spacecoyote
100+ Head-Fier
- Joined
- Feb 11, 2007
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So, how can you tell?
I really want to know. I've spent the last several hours trying to research this topic on the ever dissapointing world wide web, and when it comes to the two most common used tubes, for me, the 12AX7 and variants, and the EL84 and variants, it seams there is no set standard or criteria for identifying these bogus vintage valves. To make matters worse, there are a whole slew of haters out there that decide to make a pariah (look it up) out of seller just because they (the hater) think they are the ultimate authority on a particular tube; collecting tubes for fifteen years doesn't make a person an authority, it just means they have alot of tubes.
Alot of people aggree, for instance, that a key feature of an authentic Amperex Bugle Boy is that the chalky ink on vintage ones won't wipe off. However I have a pair of Bugle Boys, one with a slightly worn label and one with a perfect label. The first thing I thought was the perfect one's bunk. But if I rub a little harder the ink will come off. Another supposed feature is that the filament should burn bright at first and then dim, so if it doesn't or one does and the other doesn't, is(are) the bright one(s) fake? They obviously are not a date-matched pair, but I have very good reason to believe that both tubes are for real.
I also have a date-matched NIB pair of Telefunken ECC803S in the black and white box with the gold pins. These seam to have the most contraversy of any potentially faked tube anywhere! The buyer I purchased mine from has a whole following of haters, people who seam to think they know for a fact that this dude sells swag. But, and this is important, NONE of the people who drag this sellers name through the mud have EVER bought a tube from him. So if all these people saying his tubes are fakes hasen't bought one, what kind of credability do think they realy have?!
I don't doubt that counterfeit vintage tubes are a problem and that there are people making them and selling them, but if soooo many people know sooooo much about what is fake and how to identify them, then why isn't there an archive of photos readily available, found through a search engine? The only archives I could find were thread archives of hate posts back and forth between a bunch over-zealous misguided audiophile wannabees that pitch hate like an epeleptic carpenter trying to hammer a nail in a borad...see, it's contagious, all this hatemongering.
If there is anyone in this community with even a shread of definitive information on the topic of identifying fake NOS vintage tubes that they could post, I for one would be extremely grateful. There are quite a few people here, me being a principal player, that have become amatuer audiophiles seamingly overnight, and we want to experiment and collect NOS/NIB tubes before the prices get even higher and the tubes themselves become even more scarce. And whenever a niche market opens up or gets bigger the detritus feeders come out, and those bottom dwellers aren't content to feed off the bottom for very long, sooner or later they become preditors. So let's take them out of the food chain and increase our knowledge base.
be good Family,
The Space Coyote
I really want to know. I've spent the last several hours trying to research this topic on the ever dissapointing world wide web, and when it comes to the two most common used tubes, for me, the 12AX7 and variants, and the EL84 and variants, it seams there is no set standard or criteria for identifying these bogus vintage valves. To make matters worse, there are a whole slew of haters out there that decide to make a pariah (look it up) out of seller just because they (the hater) think they are the ultimate authority on a particular tube; collecting tubes for fifteen years doesn't make a person an authority, it just means they have alot of tubes.
Alot of people aggree, for instance, that a key feature of an authentic Amperex Bugle Boy is that the chalky ink on vintage ones won't wipe off. However I have a pair of Bugle Boys, one with a slightly worn label and one with a perfect label. The first thing I thought was the perfect one's bunk. But if I rub a little harder the ink will come off. Another supposed feature is that the filament should burn bright at first and then dim, so if it doesn't or one does and the other doesn't, is(are) the bright one(s) fake? They obviously are not a date-matched pair, but I have very good reason to believe that both tubes are for real.
I also have a date-matched NIB pair of Telefunken ECC803S in the black and white box with the gold pins. These seam to have the most contraversy of any potentially faked tube anywhere! The buyer I purchased mine from has a whole following of haters, people who seam to think they know for a fact that this dude sells swag. But, and this is important, NONE of the people who drag this sellers name through the mud have EVER bought a tube from him. So if all these people saying his tubes are fakes hasen't bought one, what kind of credability do think they realy have?!
I don't doubt that counterfeit vintage tubes are a problem and that there are people making them and selling them, but if soooo many people know sooooo much about what is fake and how to identify them, then why isn't there an archive of photos readily available, found through a search engine? The only archives I could find were thread archives of hate posts back and forth between a bunch over-zealous misguided audiophile wannabees that pitch hate like an epeleptic carpenter trying to hammer a nail in a borad...see, it's contagious, all this hatemongering.
If there is anyone in this community with even a shread of definitive information on the topic of identifying fake NOS vintage tubes that they could post, I for one would be extremely grateful. There are quite a few people here, me being a principal player, that have become amatuer audiophiles seamingly overnight, and we want to experiment and collect NOS/NIB tubes before the prices get even higher and the tubes themselves become even more scarce. And whenever a niche market opens up or gets bigger the detritus feeders come out, and those bottom dwellers aren't content to feed off the bottom for very long, sooner or later they become preditors. So let's take them out of the food chain and increase our knowledge base.
be good Family,
The Space Coyote
