redchiro
New Head-Fier
- Joined
- Jan 14, 2006
- Posts
- 17
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As a newbie, it's been fun reading all the different viewpoints on headphones and amps here at HeadFi. Thanks to all.
I have found it interesting to read about the Sennheiser "veil" and the fact that many prefer the HD-600 over the HD-650 and visa versa. I also see that some folks think the differences btw the 580/600/650 are pretty minor.
I think the differences are large enough to hear without too much trouble and definitely enough to determine a buying preference.
Using a Sony XA-777ES, a Perreaux SXH1, (as well as playing around with the headphone jacks of the XA-777 and my Sony DA-7ES rcvr.), these are my initial impressions:
1. I prefer the HD-650. My taste, no more, no less.
2. I am not sure which is more accurate, but the most obvious and important difference for me is the HD-650 is less sibilant (vocal sss's and percussion).
3. The HD-650 does have a more pronounced bass range and it always is there underpinning whatever is playing. I like it, but I can see how some would say it could be artificially boosted a hair and that the HD-600 is more balanced from top to bottom. The difference is not huge, but it is very obvious switching btw 'phones. Frankly, I don't mind the overall warmth the increased bass seems to add to the HD-650.
At first it sounds as if the HD-650 is a tad "muddy", and maybe a little less dynamic and "slower". But, upon switching back and forth, to my ears, all the info and detail is there. I think the perception is an aural "illusion" due to the bass response and less grainy highs. I simply find the HD-650 a little smoother with my system.
4. I do not find the HD-600 to sound "sweet" up top as I have read. I don't find it to be laid back particulary either. Maybe it is compared to other 'phones. The 600 is not overly aggressive by any means, but the HD-650 is more liquid at the extremes and not at the expense of lost detail. I think this is a refinement in the development of the Senn flagship line. I could imagine that the 'phones were voiced using solid state products. Tube lovers may well prefer the HD-600. I think with SS, the HD-650 is a real winner in removing that last vestige of "grain" from the treble.
5. I was expecting the supposed "tubey" sounding Perreaux to be a bad match for "laid back" Senn's. I am not hearing a bloated bass, or a fat, warm, or overall too liquid of a sound. I thought the Perreaux was going to be a lot warmer than the jacks on my equipment. I didn't hear a major shift in tone. I don't think I would want anything brighter or lighter sounding, so I don't find the Senn/Perreaux combo too warm or dark. Maybe I could appreciate a different amp if the tone stayed the same, and things opened up a hair.
6. I suspect there is a big learning curve with headphone listening. My experience is limited and my mental references few. But, on absolute terms, I like the Senn/Perreaux combo and I prefer the HD-650.
7. For fun, I dug out a vintage pair of AKG K240's. I paid 29 dollars for them in the late 60's or very early 70's at Lafayette Radio and Electronics. You know, they sounded pretty darn good! A tad rough around the edges compared to both Senn's, but good clarity, open sounding, decent bass, decent mids, nice overall balance. My only complaint was the upper mids and treble were a notch rougher than the HD-600's which in turn, were a notch "rougher" than the HD-650's. Once again, this trait I am describing is noticeable with sibilance and the K240 exaggerated it the most (not at all objectionable though).
8. Did I say I like the smooth presentation of the HD-650?
9. It was not my intention to describe soundstage, dynamics, bass slam, transients, etc. Overall, I was listening for general musicality, pleasing tone, and especially a sweet top end. Neither pair of 'phones is even broken in yet. If the HD-650 gets better, I won't complain.
I have found it interesting to read about the Sennheiser "veil" and the fact that many prefer the HD-600 over the HD-650 and visa versa. I also see that some folks think the differences btw the 580/600/650 are pretty minor.
I think the differences are large enough to hear without too much trouble and definitely enough to determine a buying preference.
Using a Sony XA-777ES, a Perreaux SXH1, (as well as playing around with the headphone jacks of the XA-777 and my Sony DA-7ES rcvr.), these are my initial impressions:
1. I prefer the HD-650. My taste, no more, no less.
2. I am not sure which is more accurate, but the most obvious and important difference for me is the HD-650 is less sibilant (vocal sss's and percussion).
3. The HD-650 does have a more pronounced bass range and it always is there underpinning whatever is playing. I like it, but I can see how some would say it could be artificially boosted a hair and that the HD-600 is more balanced from top to bottom. The difference is not huge, but it is very obvious switching btw 'phones. Frankly, I don't mind the overall warmth the increased bass seems to add to the HD-650.
At first it sounds as if the HD-650 is a tad "muddy", and maybe a little less dynamic and "slower". But, upon switching back and forth, to my ears, all the info and detail is there. I think the perception is an aural "illusion" due to the bass response and less grainy highs. I simply find the HD-650 a little smoother with my system.
4. I do not find the HD-600 to sound "sweet" up top as I have read. I don't find it to be laid back particulary either. Maybe it is compared to other 'phones. The 600 is not overly aggressive by any means, but the HD-650 is more liquid at the extremes and not at the expense of lost detail. I think this is a refinement in the development of the Senn flagship line. I could imagine that the 'phones were voiced using solid state products. Tube lovers may well prefer the HD-600. I think with SS, the HD-650 is a real winner in removing that last vestige of "grain" from the treble.
5. I was expecting the supposed "tubey" sounding Perreaux to be a bad match for "laid back" Senn's. I am not hearing a bloated bass, or a fat, warm, or overall too liquid of a sound. I thought the Perreaux was going to be a lot warmer than the jacks on my equipment. I didn't hear a major shift in tone. I don't think I would want anything brighter or lighter sounding, so I don't find the Senn/Perreaux combo too warm or dark. Maybe I could appreciate a different amp if the tone stayed the same, and things opened up a hair.
6. I suspect there is a big learning curve with headphone listening. My experience is limited and my mental references few. But, on absolute terms, I like the Senn/Perreaux combo and I prefer the HD-650.
7. For fun, I dug out a vintage pair of AKG K240's. I paid 29 dollars for them in the late 60's or very early 70's at Lafayette Radio and Electronics. You know, they sounded pretty darn good! A tad rough around the edges compared to both Senn's, but good clarity, open sounding, decent bass, decent mids, nice overall balance. My only complaint was the upper mids and treble were a notch rougher than the HD-600's which in turn, were a notch "rougher" than the HD-650's. Once again, this trait I am describing is noticeable with sibilance and the K240 exaggerated it the most (not at all objectionable though).
8. Did I say I like the smooth presentation of the HD-650?
9. It was not my intention to describe soundstage, dynamics, bass slam, transients, etc. Overall, I was listening for general musicality, pleasing tone, and especially a sweet top end. Neither pair of 'phones is even broken in yet. If the HD-650 gets better, I won't complain.
