[Ooztuncer]

Howdy folks,
I would like to buy a tablet pc to my father. He is a physics engineer; but teaching high school physics for last 30 years. I am 28 and till from the start he is doing nothing but writing his books in all of his limited free time, lol.

He already published 7 of them using traditional methods > he writes/draws everything on the paper, then publisher make them converted to electronic format & prints/distributes.

He is living overseas and have 0 (literally) knowledge on computers, but very interested in using some kind of electronic device so that he can write/draw on the fly.

What would you recommend him > a tablet pc or a standard laptop with digitizer (like wacom) or something else?

Even tough I am heavily involved with hardware (for desktop pc's), I have no idea especially on the software which enables him to write/draw. Are they suitable for hand writing. Also, drawing is crucial for his work (again by hand).

I am open the suggestions. Thanks kindly...

 

[MusicallySilent]

There is a learning curve with wacoms because you have to draw in one spot look in the other...

For less knowledge i would go tablet pc because the curve is harder with a wacom

If the tablet is wacom enabled it is better because it might have pressure sensitivity

 

[xnothingpoetic]

A tablet (wacom) plus a laptop wouldn't be ideal for the ultimate portable or for on the fly witting.

I think a tablet PC would be better for your father.


Lenovo makes tablet PC's you can do research on

http://shop.lenovo.com/SEUILibrary/c...67E79E0E7C9A2D

 

[Edwood]

Definitely get a hybrid touchscreen/ active digitizer tablet PC, like Thinkpad, and apparently Dell's upcoming tablet PC will also have that option.

Another thing to consider, is portability. Will your dad be carrying it around a lot? You'd probably want to stick with a 12" model, but the screen real estate is smaller and makes it harder to read, and write/draw.

I assume your dad will need to be able to type, so look for a convertible Tablet PC, rather than a slate only model.

Also, what is your budget, Tablet PC's are more expensive than other Windows based laptops.

-Ed

 

[Ooztuncer]

thank you for the great start up. I will look into tablet pc's then.

Good thing is it doesn't need to be portable. I am sure that he will use it either in his room at work or home.

Ed, what exactly slate model means? I am thinking that for this project the letters will also be composed of his hand writing. But it would be nice to convert those hand writings to word fonts (arial, times new roman, etc.) if necessary.

And for the software, do we need to buy special software or they come with the laptops? As I said drawing hand made shapes are crucial for him.

Thanks again...

edit: this looks great (4 movies talking about the pc) > http://www.gateway.com/programs/convertible/index.php

 

[Edwood]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ooztuncer /img/forum/go_quote.gif Ed, what exactly slate model means? I am thinking that for this project the letters will also be composed of his hand writing. But it would be nice to convert those hand writings to word fonts (arial, times new roman, etc.) if necessary.

Slates are Tablet PC's without a built in keyboard (can have a detacheable one, though) They are lighter in weight, and are usually more ergonomic for hand held use.

One of the best (and most expensive.)
http://www.motioncomputing.com/produ..._pc_le17wt.asp


Convertibles are Tablet PC's with a built in keyboard, the screen usually swivels around and folds flat on top of the keyboard. While they are heavier and larger than their slate counter parts, you won't have loose accessories to carry around. A major plus for those that like to type as well as write/draw.

http://shop.lenovo.com/SEUILibrary/c...67E79E0E7C9A2D


Quote:

And for the software, do we need to buy special software or they come with the laptops? As I said drawing hand made shapes are crucial for him. Thanks again...

Tablet PC's come with Windows Journal, which you can handwrite and draw. It can convert handwriting to text as well. Microsoft One Note is an even more comprehensive program where you can draw, takes notes, and organize even more than Journal. One Note often is bundled with Tablet PC's, but you can buy it separately.

I'd recommend getting a Tablet PC with Windows Vista, unless your dad really needs to use an older App that doesn't work with Vista, otherwise, Vista makes significant improvements over the Windows XP Tablet PC Edition.


Quote:

edit: this looks great (4 movies talking about the pc) > http://www.gateway.com/programs/convertible/index.php

Gateway does not have touchscreen and active digitizer. The Gateway does not seem to use a Wacom digitizer, the Gateway is known to have issues with calibration. Also, you have to press a button to rotate the screen orientation?! C'mon, Gateway, this is 2007, Tablet PC's were able to automatically rotate the screen from the beginning. My first gen Toshiba Portege 3505 was even able to do just that.

One of the best Tablet PC's for the money was the Toshiba R25 (this one is my main Tablet PC). Just over $1000, 14" screen, DVD-RW-DL Burner, 100GB HDD, Core Duo 1.6GHz. Unfortunately they discontinued it.

-Ed

 

[mikeliao]

How detailed does your afther's drawings have to be? I mean are they basic line drawings and some text on the side, or a really fine pictures with lots of details?

I've been using tablet PC's for the last 8 years and while great at getting drawings and information down fast, they don't do very fine detailed drawings well. Even properly calibrated, the nibs are just too thick and the pixels too large to draw extremely fine.

As Ed mentioned, Win Journal works well enough. Another fun program if you need to draw more than lines is Painter...make sure the digitizer is pressure sensitive if you use Painter.

 

[Ooztuncer]

Ed, thank you very much for the brief tutorial.

And mikeliao, for your question, take a look at your high school physics textbook for the type of work that will be involved in this job (some chapters like newtonian physics, optics, vectors, waves, mechanical movemement, energy, basic circuits, magnetism, etc.). The drawings are not overly complex but still needs a lot of hand free-movement and in some instances details.

I was wondering if we can pull this off for relatively cheap slates like this one > http://www.adesso.com/products_detail.asp?productid=294 with an additional 2gb sd card.

I already bought a laptop couple of months ago for him but he didn't fired it yet (lol). But with something like that he can type/draw and then transfer it to the laptop.

I believe the biggest problem will be finding software that will recognize Turkish characters like ç,ğ,ö,ş,ı,ü & scientific notation like ß,â,î,û, etc.

And another possible problem will be finding slates that has pressure sensitivity.

I will keep looking, and within this time if you come across something suitable for this job (for relatively cheap price) please share with me.

Thanks....


EDIT: by the way, both of you (Ed and Mikeliao) have some unbeliveable gear inventory, pheww...

 

[xnothingpoetic]

If he already has a laptop and he doesn't need to move around much, then maybe a wacom would be better for him.

You can use it to hand write and turn it into text and it has pressure sensitivity.

I think a Intuos3 6x8 would be ideal and can be had for around $250-$270.

 

[Wodgy]

This sounds a bit like a search for a gadget where none may be needed.

If your father's publisher processes/redraws/redoes the images anyway prior to publication, like most publishers, why not just let him continue sketching on paper like he currently does. Just get him a scanner so he can scan in the images.

Why specifically is your father looking for an electronic gadget? What kind of workflow does he want? If his publisher currently turns his sketches into print-ready diagrams and he intends to take over the job of creating print-ready diagrams himself, he should realize that he'll be taking on a lot of extra work -- more than he realizes. Just as buying Photoshop and an SLR camera doesn't turn a person into an expert photographer, hardware and software does not replace the elbow grease involved in converting sketches to final diagrams. It makes sense to let people at the publisher do that, so he can concentrate on what he's good at: writing physics texts.

 

[roastpuff]

Just to chime in on the Lenovo Tablet - it's a great piece of machinery, but you'll need an external optical drive, or the docking station. Otherwise... it's a great product. Wish I had the cash!

 

[Ooztuncer]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wodgy /img/forum/go_quote.gif This sounds a bit like a search for a gadget where none may be needed. If your father's publisher processes/redraws/redoes the images anyway prior to publication, like most publishers, why not just let him continue sketching on paper like he currently does. Just get him a scanner so he can scan in the images. Why specifically is your father looking for an electronic gadget? What kind of workflow does he want? If his publisher currently turns his sketches into print-ready diagrams and he intends to take over the job of creating print-ready diagrams himself, he should realize that he'll be taking on a lot of extra work -- more than he realizes. Just as buying Photoshop and an SLR camera doesn't turn a person into an expert photographer, hardware and software does not replace the elbow grease involved in converting sketches to final diagrams. It makes sense to let people at the publisher do that, so he can concentrate on what he's good at: writing physics texts.

Well, I can see your point but let me kindly remind you that I know what he is capable of and what a big pain in the neck to convert hundreds of hand written/drawn subjects/pages into electronic format by someone else.

I didn't need to mention in the beginning but the request came from my father himself (depending on his experience) - i didn't tell him that there are some tools that can help him to facilitate his work.

He prefers to write/draw on the fly rather than a conversion afterwards. Highly likely publisher will touch and do some improvements in the end, but I assure you that he wants to minimize the editing phase. By getting him a gadget, he will be able to create & edit his work any time.

Also, think of the time savings after the learning curve. Traditionally, he parts his work and give it to the typer/drawer/editor guy. After that, never ending correction phase starts. People, especially who converts hand written things to electronic format, have a tendency to change the original material without any reason! Hopefully, he can get rid of someone else's touches as much as possible.

I can go on this topic all day long, however i would like to go back on our original discussion, which is 'what to buy' (rather than a discussion around whether he needs something like this or not). Thanks...

 

[Edwood]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wodgy /img/forum/go_quote.gif This sounds a bit like a search for a gadget where none may be needed. If your father's publisher processes/redraws/redoes the images anyway prior to publication, like most publishers, why not just let him continue sketching on paper like he currently does. Just get him a scanner so he can scan in the images. Why specifically is your father looking for an electronic gadget? What kind of workflow does he want? If his publisher currently turns his sketches into print-ready diagrams and he intends to take over the job of creating print-ready diagrams himself, he should realize that he'll be taking on a lot of extra work -- more than he realizes. Just as buying Photoshop and an SLR camera doesn't turn a person into an expert photographer, hardware and software does not replace the elbow grease involved in converting sketches to final diagrams. It makes sense to let people at the publisher do that, so he can concentrate on what he's good at: writing physics texts.

Windows Journal files can be outputted as image files as well as being readable by most MS Word programs.

A Tablet PC would save him the scanning and image processing steps.

I am an artist by trade, and I no longer draw on paint on real paper. It takes a little getting used to, but ever since I've been able to draw directly on the screen, I never looked back.

Getting a convertible Tablet PC is a win-win, where you can use it as a standard laptop AND be able to sketch on it, handwrite, etc.

-Ed

 

[Wodgy]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Edwood /img/forum/go_quote.gif Windows Journal files can be outputted as image files as well as being readable by most MS Word programs. A Tablet PC would save him the scanning and image processing steps. I am an artist by trade, and I no longer draw on paint on real paper. It takes a little getting used to, but ever since I've been able to draw directly on the screen, I never looked back.

You're the artist -- you're producing finished work. It's not the same type of workflow. What I was commenting on was how introducing a digital device into his workflow now shifts the burden of preparing final illustrations from someone else (presumably an artist or a prepress person) to the author. This isn't just introducing new technology, this is taking on the burden of work that used to be someone else's. I personally would be glad if someone else prepared camera-ready versions of papers for publication from my drafts so I didn't have to do it. It's a lot of extra work.

In any case, to get back to the original poster's question, since your dad is not looking for a mobile solution, it makes much more sense to get a Wacom Cintiq (basically a screen you write directly on) than a Tablet PC. With a TabletPC, you're essentially buying a whole computer just to get a drawing tablet with a screen. If you don't need the mobility and the hassle of maintaining another, relatively slow, machine, allocate the same money towards a high quality solution specifically for drawing. The Cintiq is especially good because Physics illustrations for publication will almost all be vector art. It's easier to pull control points in Illustrator with a high-resolution display (and tedious with a conventional blind tablet). You can get the same resolution display in a few TabletPC models, but the screens are much smaller and they're hard for someone with older vision to work with.

 

[Edwood]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wodgy /img/forum/go_quote.gif You're the artist -- you're producing finished work. It's not the same type of workflow. What I was commenting on was how introducing a digital device into his workflow now shifts the burden of preparing final illustrations from someone else (presumably an artist or a prepress person) to the author. This isn't just introducing new technology, this is taking on the burden of work that used to be someone else's. I personally would be glad if someone else prepared camera-ready versions of papers for publication from my drafts so I didn't have to do it. It's a lot of extra work. In any case, to get back to the original poster's question, since your dad is not looking for a mobile solution, it makes much more sense to get a Wacom Cintiq (basically a screen you write directly on) than a Tablet PC. With a TabletPC, you're essentially buying a whole computer just to get a drawing tablet with a screen. If you don't need the mobility and the hassle of maintaining another, relatively slow, machine, allocate the same money towards a high quality solution specifically for drawing. The Cintiq is especially good because Physics illustrations for publication will almost all be vector art. It's easier to pull control points in Illustrator with a high-resolution display (and tedious with a conventional blind tablet). You can get the same resolution display in a few TabletPC models, but the screens are much smaller and they're hard for someone with older vision to work with.

I agree that a Wacom Cintiq is better, but the 21UX costs $2500. Not everyone is ready to drop that much money on technology that is new to them.

Why in the world would his dad have to do finished vector art? Have you ever used a Tablet PC? It's not specifically aimed at artists, in fact, it's not ready out of the box to be a complete artist's tool.

There is no difference in handwriting and drawing on paper and Windows Journal other than you have more tools at your disposal in Journal and you do not have to scan anything.

For the OP, before you just go off and buy a Tablet PC or whatever, perhaps have your Dad try playing around with a Tablet PC to see if he can get a feel for it. Do your homework on Windows Journal and other Tablet PC apps, and walk him through it. Although Journal is really easy to use, no need for a complex tutorial or anything. You just start writing on the screen.

-Ed