[jonathan c]

Many also speculated that Beats influenced the trend. Don’t laugh, as in 2010 Beats were the mainstream introduction of bass to the masses. They sold millions of pairs of headphones, many members will not want to disclose that they were the gateway headphone to Head-Fi.

I will say that I never owned Beats but, hinting at my age, started eons ago with a Wollensak cassette player and Sennheiser 414s - with the fragile cable and with foam prone to rot…

 

[number1sixerfan]

Generally speaking, imho the new TOTL are better technically--soundstage, imaging, detail, holographic nature, etc., which isn't surprising given how technology improves. But quite a few of the older TOTL cans had quite a bit more of a euphoric goodness to them. Out of only what I owned personally over time and not just what I heard at mini meets, the L3000, HP-1000, PS1 and HE-60 all come to mind in that regard.

I've had the unique chance to own the K1000, L3000, HE60, and 007 MK1 alongside the TC/Susvara/009/Sr1a. The L3000 before going out of commission unfortunately got more head time while I had them all. Just truly an insanely, captivating sound. In comparison, the K1000 did not age well at ALL. The Sr1a is everything it should've been, and the 009 is far preferable--which is so crazy as I loved the K1000, had at least 4 pairs over the years. The HE60 and MK1 are a step below the Susvara/009/TC etc, but are still really enjoyable in their own right. So really, it just depends.

Lastly, price wise.. being fully honest, things just don't make any damn sense. I can understand a bit of a price hike over time for R&D and cost of parts, but the prices are clearly as inflated as companies can possibly get away with. But I feel that about half of my headphones are clearly overpriced and yet I still have them. If they didn't maintain great resell value that wouldn't be the case.

 

[paradoxper]

Generally speaking, imho the new TOTL are better technically--soundstage, imaging, detail, holographic nature, etc., which isn't surprising given how technology improves. But quite a few of the older TOTL cans had quite a bit more of a euphoric goodness to them. Out of only what I owned personally over time and not just what I heard at mini meets, the L3000, HP-1000 and PS1 all come to mind in that regard.

I've had the unique chance to own the K1000, L3000, HE60, and 007 MK1 alongside the TC/Susvara/009/Sr1a. The L3000 before going out of commission unfortunately got more head time while I had them all. Just truly an insanely, captivating sound. In comparison, the K1000 did not age well at ALL. The Sr1a is everything it should've been, and the 009 is far preferable--which is so crazy as I loved the K1000, had at least 4 pairs over the years. The HE60 and MK1 are a step below the Susvara/009/TC etc, but are still really enjoyable in their own right. So really, it just depends.

Lastly, price wise.. being fully honest, things just don't make any damn sense. I can understand a bit of a price hike over time for R&D and cost of parts, but the prices are clearly as inflated as companies can possibly get away with. But I feel that about half of my headphones are clearly overpriced and yet I still have them. If they didn't maintain great resell value that wouldn't be the case.

Disregard your subjective whims or objective gospel, every single headphone is over priced. The only headphone relatively worth its cost is the fully CNC'ed 1266.
They ran it over with a jeep and it didn't flinch.

We are approaching absurdity though with $10k headphone prices.

 

[number1sixerfan]

Disregard your subjective whims or objective gospel, every single headphone is over priced. The only headphone relatively worth its cost is the fully CNC'ed 1266.
They ran it over with a jeep and it didn't flinch.

We are approaching absurdity though with $10k headphone prices.

Please save us your Abyss propaganda lol

But agree. And even $5k doesn't seem too bad these days for absolute TOTL (which is let's say like 4-5 models). But the fact that so many below that are priced there, and many that are truly TOTL are edging up far beyond that is just insane. But again, I'm complacent as well.

 

[paradoxper]

Please save us your Abyss propaganda lol

But agree. And even $5k doesn't seem too bad these days for absolute TOTL (which is let's say like 4-5 models). But the fact that so many below that are priced there, and many that are truly TOTL are edging up far beyond that is just insane. But again, I'm complacent as well.

I will. Do you have a minute, I'd like to share with you the good gospel of the great Kevin Gilmore?

It is what it is today and tomorrow. It's the same thing with a multitude of valued goods. Art, engineering, performance, everything is arbitrary.

 

[Redcarmoose]

I actually remember demoing the Sennheiser HD414s against the Koss of the day in 1975. Then someone put on Iron Man by Black Sabbath...... then the Koss became a first in a lifetime experience!

I will say that I never owned Beats but, hinting at my age, started eons ago with a Wollensak cassette player and Sennheiser 414s - with the fragile cable and with foam prone to rot…

 

[Roderick]

Many also speculated that Beats influenced the trend. Don’t laugh, as in 2010 Beats were the mainstream introduction of bass to the masses. They sold millions of pairs of headphones, many members will not want to disclose that they were the gateway headphone to Head-Fi.

Very true. Something like Solo 2 is propably also quite close to harman target. Years ago it was bassy headphone for kids kind of tuning and now many consider it a reference tuning.

Beats was also important because it proposed idea to the masses that it is ok to pay over $300 for headphones. I'm sure that has had both positive and negative effect on things.

 

[Deolum]

Generally speaking, imho the new TOTL are better technically--soundstage, imaging, detail, holographic nature, etc., which isn't surprising given how technology improves. But quite a few of the older TOTL cans had quite a bit more of a euphoric goodness to them. Out of only what I owned personally over time and not just what I heard at mini meets, the L3000, HP-1000, PS1 and HE-60 all come to mind in that regard.

I've had the unique chance to own the K1000, L3000, HE60, and 007 MK1 alongside the TC/Susvara/009/Sr1a. The L3000 before going out of commission unfortunately got more head time while I had them all. Just truly an insanely, captivating sound. In comparison, the K1000 did not age well at ALL. The Sr1a is everything it should've been, and the 009 is far preferable--which is so crazy as I loved the K1000, had at least 4 pairs over the years. The HE60 and MK1 are a step below the Susvara/009/TC etc, but are still really enjoyable in their own right. So really, it just depends.

Lastly, price wise.. being fully honest, things just don't make any damn sense. I can understand a bit of a price hike over time for R&D and cost of parts, but the prices are clearly as inflated as companies can possibly get away with. But I feel that about half of my headphones are clearly overpriced and yet I still have them. If they didn't maintain great resell value that wouldn't be the case.

For my taste the 007 Mk. 1 and the Susvara are around the same tier and one step above 009 and TC. I didn't own 009 and TC but only heard them so it's a bit hard to evaluate. The 009s is on the Susvara, Mk1 tier for me though.

With all of those when i have them on my head i don't feel they're worth the money and most of them are also quite uncomfy (TC) or fragile (Susvara, Staxes) so in the end i use the HD650 and Ananda most of the time if i don't use speakers or IEMs.

 

[Reputator]

This is a pretty great topic! I'm enjoying reading everyone's long-term experiences and perspectives

 

[flargosa]

Now people get all excited over a $4,500 headphone. This is nuts. When I first joined this hobby HD650 was the uber expensive, lol.

 

[arielext]

A proper amped akg k240 sextett or an akg k340 can still run circles around most headphones. If you throw in some eq and perhaps some DIY if you feel up to it and you can own a pair of headphones that can compete with those costing 5 to 10 times as much

 

[kman1211]

A proper amped akg k240 sextett or an akg k340 can still run circles around most headphones. If you throw in some eq and perhaps some DIY if you feel up to it and you can own a pair of headphones that can compete with those costing 5 to 10 times as much

Agreed, I was impressed when I heard a properly amped K240 Sextett and K340. I would say the same is true with the DT 48 and DT 480 as well. Some of the older STAX ear speakers are very impressive. Old flagships seem to vary a lot in terms of how well they hold up. But there are some real gems out there and some of the old flagships don’t even cost that much. You may need to do some TLC and DIY on some, but the potential is there on some.

 

[Chefguru]

Generally speaking, imho the new TOTL are better technically--soundstage, imaging, detail, holographic nature, etc., which isn't surprising given how technology improves. But quite a few of the older TOTL cans had quite a bit more of a euphoric goodness to them. Out of only what I owned personally over time and not just what I heard at mini meets, the L3000, HP-1000, PS1 and HE-60 all come to mind in that regard.

I've had the unique chance to own the K1000, L3000, HE60, and 007 MK1 alongside the TC/Susvara/009/Sr1a. The L3000 before going out of commission unfortunately got more head time while I had them all. Just truly an insanely, captivating sound. In comparison, the K1000 did not age well at ALL. The Sr1a is everything it should've been, and the 009 is far preferable--which is so crazy as I loved the K1000, had at least 4 pairs over the years. The HE60 and MK1 are a step below the Susvara/009/TC etc, but are still really enjoyable in their own right. So really, it just depends.

Lastly, price wise.. being fully honest, things just don't make any damn sense. I can understand a bit of a price hike over time for R&D and cost of parts, but the prices are clearly as inflated as companies can possibly get away with. But I feel that about half of my headphones are clearly overpriced and yet I still have them. If they didn't maintain great resell value that wouldn't be the case.

Perfectly said.
And this why even though the sr009s is technically my best headphone, my grado hp-2i gets all 90% of the head time.

Audeze CRBN, which I just heard today, are the first headphone in a long time that made me feel some old school nostalgia.

 

[greenhorn]

I think I can safely say that the prices of high quality headphones produced nowadays is 10 times higher than the price of high quality headphones produced 20 years ago.

I have serious doubts on a « general » increase of their quality; not a 10 fold increase… but just on any increase.

My thoughts go, as an example, to the thin integrated circuits electronics vs big electronics of the seventies… they were of course touted as being better. Or the CDs replacing vinyls, in the late eighties (they also were touted as being better ). Now we all know this was not the case.

Marketing

 

[dbf909]

I actually remember demoing the Sennheiser HD414s against the Koss of the day in 1975. Then someone put on Iron Man by Black Sabbath...... then the Koss became a first in a lifetime experience!

I did the same comparison in '75 or '76 between the 414 and the Koss HV1LC. Only it was Pink Floyd's Wish You Were Here that sold me on the Koss...

I bought a 414 and a 424 over the next few (10?) years but the Koss was my #1 for decades. I also owned a Pro4AAA for a while. I honestly don't remember the prices paid for them back then but I'm sure that they were less than $100. I do remember demoing some "expensive" headphones back in those days but honestly don't remember lusting after any of them.

In I think the late 90's I picked up a pair of Sony MDR-7506 for recording and studio use. I remember thinking that they were quite an upgrade over the Koss and older Senns and I got rid of all of those old phones with their rotting away foam pads...

Nowadays with virtually everything there is such a huge disparity in price between the "entry level" and "top of the line". Way more so than in the 70's by proportion. Some things have improved significantly and others not so much but are just "marketed" that way. The value proposition of TOTL is always a tough sell for me as I always look for the "knee" in the curve - the point of largely diminishing returns. For me right now that is the Sundara. I've auditioned phones that cost 10-20x what I paid for the Sundara and they sound amazing BUT nowhere close to 10-20 times as amazing.

I think that the state of headphone technology and value have never been better than they are today. The TOTLs of today are probably noticeably better than those of yesterday but the adjusted cost differential is likely more of an indication of the level of disposable income of those few that would buy them today vs yesterday.