[bigshot]

You mean an analogue equalizer with manual volume pots? That wouldn't be native DSD, because the DSD would have to be converted to analogue first. And outboard digital equalizers would need to convert to PCM before adjusting.

There really isn't any reason to work with native DSD. It's inflexible and it doesn't sound any better than PCM to human ears.

 

[Jimis 3 16]

You mean an analogue equalizer with manual volume pots? That wouldn't be native DSD, because the DSD would have to be converted to analogue first. And outboard digital equalizers would need to convert to PCM before adjusting.

There really isn't any reason to work with native DSD. It's inflexible and it doesn't sound any better than PCM to human ears.

I actually can hear sound quality difference from DSD compared to same files in PCM and I'm sure every thing analogue will work.. NX4's bass boost works so THX AAA portable's internal EQ features will absolutely work. For me, It would be ideal a portable headphones equalizer, do you know any?

 

[bigshot]

Tell me about how you conducted that test please... How did you determine that the DSD and PCM were the same mastering? Did you level match? Direct A/B switched? Blind? How many comparisons did you do and what percentage of them did you get right?

I already answered your questions about equalizers and DSD.

 

[Jimis 3 16]

I'm very sure I can hear difference between DSD and PCM, It's not illusion that's for sure!! I didn't make blind test, I did A/B test, level match and I can tell, there is a difference in sound quality on DSD, that made me like DSD more than PCM. It was more difficult to hear difference between DSD256 and DSD512 but It was obvious on PCM to DSD256 and on PCM to DSD512..

 

[Jimis 3 16]

Tell me about how you conducted that test please... How did you determine that the DSD and PCM were the same mastering? Did you level match? Direct A/B switched? Blind? How many comparisons did you do and what percentage of them did you get right?

I already answered your questions about equalizers and DSD.

Did you ever try to make DSD and PCM sound test?? Type of headphones and amp/dac you use play an important role on this..

 

[VNandor]

Maybe you're right about EQing with software on DSD files but something I just thought, Is It possible to EQ them If hardware makes the job? For example, If I use a THX AAA portable's hardware EQ, I think then It's possible?

If you used an analog hardware EQ I imagine the signal would start off with a DSD to analog conversion by your converter( if it can do that), the line out of the converter would be attached to the input of the analog EQ (so analog in analog out) and the line out of the analog EQ would be connected to the amplifier. I don't see any PCM conversion there. Of course that would still leave the DSD file unedited.

 

[Jimis 3 16]

If you used an analog hardware EQ I imagine the signal would start off with a DSD to analog conversion by your converter( if it can do that), the line out of the converter would be attached to the input of the analog EQ (so analog in analog out) and the line out of the analog EQ would be connected to the amplifier. I don't see any PCM conversion there. Of course that would still leave the DSD file unedited.

That's right!! The problem is, I can't find any portable hardware headphones equalizer, do you know any??? (I want portable...)

 

[VNandor]

That's right!! The problem is, I can't find any portable hardware headphones equalizer, do you know any??? (I want portable...)

The only time I've seen an analog EQ is when I had some fun with a mixing console that was older than me. So no, sorry.

 

[Jimis 3 16]

It's ok, the only choice I can think of is the THX AAA portable, but I'll also have to use Its amp portion to get the EQ. I currently use Topping NX4, I like the dac on this and connecting It to THX portable will get the EQ settings of It..

 

[bigshot]

Did you ever try to make DSD and PCM sound test?? Type of headphones and amp/dac you use play an important role on this..

Yes I did. The problem wasn't so much the amp and DAC, it was finding something that used the same mastering in both DSD and PCM. It was also difficult to find a direct DSD recording. Most music on DSD is either legacy analogue recordings or commercial music engineered in PCM. In order to hear pure DSD, you have to find a recording that was recorded and mixed live. It isn't technically possible to mix using DSD. Usually, it is bumped to PCM to mix and then back to DSD again.

If you'd like to hear about my test, I'd be happy to tell you about it. Yes, it was quite difficult to set up.

By the way, if it isn't blind, expectation bias can affect your results. Expectation bias is real. In Sound Science, if you claim to hear clear differences between things that sound the same to everyone else, you need a blind test to prove it. I'm pretty sure your results were the result of either expectation bias or different mastering. I think you are chasing the wrong goal here. You are focused on theoretical sound, not sound you can actually hear. And you have misconceptions about how it all works.

If you used an analog hardware EQ I imagine the signal would start off with a DSD to analog conversion by your converter( if it can do that), the line out of the converter would be attached to the input of the analog EQ (so analog in analog out) and the line out of the analog EQ would be connected to the amplifier. I don't see any PCM conversion there. Of course that would still leave the DSD file unedited.

No but it would be extremely difficult to find an analogue equalizer with specs capable of accurately presenting DSD sound quality. And I've never seen a portable analogue equalizer except on boom boxes.

 

[Jimis 3 16]

Yes I did. The problem wasn't so much the amp and DAC, it was finding something that used the same mastering in both DSD and PCM. It was also difficult to find a direct DSD recording. Most music on DSD is either legacy analogue recordings or commercial music engineered in PCM. In order to hear pure DSD, you have to find a recording that was recorded and mixed live. It isn't technically possible to mix using DSD. Usually, it is bumped to PCM to mix and then back to DSD again.

If you'd like to hear about my test, I'd be happy to tell you about it. Yes, it was quite difficult to set up.

By the way, if it isn't blind, expectation bias can affect your results. Expectation bias is real. In Sound Science, if you claim to hear clear differences between things that sound the same to everyone else, you need a blind test to prove it. I'm pretty sure your results were the result of either expectation bias or different mastering. I think you are chasing the wrong goal here. You are focused on theoretical sound, not sound you can actually hear. And you have misconceptions about how it all works.

I agree, It's a slight difference but It is noticable, I think probably If I would make a blind test, I would find the most If not all times when played DSD and times when played PCM.
The other thing you say most DSD music is legacy analogue recordings..... Actually If you didn't know, you can convert any PCM file(s) up to DSD1024 with a software called ConverteR 48x44 https://samplerateconverter.com/

If you're interested to make more comparisons, use this to convert your PCM music to DSD... It's downloadable and free.

 

[VNandor]

he other thing you say most DSD music is legacy analogue recordings..... Actually If you didn't know, you can convert any PCM file(s) up to DSD1024 with a software called ConverteR 48x44 https://samplerateconverter.com/

I can convert a 64kbit mp3 file into a 192kHz/24bit lossless file. Do you think I would gain any extra fidelity back by doing that? How would I benefit from converting a PCM file to DSD?

 

[bigshot]

It's a slight difference but It is noticable, I think probably If I would make a blind test, I would find the most If not all times when played DSD and times when played PCM.

Nope. I'm afraid not.

There is no audible difference between PCM and DSD. In fact, almost every commercial release on DSD was originally a PCM file. There is no difference. If you are hearing one, either the mastering is different or you are experiencing expectation bias in a sighted test. If you are interested in knowing how it actually works and what really matters, in my sig file, there is a link that explains it all... CD is all you need. https://web.archive.org/web/20200426202431/https://people.xiph.org/~xiphmont/demo/neil-young.html If you have any questions, I'm sure there are people here willing to help you figure it out.

 

[Jimis 3 16]

I can convert a 64kbit mp3 file into a 192kHz/24bit lossless file. Do you think I would gain any extra fidelity back by doing that? How would I benefit from converting a PCM file to DSD?

In my opinion yes, I'm interested to hear your results If you try It, to me there is a slight but noticable difference, on a test maybe I won't find 100% all the times of DSD and PCM but also maybe I will, I didn't try blind test. I suggest trying yourself and tell me after. Type of headphones and amp/dac you use plays an important role on this test...

 

[bigshot]

In my opinion yes

Your opinion is incorrect. I tell you that understanding the basics of how digital audio works. I've seen the results of controlled tests done in the past. I even did a test myself for my own interest. There is no audible difference between PCM and DSD. In fact, high bitrate lossy sounds exactly the same to human ears too.