[HookedOnAudio]

   
-Allow me to quote the Benchmark Media DAC2 manual, specifically page 61, where it lists the headphone amplifier specs:
 
Output impedance: <0.11 ohms
Output range (at 0dBFS) into 60 ohm load: off to +17dBu (5.5Vrms, my comment)
Bandwidth: >500kHz
THD+N: -106dB, 0,0005% into 30 ohms at +18dBu (1.26W)
 
That should do nicely even for the most discerning audiophile.

 
Sorry for jumping in from the side, but please allow me to ask the experts a quick question.
 
When specs like the above are listed, how do you convert that to the mW or W power output number?  (I do understand that you would have to pick a few resistance values to calculate - i.e. 32 Ohm or 64 Ohm headphones, etc.)

 

[OddE]

Back to the value proposition. In US the benchmark DAC 2 retails for close to USD 2000 plus tax and shipping. Not exactly a bargain compared to many "consumer" oriented options!

 
-I guess value depends...
 
Compared to some of the audiophile offerings, a $2k DAC is not particularly expensive (It even does DSD, for those who are into that kind of thing); neither is a $2k headphone amp - or a $2k preamp, which the DAC2 also does well if you haven't got too many analog sources - and who has, nowadays?
 
Heck, you can even get interconnects for your $2k+ audiophile DAC and $2k+ audiophile headphone amp which will set you back more than $2k!
 
Pro audio gear isn't necessarily cheap; but it probably has a better bang/buck ratio than most, if not all high-end stuff.

 

[OddE]

 
For fun I'm looking at a heavily modified  Art MPA Pro II digital to stick in between SS DAC and Amp to add tube warmth when the mood strikes. Yes it's stupid, yes it will "degrade" SQ - but hey it might sound great to me ...

 
-Finally someone who's got it! If it sounds great to you, then what does it matter if it doesn't measure perfectly flat?
 
(I am considering a valve headphone amp for the exact same reason. I happen to like valves/tubes - whether it is because of the sound or the old-school aura going along with them, I am not entirely certain... )

 

[OddE]

   
Sorry for jumping in from the side, but please allow me to ask the experts a quick question.
 
When specs like the above are listed, how do you convert that to the mW or W power output number?  (I do understand that you would have to pick a few resistance values to calculate - i.e. 32 Ohm or 64 Ohm headphones, etc.)

 
-The power can be calculated as the square of the voltage applied across the headphone divided by the impedance (Just one way out of several!)
 
In this case, when the voltage is given as +17dBu you'll have to engage in a bit of logarithmic math first - 0dBu is 0.775 volts or so, so +17dBu is 0.775*10^(17/20)=5.5V. (There's probably at least a dozen calculators online which will get the conversion done for you)
 
So, voltage squared, divided by impedance as in the example from the manual: 5.5V*5.5V/60 ohms = 0.5W.

 

[MLGrado]

Sure!  I would LOVE to have a Merging Horus or Hapi to play around with!  Or a Meitner DAC...
 
And what about Lavry?  Aren't they considered 'pro'?  Damn fine stuff, regardless if its pro or consumer.  
 
Emotiva makes a 'pro' DAC, the Stealth, that gets a lot of nice reviews.  
 
Apogee?  Makes some killer sounding ADCS and DACS.  Matter of fact, one of the finest home theater processors I ever owned used an Apogee clock.  
 
The aforementioned Grace and Benchmark DACS...

 

[RonaldDumsfeld]

There was a well known example 3 years ago where it was demonstrated that a $150 DAC could be audibly transparent i.e. sound identical to the Benchmark DAC mentioned above.
 
In that context spending $2,000 on a basic stereo DAC in 2015 is not so much extravagant as downright decadent.
 
Here is a better example of what I meant by value.
 
 
 

 
This is an Audio-GD NFB-1S. It is often recommended here as a 'budget' reference DAC and as such it is excellent I am sure. Assuming the customs man doesn't get involved this would cost me ~ 550 Euros after p&p etc. You can connect it via USB to a PC or via S/PDIF to a games console or CD optical out. Nice balanced outs for active monitors. In audio interface terms it is a zero in/ 2 out interface. No volume control, no headphone amp. no software. Pretty basic
 
http://www.audio-gd.com/Pro/dac/NFB1S/NFB1SEN.htm
 
Now for significantly less money I could get one of these.
 

 
An SPL Crimson. ~450 Euros. This is a fully featured 6 in and 6 out interface. Utterly transparent audio. Connect up to two sets of line outputs with volume control plus 2 discrete headphone amps built in. It has S/PDIF I/O and will also connect to a tablet. You can connect anything at all to the 6 inputs, CD player or any other line level sources, microphones, instruments or anything with. All the input and output channels can be used independently and usually simultaneously. They can be recorded at the click of a button.
 
http://spl.info/en/products/interfaces/crimson/in-short.html
 
If you wanted alternatives at the same price. The  MOTU Ultralite has more channels and phenomenal Cuemix control software. RME Babyface has the best software on the planet and stylish looks, Audient id22 has a nice form factor and TOSlink.
 
I'm not claiming the pro audio gear necessarily sounds any better than the current audiophile equivalents but it certainly doesn't sound worse and it's so much more versatile for the same price.
 
Check them out - particularly if you have or intend to get a pair of active monitors to compliment your existing set up.

 

[MLGrado]

  There was a well known example 3 years ago where it was demonstrated that a $150 DAC could be audibly transparent i.e. sound identical to the Benchmark DAC mentioned above.
 

 
 
Well, considering a $1500 DAC  probably has about $150 worth of audio parts in it, not surprising that it COULD be done.   Well, that 10 percent figure comes from a well known designer in the industry who has a pretty good idea what these things actually cost to build.  Depending on the company, where the product is built, how it is marketed, etc. of course that figure could be quite different. 
 
Suffice to say, though, expensive 'audiophile' products can and often do have a ton of markup.  Lots of hands involved, lots of people need to get paid along the way.  
 
 
I wish I was skilled enough to make my own DAC.  The parts are the least expensive ingredient.  Time, and most of all expertise, are the expensive things...

 

[BeatsWork]

 
-Finally someone who's got it! If it sounds great to you, then what does it matter if it doesn't measure perfectly flat?
 
(I am considering a valve headphone amp for the exact same reason. I happen to like valves/tubes - whether it is because of the sound or the old-school aura going along with them, I am not entirely certain... )

 


I am not an "Audiophile". I want to listen to the music I want to listen to in a way that is pleasing to me. Is it flat? Don't care. Download tracks by "Sarah Bublebaker" because it's the "most accurate recording and mastering of a female vocalist" achieved to date - no thanks!

Clearly there are many schools of thought and I greatly appreciate that all are tolerated and civil to each other at Head-Fi. Go ask for a recommendation on a Tube Amp (or even pro vs. consumer gear) on "Element H"Audio Forum and you will be immediately smacked down -vigorously- for implying that "tube amps could in some way be preferable to SS" [Ditto Pro vs. Consumer gear] without documented DBT and 10 pages of spectrograms.