[Sonic Defender]

@Beagle, is your thread for dedicated impressions doing well? Could you drop a link to it here again? Happy Canada Day to those north of the 49th.

 

[up late]

you can disregard equations #3 and #4 @rnros. no one's twisting your arm.

 

[nordkapp]

@Sonic Defender
https://www.head-fi.org/f/threads/sony-z1r-listening-impressions-only.853330/
Yes, impressions only, please!!!!!! 4 pages in and no petty stuff.

 

[Rowethren]

am I the only one getting fed up with the garbage nonsense pilling up in this topic in the last week?
what I read are people who expect too much from a frequency response graph or somebody's review, but then blame the graphs and/or the review for their own mistaken assumptions.
several people warned that 2 rigs shouldn't be compared, then plenty of people do just that thinking they're making a good point...
many warned that a reviewer is just one guy with his opinion, then plenty of people go wild because they think what the reviewer said isn't 100% fact. well no **** Sherlock.

are you guys so insecure about your own taste that you need constant validation from online reviews? what about food? do you trow a tantrum if somebody doesn't like what you enjoy? I don't get it. I don't get why someone couldn't dislike a headphone without being wrong, I don't get why 2 measurement rigs showing variations is such a big deal when it's absolutely normal. I don't get any of it.

meanwhile, we all pretend like we want reviewers to stop sucking up to manufacturers. but if people react like this anytime someone says what he thinks, is it really such a surprise that in the long run most reviewers turn into "everything is awesome" BS reviews?



and please pretty please, stop with the "flat this", "neutral that". there is no neutral headphone response universally defined. if you think there is, most likely you need to look up headphone+human interaction and stuff about HRTF. if I feel like a headphone is neutral, it's my subjective impression and it does not define neutral for anybody else. why? because I am not the center of the universe. just like my idea of just the right quantity of spicy only has that balanced meaning for me. and someone else will put twice the amount and think I'm a *****. we are different people, our impressions are our own.
as for a graph, the flat line only means the stuff measured is similar to the reference used to calibrate the graph. and that's it. do you guys even know what that reference is when you make assumptions about how neutral the headphone is? if I use a square wave shape as reference, then only a square wave like response could look flat on the graph. a flat line never ever meant that the headphone was great or would sound neutral to me. if you have such an assumption, bury it deep and forget. measuring a headphone is not like measuring a DAC!

Sadly the next 20 posts after this one are still talking about the same circular crap. I like you am getting rather bored of it! People can either like them or not but constantly trying to push your opinions onto someone else is rather futile!

 

[Sonic Defender]

@Sonic Defender
https://www.head-fi.org/f/threads/sony-z1r-listening-impressions-only.853330/
Yes, impressions only, please!!!!!! 4 pages in and no petty stuff.

Thanks, yes at least there is a nice clean thread.

 

[EDN80]

As just one example, the massive amounts of praise that the HD800 got, the same headphone that people are these days modding left and right to sound more acceptable. Tyll was happy to declare the HD800 a massive winner and extremely well balanced, despite the headphones clearly being slanted towards articulation and coldness (which to his credit he did touch on), and despite him and others later recommending multiple mods, EQ tweaks and all the rest to get them to sound ironically better 'balanced', essentially adapting how they sound altogether! Note he hasn't offered the same advice or tweaks for cans such as the MDR-Z1R.

You know what? I didn't want to go there, but agree 100% on this. I stopped taking Tyll's reviews seriously right about then. I read them now and just shrug. The HD800 were the best damn hp in the world-- modded and EQ'd to death! Either you mod and EQ all hps to "bring out their best" or you don't. No peep on possible Z1R modding or EQing. He just trashed them.

Send me a PM if you are interested in the trade. Even trade, I'll pay the shipping costs. Serious traders only.

Hmm.. you may be onto something here... may have to get in on the action. At any rate, best possible response to a ridiculous statement.

And, once again, nobody is addressing Naim's point that the HD800 was heralded - arbitrarily - as "neutral" and "balanced" by Tyll for years, despite blood pouring from the ears of those who paid attention to his reviews, comments, and Wall of Fame and then went out and spent $1700 for them.

Exactly.

 

[Beagle]

am I the only one getting fed up with the garbage nonsense pilling up in this topic in the last week?
what I read are people who expect too much from a frequency response graph or somebody's review, but then blame the graphs and/or the review for their own mistaken assumptions.
several people warned that 2 rigs shouldn't be compared, then plenty of people do just that thinking they're making a good point...
many warned that a reviewer is just one guy with his opinion, then plenty of people go wild because they think what the reviewer said isn't 100% fact. well no **** Sherlock.

are you guys so insecure about your own taste that you need constant validation from online reviews? what about food? do you trow a tantrum if somebody doesn't like what you enjoy? I don't get it. I don't get why someone couldn't dislike a headphone without being wrong, I don't get why 2 measurement rigs showing variations is such a big deal when it's absolutely normal. I don't get any of it.

meanwhile, we all pretend like we want reviewers to stop sucking up to manufacturers. but if people react like this anytime someone says what he thinks, is it really such a surprise that in the long run most reviewers turn into "everything is awesome" BS reviews?



and please pretty please, stop with the "flat this", "neutral that". there is no neutral headphone response universally defined. if you think there is, most likely you need to look up headphone+human interaction and stuff about HRTF. if I feel like a headphone is neutral, it's my subjective impression and it does not define neutral for anybody else. why? because I am not the center of the universe. just like my idea of just the right quantity of spicy only has that balanced meaning for me. and someone else will put twice the amount and think I'm a *****. we are different people, our impressions are our own.
as for a graph, the flat line only means the stuff measured is similar to the reference used to calibrate the graph. and that's it. do you guys even know what that reference is when you make assumptions about how neutral the headphone is? if I use a square wave shape as reference, then only a square wave like response could look flat on the graph. a flat line never ever meant that the headphone was great or would sound neutral to me. if you have such an assumption, bury it deep and forget. measuring a headphone is not like measuring a DAC!

Nobody is forcing you to read it. Use the ignore button if need be.

 

[up late]

the hd800 isn't perfect or everyone's cup of tea but what headphone is? it is a legendary headphone however, that is still in production. i don't know how many of them have been sold over the last eight years - tens of thousands perhaps, but I find it hard to believe that every owner has found it problematic. i think that it still competes with far more expensive flagship headphones that have come after it.

 

[Beagle]

the hd800 isn't perfect or everyone's cup of tea but what headphone is? it is a legendary headphone however, that is still in production. i don't know how many of them have been sold over the last eight years - tens of thousands perhaps, but I find it hard to believe that every owner has found it problematic. i think that it still competes with far more expensive flagship headphones that have come after it.

The 'Big Mac' of headphones.

 

[up late]

not really. beats might be closer to the mark.

 

[Sonic Defender]

The 'Big Mac' of headphones.

I like how you can now get official McDonald's branded Big Mac sauce in squeeze bottles in the grocery store now!

 

[Martin79]

Pre mňa hd800(i have) without eq = unlistenable headphones.

 

[up late]

i've never found it unlistenable but it has a treble tilt to my ears, and i can understand how that 6khz spike would be a deal breaker for some folks. if you prefer a darker, bass heavy presentation then the z1r would most probably suit you better.

 

[Martin79]

Th900 which you have is not bass heavy?

 

[up late]

it has prodigious bass