercedes. The front speakers will be where your details are, whereas the back speakers are what give you your volume. That's why MANY cars have puny 4x6 or cheapo small speakers up front, with beefy 6x9s, 6.5s or 7.25s in the rear. The rear gives you your volume and mids, where the front also gives you your mids, but like you said, the front is where everything is noticed.

So it's important to spend an equal amount of money out back so that when it's turned up, it won't sound like crap (which aftermarkets up front, with stockers in the rear, will sound like crap, especially with an aftermarket HU or even worse, amp powering them).

But you're right, just replacing the speakers won't be DRAMATIC, it'll definitly be cleaner, and more shrill cause the HU can't drive them properly, but it'll be noticeable. Same goes for a HU on it's own, it won't do much on it's own, the sound will change, noticeably, but not dramatically.

I hate car audio....it's like a boat, it's just a money pit. I ride a motorcycle so I can avoid needing to buy a stereo for a car, lol.

 

[Electro Point]

^ Not all car have tiny speakers in the front, just FYI 6x8" in the front and 6x9" in the back for me.

But to each preference, If you want your soundstage coming from behind you, do spend money on your rear speakers. Usually rear speakers tend to ruin your front imaging and the soundstage appear right in front of you as it brings the stage to the center of the car or to the rear.

 

[Gonz]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Electro Point /img/forum/go_quote.gif ^ Not all car have tiny speakers in the front, just FYI 6x8" in the front and 6x9" in the back for me. But to each preference, If you want your soundstage coming from behind you, do spend money on your rear speakers. Usually rear speakers tend to ruin your front imaging and the soundstage appear right in front of you as it brings the stage to the center of the car or to the rear.

If he's using factory locations (stock mounting), he's not going to get good imaging to begin with. If you're concerned with a proper soundstage, you'd be doing a custom install with kicks and custom tweeter placements, not using Walmart coaxials in the doors.

Lets be realistic here.


The guy has a Walmart budget. This is fine, I've done great things with that kind of cash. Install makes alot of difference, almost anything can sound good if you install it right.

Headunit is important, because you want line outs. A pair minimum, 2 pairs even better. Sony headunits are very nice for cheap, also Walmart used to carry a brand called "Xtreme Sound", it's made by Koss. I still have one around here, it was quite nice for $60 and the warranty... well, I had one for about 5yrs till it acted a little weird, and Koss did an exchange with a new one for $30. Nicer current model too. Can't beat that, Pioneer would tell you to go screw.

Sony Xplode amps do what they say they will. I had one running some 6.5" Lightning Audio coaxials and I was surprised how nice it sounded. Durable stuff too. I would recommend Lightning Audio speakers any day, $30 or less a pair. I would run front and rear coaxials, with a 4ch Sony amp.

Get an install kit and hook your amp up properly. Power and ground cables are important.

You'll probably want a separate amp for your sub, a class D monoblock for that is the cheapest way to go, but a 2ch bridged is fine too. Your best bet for tight bass on the cheap, is to find a 10" sub pre-mounted in a sealed enclosure. No ports, no bandpass.

This for example suits what you originally were asking for. The enclosure is well made for a pre-fab, and it should make you happy for bass. They have single sub boxes too. I've dealt with that vendor, and they're quite good people to buy from. Phoned me to let me know an amp was on order and would be delayed about a week, I had it in 3 days. The call was nice though.

 

[-=Germania=-]

You can pick up a decent sub for about $150 with enclosure either used or at a local audio place. Get a cheap Pyle amp ( the name says it all) and don't believe the wattage that it says - cut it in have or count it as 1/3rd. They work when you take that into account.

However --- in your circumstance... I would suggest some very nice 2 ways put in your car and forget the sub altogether. If all you are after is SQ - that is the best for your budget. I would try and buy a used Alpine reciever and get the side panels.

 

[GreatDane]

I use an Eclipse HU and was using one of those Sony Explode 4 channel amps originally to drive 2 10" subs( bridged into 2 ch.). It worked OK. After I bought a nice mono amp to drive some newer 10" subs I began using the Explode amp to drive 2 pairs of speakers (Infinity & MB Quart at the time). Before using the Explode amp for the main speakers I used the HU to drive them and it sounded better and drove them almost as loud as the "800 watt" Explode(yeah right).

Now I use the Eclipse HU to drive a pair of Eclipse 5x7 Point Source for the door speakers and an older pair of Alpine 5x7 for behind the seat in an F-350.



My point is that for sane listening levels I don't feel an amp is needed if you use a decent HU and in my case the HU amp sounded better.

 

[Electro Point]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gonz /img/forum/go_quote.gif If he's using factory locations (stock mounting), he's not going to get good imaging to begin with. If you're concerned with a proper soundstage, you'd be doing a custom install with kicks and custom tweeter placements, not using Walmart coaxials in the doors. Lets be realistic here. The guy has a Walmart budget. This is fine, I've done great things with that kind of cash. Install makes alot of difference, almost anything can sound good if you install it right. Headunit is important, because you want line outs. A pair minimum, 2 pairs even better. Sony headunits are very nice for cheap, also Walmart used to carry a brand called "Xtreme Sound", it's made by Koss. I still have one around here, it was quite nice for $60 and the warranty... well, I had one for about 5yrs till it acted a little weird, and Koss did an exchange with a new one for $30. Nicer current model too. Can't beat that, Pioneer would tell you to go screw. Sony Xplode amps do what they say they will. I had one running some 6.5" Lightning Audio coaxials and I was surprised how nice it sounded. Durable stuff too. I would recommend Lightning Audio speakers any day, $30 or less a pair. I would run front and rear coaxials, with a 4ch Sony amp. Get an install kit and hook your amp up properly. Power and ground cables are important. You'll probably want a separate amp for your sub, a class D monoblock for that is the cheapest way to go, but a 2ch bridged is fine too. Your best bet for tight bass on the cheap, is to find a 10" sub pre-mounted in a sealed enclosure. No ports, no bandpass. This for example suits what you originally were asking for. The enclosure is well made for a pre-fab, and it should make you happy for bass. They have single sub boxes too. I've dealt with that vendor, and they're quite good people to buy from. Phoned me to let me know an amp was on order and would be delayed about a week, I had it in 3 days. The call was nice though.

Excuse my ignorance in my previous post. Reconsidering that he is on a tight budget again and less spent is better, and the front speakers are tiny in this situation.

I think he should just get a Pioneer headunit and 4 quality speakers. (Priced each around 80-100$ a pair.) And just forget about the amps and subwoofers because that seems over the budget now its already close to 350-400$. This is just a basic system and likely easier to install than running cables and trying to mount your the amp and placement of the sub.

I highly recommend Pioneer headunit because they have great SQ and a bunch audio features so it is the better bang-for-the-buck IMO. It has high and low pass filters, a very useful tunable EQ which you can set to different frequencies for each band (High, Mid, Bass) and also how you want the EQ to boost or attenuate which frequencies you choose. This next feature is great and its called Front Image Enhancer (FIE) and it attenuates the highs and mids from your rear speakers so you are just getting bass from the rear to help your small front speakers while keeping the sound appearing in the front of the car.
Compared to Sony, The pioneer performs better then the one I used to have and compared to some my friends have.



Below are links for 2 Pioneer headunit which are excellent choice with all the features I mentioned included.
Pioneer DEH-P2900MP CD receiver with MP3/WMA playback at Crutchfield.com
Pioneer DEH-P3900MP CD receiver with MP3/WMA/AAC playback at Crutchfield.com

 

[Gonz]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Electro Point /img/forum/go_quote.gif Excuse my ignorance in my previous post.

It wasn't ignorant at all, just not realistic. I don't get the impression he's going to be glassing up some kickpods for his new Civic.

Theres the best most proper way to do things, the best most expensive gear to do it with... and then theres ways to do things on a budget, and low priced gear that can be expected to perform as advertised.

I've had surprising results. I've done projects like this for the sole purpose of proving it can be done. (and to help out friends on budgets) But anyways...



Quote:

I think he should just get a Pioneer headunit and 4 quality speakers. (Priced each around 80-100$ a pair.) And just forget about the amps and subwoofers because that seems over the budget now its already close to 350-400$. This is just a basic system and likely easier to install than running cables and trying to mount your the amp and placement of the sub.

I've done alot of comparisons with speakers running off the headunit, and then amped. A/B type comparos, even using Sony Xplode amps with a measly 60w x4 RMS. There is definitely a difference, and I would never settle for unamped speakers. Aftermarket Headunits do a damn lousy job of driving aftermarket speakers. Yes it'll work, but at volume, you definitely get distortion. Common sense here... a dedicated amp is 99% of the time, better than something integrated into a $100 headunit. If this wasn't the case, theres whole sections of this website we could just throw away.


The sub is debatable I guess. Not for me, as I like to feel a kick drum, but for a budget system, it can always wait till later.


Running a positive cable off the battery, through a pre-existing hole in the firewall, and down along the door sills is a cinch. 5 minutes work. Especially in a newer car. The ground is even easier. No excuses here.

It doesn't need to be 0Ga, in this case, 200 or 400 watts, a 4Ga cable could be run to the back of the car, and a distro block used to split the 4Ga out to two short 8Ga cables to feed two amps.


This is why stuff often doesn't sound good. People don't put the minimum of effort into doing things the right way to allow the gear to perform well. $400 is a perfectly fine budget to work with, at least a great start in the right direction... investing it wisely means a little sweat equity to get more out of it.

 

[oicdn]

What kind of car do you have?

I know GM and Toyota headunits are fairly clean and strong for factory headunits, even if the speakers they use are garbage. You could possibly get by on just speakers, sub and an amp running off the factory headunit and be fairly surprised.

But I would stick to going to wally world and snagging up some xPlod stuff. Gonz is right, it's about synergy, and as said by him, and previous experiances I've seen first hand, you can have an OK sounding system for pennies on the dollar, reletively speaking of course.

 

[smallmouth]

Quote:

Originally Posted by oicdn /img/forum/go_quote.gif I spent thousands upon thousands just keeping my car rig current and for what? That car has been long sold. It's nice to have all that, but honestly, it's not worth it at all seeing as how LITTLE time you're in your car by comparison. Now, if you are like a taxi driver or something where you're driving ALL DAY, MAYBE it'de be worth it, but when you factor in the added insurance premiums, and possible theft, it boils back down to it not being worth it IMO.

I was into car audio several years back and spent gobs of cash and I have to agree with this sentiment. Car audio is fun, but is a terrible return for the investment.

That being said, even some decent mid-price-range speakers (Boston Acoustics had some great options at the time) and a modest amp can give you a noticeably better-than-stock sound. If you have ports for 6x9 speakers in the rear, forget the sub and but a decent pair of those instead. They'll provide enough bass and it will be money much better spent than spreading your budget thin to include a crappy sub.