[cash68]

I've been reading this book, and it's been completely blowing my mind. I highly suggest any of you who are about to go into school, or even half way into school, read this book.

Amazon.com: A Whole New Mind: Moving from the Information Age to the Conceptual Age: Daniel H. Pink: Books

It brings up some VERY VERY VERY VERY interesting points. Please check it out. I'm just... just get it at your library. Trust me. It deals with left versus right brain thinking, and the evolution of society. From agricultural, to industrial, to informational, to .... the next big thing. White collar jobs are flooding out the country at a rate of 16 billion dollars worth per year, since engineers in India will work for $15,000 a year, overseas lawyers work even cheaper, and the ability of computers to process data and find patterns grows even stronger. It's kinda nuts.

 

[nsx_23]

Try this book: Change Your Thinking - Second Edition Sarah Edelman - ABC Shop - The Home of Australian Content

I absolutely swear by it. Heck, it should be on the secondary school reading list.

That book was probably the best book I've picked up. It really taught me how to think and tackle different situations in life.

 

[linuxworks]

I'm seeing my field (software) being farmed out left and right ;(

its a pity and a shame. my generation may be the new 'angry young men' since our jobs are being cut out from under us.

if you've ever had to train your overseas replacement, you know how this feels. ;(

the next generation WILL need to do something.

in the meantime, the only 'safe' jobs are those that can't be done remotely. and THAT is a big shift that many of us simply didn't expect or plan for.

 

[nsx_23]

I wonder just how safe engineering jobs are. Opinions seem to vary wildly.

 

[linuxworks]

honestly, I would not recommend for my kids (I don't have any yet) to go into 'thinking sciences'. its currently a bad bet.

physical things can't be farmed-out. a guy repairing your heating system (lol) can't be done remotely. but 'thinking jobs' are TOO easy to be done remotely, so assume they all will be. that's my take on things (sadly).

 

[nickyboyo]

Having both a degree in mechanical engineering and a time served trade apprenticeship under my belt, take it from me, 90% of engineering is dead in the developed world.
The amount of engineering being sub-contracted out to the sub-continent is staggering, and with China's thirst for knowledge and their work ethic, they are quickly catching up with India. Most engineering projects are being shipped to one or other of the 2 countries mentioned above. They do it cheaper and quicker.
The other downside of becoming purely academic is that, unfortunately the vast majority of engineering grads from the western world have over inflated ego's and an under developed grasp of common and practical sense. Shop floor and trade orientated people are much more grounded and usually more fun to be with when working and socialising.
Plus, i earn far more when working as a "blue collar" worker than i do as a "white collar" worker, but that's the choice- hard yakka or easy life???
My advice, if you want to go into engineering, learn the hand skills and job "know how" first, then progress to uni and get a grasp of the mathematics and science behind the trade or discipline you have chosen.

I just wish now that i had become a plumber when i had the chance as a boy many many years ago....

 

[marvin]

Why do I have a nasty suspicion that the book will mostly be self reinforcing to already "R-directed" thinkers...

Quote:

Originally Posted by nsx_23 /img/forum/go_quote.gif I wonder just how safe engineering jobs are. Opinions seem to vary wildly.

In the US, it's sort of a toss up. I suspect the trends are the same in most western countries.

On the positive side, the university system is producing less and less engineering graduates as the combination of difficult major and relatively poor job prospects has been driving prospective engineers elsewhere. Like accounting*. This trend is generally good for younger engineers and new graduates considering that growth is still continuing in engineering fields and the boomer generation will retire shortly.

On the negative side, outsourcing seriously limits engineering job growth within the US and also changes the nature of the job. Conceptual design, systems level design, and engineering sales and support will continue to be done in the US for the foreseeable future. However, much of the actual circuit and assembly design work will be outsourced. Also, H1Bs (foreign worker visas) will continue to eat into the total number of US based jobs available to US grads.

Overall, job prospects are not great or terrible. Just better elsewhere.

* An accounting degree combined with a fed.gov accounting job is a highly recommended job path for those that are bright but not brilliant. Decent pay along with extremely good job security.

 

[amphead]

Thanks for the book recommendations. My recommendation is to be an entrepreneur in the mechanical/electronic field. Read, read, read up on techniques on the internet, while trying to develop a product that would have practical value. Take your time and build quality prototypes that are modular in nature. See where I'm going with this? Once you have perfected it, build it here in your own shop, or farm it out to China/India if you must. If you were thinking ahead, you would build up your cash reserves while farming it off-shore to then hire a few people in your home country to build it and create jobs. Edit: don't be afraid to team up with someone else of like mind to create synergy, such as mechanical engineering/electronic engineering combination. The shortage that exists currently is for people who develop useful products which in turn, create jobs.

 

[Taikero]

Creative thinkers and hard workers always have jobs, no matter their field. Being both makes you invaluable.

Thank you for the book suggestions.

 

[analogsonar]

working for someone else is o.k as long as you know them and their interests are the same as yours. self business is the only way to profitabilty for me and everyone. one day I will beat the whole 1984 scenario and actually work for myself, and customers, creating a real economy.

 

[Nocturnal310]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Taikero /img/forum/go_quote.gif Creative thinkers and hard workers always have jobs, no matter their field. Being both makes you invaluable. Thank you for the book suggestions.

i agree with u...but even then.the need for human resource is decreasing on average.

hard workers dont always get the work..because they have much more competition than before.

and ..not everyone is creative thinker and hard working..but this doesnt mean they have no right to survive (no job = no survival right?)

all this is because of crazy increase in human population worldwide.

due to this...more n more humans are becoming irrelevant and unnecessary for organizations.

the way technology makes more technology possible...more humans are making more humans..

so now technology is expanding so rapidly ..that it is conflicting with the human population..and competing with them....result? ..machines win...humans lose.

funny situation..but in future i wonder what 80% of the worlds population may be doing.

 

[nsx_23]

I just have this feeling that once I finish my degree, I'll probably end up in China for a part of my career since I'm Chinese.

The thing is, many people say that Australia actually has a big engineer's shortage.

 

[-=Germania=-]

Sorry LinuxWorks, I completely understand.

I was working with a branch of a company in a foureign country who was doing quite a bit of software grunt work (matching databases to functions of a java web app). I tell you that it was tough to get any work done and they would frequently go DAYS without getting anything done. Apparently that was pretty standard management practice at the foreign office and made it very hard to complete deadlines. It was not only that, but when they ran into an issue they would wait until we would stop and wait for our response the next day and do no more work - even if there was other things that they could be working on. It is just hard to keep people on task when they are in another country when management doesn't care.

Personally, I really don't like outsourcing software development (esp. when dealing with very sensitive information) and even statistically it takes much longer. It may be fine for grunt work, but time is money IMO.

Good news is that there are always jobs in HCI ! I think that HCI is much more fun and engaging anyway.

 

[sachu]

I was a software engineer in India, fresh out of college and had got into one of India's premier software services companies..infosys. Only about 100 were called for an interview from about 2500 who took the written test.

So it is a matter of luck ...anyway for those who keep thinking its crazy that people work for 15k in India should stop looking at it that way. Becuase, 15k$ is a lot of money in India. I remember the first month I came here to the states for my graduate studies (yeah i quit my cushy/crappy techie job after only 7 months , first 5 of which were awesome though) and i was going through hell thinking about each and everything I bought , from a dollar mac burger to paying rent in terms of Indian rupees..It just seemed like too much money..(I come from a middle class family (upper middle I would think)..then , you start moving out of that phase else you will be stuck in hell biting your nails every time you spend anything more than a quarter...

Too k a lot of adjusting to.

I look at the new paradigm as payback for all the looting the westerners and arabians did in the last few centuries as they carried off the wealth of India (and China too), while oppressing its people....One other thing, its the American consumer who has landed himself in such a spot, by expecting products at a lower price.

This is a very politically sensitive issue..don't know if you/I really want to discuss this on the forum..

I don't plan on going back to India ...unless I am made to do so by forces out of my control..I like the life I have now..but I do want to move to another country..no offence against any Americans...I just think that the system here is effed up waay beyond repair or repair that I would probably not see in my life time.

Am thinking Canada or western Europe..NZ is on the cards too

 

[analogsonar]

"effed up beyond repair" I agree. but remember, the same employers hundreds of years ago, are still the same employers now. the power structure has not changed at all. the rich who are rich now, have been rich and owned majority stock for centuries. notice, that civil liberties are going by the wayside, and that is because of who is in power. i work for the super rich, and so does everyone else, we always have. freedom is the main concern. canada does sound like a better option and i think i will move there too.