The DIY'rs Cookbook

[johnjen]

   
so you do prefer the SQ using tone booster over Sonarworks?
 
ive tried the exact same setting and I find the SQ is not as good as sonarworks. it sounds very different actually and sounds almost nasal. maybe Im missing something

Thus far I prefer the tone boosters approach but then again it is more tailored to my modded 800's than even the no limits curve for the 800's, so it's a better fit.
 
And when I tried this approach before (well before sonarworks popped up on the scene) it too sounded funky and weird.
So I abandoned it and went in a different direction.
 
JJ

 

[johnjen]

So Akiko sticks can have a negative effect as well? Maybe something I need to try at a meet, they're interesting gizmos to say the least.

Yes they can, IF you 'go to far' with them.
 
By that I mean if to many sticks are added to the system they seem to 'over compensate' and the SQ falls off after they fully settle in.
 
I had the triple on my amp and dac and then I added a double to the dac as well and added a wireless canister strapped to the power cables at the duplex rectiptacle.
The SQ went soft, like it was over damped, as the life in the music got sucked out.
Until I removed the dbl from the dac, then the life in the music came back.
 
As I see it now, the triple when connected to the amp and dac makes the biggest difference.
And adding a wireless canister on the power cables is kinda like icing on the cake.
 
At least in my system anyways.
 
JJ

 

[johnjen]

 
Is that the universal one that just straps onto the cable with velcro/zip-ties?

The universal one is what I have strapped to my power cables at the duplex recpt.
As I mentioned it's like the icing on the cake.
 
JJ

 

[johnjen]

   
What's part of the TRS is it connected to?  The ground line?
 
Only asking so I can have a play myself ... after getting the new amp in, and researching tubes, I'm feeling all "tweaky" again.

Yes, the S of the TRS has a wire that is run out of the connector with a spade lug on the end for the re-wired dble stick to plug into.
 
It works really well on Big Poppas setup because he is running un-grounded and this connects directly with the ground plane at the out put of the amp.
 
JJ

 

[johnjen]

Me being mean with money and cobbling not half understood information together..

If piezoelectric effects are a 2 way street. Stress creates a current... current coverts energy through movement.

If that is the case..what would a cheap ultrasonic transducer do if placed in line or parallel to the ground plane?

I was thinking of encasing it in silicon window sealant so it doesn't doesn't create a voltage.. and using the ground to convert signal noise/current to sound/ transducer movement to energy. Ect... If that makes sense. ..

Just my silly mind working...

I did ask an engineer... He did mention that an unwanted parasitic resonance could occur. So mechanical damping with the silicon sealer..????

The stress creates very low current but fairly high voltage (depending upon the design).
And the reverse also holds true where high voltage creates greater displacement, but again the current is very low (little power is involved).
 
And what the akiko sticks 'seem' to be doing is holding the crystal elements in place while the voltage is applied and so as they try to displace (move) but are constrained by the 'potting compound', the voltage is converted to heat and not movement.
 
As to how they 'couple' with resonances without a direct electrical connection (wireless) I'm not sure, other than they may be using a mix of different 'resonantly active' materials.
 
JJ

 

[johnjen]

Some pictures would be nice if that's possible of the connections please BP

8^)

I looked and the only pic I have is a during construction shot.
It doesn't show the actual wiring as it exists in the connector.
 
Perhaps I'll get a chance to take a pic later when I make another one.
 
JJ

 

[johnjen]

So I have added the 2nd wyrd along with a 6" 'stubby' usb cable that interconnects them and a Schiit Pyst usb cable into the system.
I have cooked these cables and they are settling in.
 
I'll get a chance to hear what happens when I pull the wireless canister out of the system after the new usb setup fully stabilizes.
 
I'll probably also pull the triple canister out as well just to further document the changes.
 
But thus far there is NO incentive to want to mess with the SQ I have now, other than for strictly scientific reasons.
 
As a hint of the measure of the improvements, my cheap speakers are most impressive…
The sound stage has really come into much sharper focus, which I attribute to the 2nd wyrd and cable upgrade.
 
The euphonic toobz (which are still invisible

) I attribute to the akiko sticks/canisters.
 
Together they make for an even more compelling musical experience.
And these changes haven't fully settled in yet.
And if the past chages/improvements are repeated I figure I'll be setting new records in terms of overall acoustic levels of performance.
 
And there are additional tweaks, just waiting for when things settle in and stabilize.
 
JJ

 

[landroni]

  So I have added the 2nd wyrd along with a 6" 'stubby' usb cable that interconnects them and a Schiit Pyst usb cable into the system.
I have cooked these cables and they are settling in.

 
I'll get a chance to hear what happens when I pull the wireless canister out of the system after the new usb setup fully stabilizes.

When you "cook" the cables, what do you do exactly? Are you cryoing them?
 
And I'm curious why you stick to the USB setup instead of building the system upon SPDIF (either coax or optical)? USB seems to be the noisiest solution available, and perhaps some of these tweaks would be unnecessary (or have a more profound effect) if a less noisy transport were used from the start...

 

[Torq]

 
When you "cook" the cables, what do you do exactly? Are you cryoing them?
 
And I'm curious why you stick to the USB setup instead of building the system upon SPDIF (either coax or optical)? USB seems to be the noisiest solution available, and perhaps some of these tweaks would be unnecessary (or have a more profound effect) if a less noisy transport were used from the start...

For some information on cable cookers/cooking, you can have a read here.  I believe @johnjen uses one of their units.  I'm tempted to grab one myself and have a play.
 
This is different to cryogenic treatments.
 
And, with my tongue firmly in my cheek ('cause it's hard to argue with the results John gets), I'd say USB offers far more opportunities for tweaking than S/PDIF over optical ... 

 

[Torq]

  Yes, the S of the TRS has a wire that is run out of the connector with a spade lug on the end for the re-wired dble stick to plug into.
 
It works really well on Big Poppas setup because he is running un-grounded and this connects directly with the ground plane at the out put of the amp.
 
JJ

Cool, makes sense, thanks!

 

[johnjen]

 
When you "cook" the cables, what do you do exactly? Are you cryoing them?
 
And I'm curious why you stick to the USB setup instead of building the system upon SPDIF (either coax or optical)? USB seems to be the noisiest solution available, and perhaps some of these tweaks would be unnecessary (or have a more profound effect) if a less noisy transport were used from the start...

The link that Torq supplied is the cable cooker I use and it can cook just about any cable, except ethernet and opitcal cables.
It essentially throws current down the cables using either a swept triangle or square wave which 'conditions' not just the conductor but perhaps more significantly the insulation as well.
And after cooking and cryoing cables, the net results are most impressive.
 
I originally used ethernet as my data path of choice to feed my dac.
But ever since I got a wyrd and a better usb cable (and cooked it) the usb has delivered a superior signal.
 
I recently went back and tried an optical cable but it too falls short.
And I just added a 2nd wyrd and am using shorter usb cables, which again raised the bar, and in a significant way.
 
As for coax, I don't have a coax source to feed my dac to even try, and most ddc's use usb as their input which doesn't bypass usb's idiosyncrasies either, so I'm experimenting with optimizing the usb path.
 
I'd love to get a mac based pci card that outputs AES/EBU directly but they are usually massive overkill (as in multiple channels and WAY expensive) and of questionable SQ since no one else uses them.
 
And thus far, usb as 'funky' as it is, can be quite nice, when it's 'properly' tweaked.
 
JJ
ps the AudioDharma cooker now offers "GROUND BREAKER Power Cable Adapter Set" for cooking the ground wire in power cables.  This could be a significant improvement if the sonic attributes of improving the grounding of our systems can be tweaked by cooking the ground wire as well.

 

[Middy]

Sorry BP I am a bit of an armchair quarterback only through no electronics knowledge. It was more just to get an idea of what you are doing,rather than stealing ideas for free. Your hard work is yours alone.. to do as you wish.
So apologies if I made that impression my friend..8^). I had a graduate scratching His head when I mentioned using a piezoelectric device as a noise filter. Parasitic noise, then digital and sine wave basics....
If Akiko do what I think..Piezoelectric device and added voltage creates energy but then creates a voltage!

De coupling and using the incoming voltage. Like a capacitor or via inductance?? To shed the voltage noise but stop a feed back?

So a wired in cheap device just causes issues rather than fix. An Akiko stick is like a muffler for ground noise.
That's my simple view from my limited understanding. The last layer absorbs that vibration in the stick...
I throw ideas in here just to help, if they have any merit great..Just to put a smile on your face is good with me 2.
I just want to learn 8^).

And JJ thank you for helping me with my other outside interests. It's a bit random at the moment but some deeper thought and why it works, helps my cause. It now seems crazy not to get the kit 100% before starting to view or make additions first. It's like buying chrome wheels to make the car look better but the rest of the car is filthy...

Now cold cryo annealing metal and heat cycling via cable cooker... I have seen big billets of metal left out side for months too reduce micro fractures especially castings before machining.
You guys proving fairy to fact is a great learning experience so thank you.

Dave 8^)

An Intona usb filter is my last under the radar purchase for a while. That comes next week hopefully with the Silclear... I asked where it was and they are waiting a delivery so I can't do the earth/screws and xlr yet.......

Squalene oil in the contact cleaners made me laugh... It's shark oil...
Snake oil isn't as good I hear...

 

[johnjen]

Ok so here is an experiment that costs no money, will take very little time, and might just open a few eyes…
 
If you have a crossfeed circuit in your system, try turning it off (or on as the case may be) and listen for any qualitative changes to each individual 'voice'.
Try to ignore the sound stage changes and only focus upon the 'integrity' of each 'voice' as it is presented.
 
I would assume that different methods of inserting these signals into the mix will yield differing results.
 
And be sure and report your experimental results back here.
 
JJ 

 

[johnjen]

Sorry BP I am a bit of an armchair quarterback only through no electronics knowledge. It was more just to get an idea of what you are doing,rather than stealing ideas for free. Your hard work is yours alone.. to do as you wish.
So apologies if I made that impression my friend..8^). I had a graduate scratching His head when I mentioned using a piezoelectric device as a noise filter. Parasitic noise, then digital and sine wave basics....
If Akiko do what I think..Piezoelectric device and added voltage creates energy but then creates a voltage!

De coupling and using the incoming voltage. Like a capacitor or via inductance?? To shed the voltage noise but stop a feed back?

So a wired in cheap device just causes issues rather than fix. An Akiko stick is like a muffler for ground noise.
That's my simple view from my limited understanding. The last layer absorbs that vibration in the stick...
I throw ideas in here just to help, if they have any merit great..Just to put a smile on your face is good with me 2.
I just want to learn 8^).

And JJ thank you for helping me with my other outside interests. It's a bit random at the moment but some deeper thought and why it works, helps my cause. It now seems crazy not to get the kit 100% before starting to view or make additions first. It's like buying chrome wheels to make the car look better but the rest of the car is filthy...

Now cold cryo annealing metal and heat cycling via cable cooker... I have seen big billets of metal left out side for months too reduce micro fractures especially castings before machining.
You guys proving fairy to fact is a great learning experience so thank you.

snip

As I see it sharing the results of our experiments and investigations just might spur others to pick up the baton and run with it, and perhaps take them even further.
 
 
The cryo treatment basically tends to 'straighten out' the crystalline structure of metal which might also help to smooth the surface as well.
But this is speculative on my part, although I have read some reports that 'strongly' pointed in this direction.
 
 
The cooking doesn't really involve heating the wires, rather it passes a 'strong' current thru the conductors which in turn fluxes 'strong' magnetic and electrostatic fields in and around the cables being cooked.
My 'take' on this is, this fluxing 'scrambles' or re-orders, or resets the dielectric (insulation) to be (more?) 'neutral' to these fields.
This also applies to the conductor itself, and I figure that it helps to set up the dielectric to absorb the electrostatic charge more evenly as well.
 
IOW cooking 'treats' the wire and insulative materials to be neutral in terms of how they 'react' to the voltages and currents that the cable will actually be used for.
At least that is what my speculative head scratching comes up…
 
And these 2 processes work rather well together to produce 'Better' results.
 
JJ
ps "Piezoelectric device and added voltage creates energy but then creates a voltage!"
My speculation is…
The piezo-electric material is held in a dense bonding compound (think potting compound) which while being conductive also will hold the crystals 'tightly' in place.
This should reduce the amount of movement/displacement of the crystals as the induced voltage tries to get them to move.
This in turn means they will generate even smaller 'back voltages' and will tend to dissipate the induced voltage as heat.
 
Of course this doesn't apply to the wireless canisters and sticks which I figure must operate on matching resonances with the fields it is in.

 
 
JJ

 

[landroni]

  The cryo treatment basically tends to 'straighten out' the crystalline structure of metal which might also help to smooth the surface as well.
But this is speculative on my part, although I have read some reports that 'strongly' pointed in this direction.

 

 
The cooking doesn't really involve heating the wires, rather it passes a 'strong' current thru the conductors which in turn fluxes 'strong' magnetic and electrostatic fields in and around the cables being cooked.
My 'take' on this is, this fluxing 'scrambles' or re-orders, or resets the dielectric (insulation) to be (more?) 'neutral' to these fields.
This also applies to the conductor itself, and I figure that it helps to set up the dielectric to absorb the electrostatic charge more evenly as well.

 
IOW cooking 'treats' the wire and insulative materials to be neutral in terms of how they 'react' to the voltages and currents that the cable will actually be used for.
 

Thanks for this. I too was wondering what was the intended effect of 'cooking' on the cables.
 
As for cryoing, having discussed this a bit with Torq, my understanding is that cryoing has an effect on the cables' internal structure. There will be clear changes in the crystal/boundary structure (which can even be seen under an electron microscope). Now, and this is conceptually related to the cleaning of connectors with e.g. Deoxit, "every boundary in the internal make up of a cable has similar properties to the connections in an electrical cable [...] in that they can result in signal reflections in the cable. Now those boundaries are very very small, so the reflections are similarly tiny (compared to the huge boundary you find with an RCA connector) and the effects are going to be small. But ... making the crystals LARGER reduces the number of boundaries and reduces this effect so, in theory, you should get a cleaner signal. [...]  And such treatment very definitely, and measurably, affects the strength of metals."
 
I suspect such improvements will manifest themselves sonically, as you often suggest, only in well-tweaked systems that have few bottlenecks elsewhere...
 

And these 2 processes work rather well together to produce 'Better' results.

 
Do you mean that you will both cryo and cook the same cable?