[Shike]

Honestly there is no stead-fast rule. Distortion and transient response issues are generally so small or non-existent on good quality modern dynamics that it makes me questions stats for a lot of reasons. I own a pair of stats, currently need to refurbish them, but I'm hardly classifying it as a priority for this reason.

 

[pearljam5000]

What dynamic headphones sound closest to electrostatic?
Quote:

Originally Posted by Shike /img/forum/go_quote.gif Honestly there is no stead-fast rule. Distortion and transient response issues are generally so small or non-existent on good quality modern dynamics that it makes me questions stats for a lot of reasons. I own a pair of stats, currently need to refurbish them, but I'm hardly classifying it as a priority for this reason.

 

[Shike]

Quote:

Originally Posted by pearljam5000 /img/forum/go_quote.gif What dynamic headphones sound closest to electrostatic?

Here's the problem with that question . . . which electrostat? They don't all sound and measure the same. For example if talking about a Stax SR5 it sounds close to a K701.

It's to the point where you can no longer say there's a true sound for either. To say there's a dynamic sound would to be saying Grado, Denon, AKG, etc all sound the same or share a similar sound when that couldn't be further from the truth. The same holds true for electrostats.

If you want me to qualify my earlier statement about distortion and transient response though, most modern dynamics have a distortion of less than 1%. Combine this with the ability to produce higher frequencies accurately, depending on the phone, demonstrates transient response (a driver must have a fast transient response to produce higher frequencies by definition). Lastly, consider the mass of a headphone driver and you'll start to get the idea.

Electrostatics aren't mystical by any means . . . well, not until you get to speakers where distortion products can be quite a bit higher (10% is quite common on dynamics). Then I'd fully suggest investing in them, ribbon, planar, etc.

Of course you'll find people that demand an insane transient response which will go far beyond their ability to hear as an end all. If that's what they want more power to them, but I hardly consider it a huge advantage.

 

[Happy Camper]

I run a 15" servo Velodyne with surround system Martin Logans. They are a hard match to integrate. I understand the ML subs do sound more musical than the big subs. The big sub moves a lot of air so trying to match the output of the panel/woofers takes a lot of listening/tweaking. (I don't think a large sub can be tamed to match the musical delicacy needed) The ML sub use three 8" drivers which is a decent compromise for accuracy/thump.

The 701/ety sound is similar to stats. Stats will blow them away in shear detail retrieval but not bad dynamic substitutes.

 

[krmathis]

Quote:

Originally Posted by vcoheda /img/forum/go_quote.gif stats = hear more. dynamics = feel more.

I think you nailed it, with just 6 words..

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gbjerke /img/forum/go_quote.gif Surprises me why not more people take the plunge and match stats with a subwoofer. Best of both

Because there are little need to.
Cause there sure are electrostatic headphones with plenty bass, both in extension, punch and volume. The Stax O2 to name one..

They do not come close to the bass punch (for bass heads) of some of the moving coil ones.

Quote:

Originally Posted by pearljam5000 /img/forum/go_quote.gif What dynamic headphones sound closest to electrostatic?

Which electrostatic? They are just as varied in sound as moving coil headphones...

That said I find the AKG K1000 have some of the speed and sparkling highs of the Stax SR-007, but certainly not the same bass performance.
Closest I have found so far to the higher end electrostatic ones.

 

[edstrelow]

While excellent transient response is a much discussed advantage of stats there are others as well including reduced intermodulation distortion.

Electrostatic diaphragms generally have a large area, frequently orders of magnitude larger than dynamics, (although still incrediblly light) so while you don't get large displacement of the stat membrane, you move more air due to the size of the diaphragm. This trade-off of size vs displacement works well with phones and less well with speakers because you just need to move more air. Think how much larger a dynamic woofer is than a tweeter.

However because of their smaller displacement stats will show less Doppler type of distortion, essentially intermodulation, since the stat diaphragms don't move as much or as far. Dynamic speakers try to get around this problem by using multiple drivers, tweeters, mid range and woofers but this is less practical for dynamic headphones.

 

[pearljam5000]

excellent explanation edstrelow,thanks

Quote:

Originally Posted by edstrelow /img/forum/go_quote.gif While excellent transient response is a much discussed advantage of stats there are others as well including reduced intermodulation distortion. Electrostatic diaphragms generally have a large area, frequently orders of magnitude larger than dynamics, (although still incrediblly light) so while you don't get large displacement of the stat membrane, you move more air due to the size of the diaphragm. This trade-off of size vs displacement works well with phones and less well with speakers because you just need to move more air. Think how much larger a dynamic woofer is than a tweeter. However because of their smaller displacement stats will show less Doppler type of distortion, essentially intermodulation, since the stat diaphragms don't move as much or as far. Dynamic speakers try to get around this problem by using multiple drivers, tweeters, mid range and woofers but this is less practical for dynamic headphones.

 

[MikoLayer]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Happy Camper /img/forum/go_quote.gif I run a 15" servo Velodyne with surround system Martin Logans. They are a hard match to integrate. I understand the ML subs do sound more musical than the big subs. The big sub moves a lot of air so trying to match the output of the panel/woofers takes a lot of listening/tweaking. (I don't think a large sub can be tamed to match the musical delicacy needed) The ML sub use three 8" drivers which is a decent compromise for accuracy/thump. The 701/ety sound is similar to stats. Stats will blow them away in shear detail retrieval but not bad dynamic substitutes.

Does that mean if one finds K701 a bit too sterile, emotionless and uninvolving compared to other dynamic cans, he is less likely to fall in love with stats? I somehow doubt this though, just about anything I have read hear points to superior "musicality" of HE90 and O2 over all the competition (if you can call them that) from the dynamic camp

 

[Shike]

Quote:

Originally Posted by MikoLayer /img/forum/go_quote.gif Does that mean if one finds K701 a bit too sterile, emotionless and uninvolving compared to other dynamic cans, he is less likely to fall in love with stats? I somehow doubt this though, just about anything I have read hear points to superior "musicality" of HE90 and O2 over all the competition (if you can call them that) from the dynamic camp

From what you read according to their ears and their perception.

 

[MikoLayer]

Yep, but thats all I have at disposal at the moment; I just can't see myself getting anything electrostatic any time soon, especially with all that I have spent on the dynamic setup in the past week. Call it an unfounded prejudice if you will, but I just wanted to have some idea of what to expect, confirm or dispel if I ever get to own one in the future