[akira281]

For people considering purchasing one of these, beside the large price difference, what are the sonic differences?

Does the extreme dropoff at 16kHz on the UE-10 affect its sense of airiness and extension?

 

[chrisfromalbany]

Have you were hear 16K to 20k Hertz? The difference is very small. No I don't fine that to be factor.

Hard to do a comparison because they are two different animals. I have heard both but never did a real comparison. Because you can't really compare them. The UE-10s are noticible better in ways. Detail, controlled bass. and seperation come to mind.

 

[Jasper994]

The Super.Fi carries much of the same flavor of the UE-10, but (as it should) falls short in every category. That's not to say the SF5P isn't a nice piece, it's just not the UE-10.

If you have specific questions I'll try to answer them, otherwise just look for the reviews I'll be completing in the near future.

As far as the 16khz roll off on the UE-10, it's that way with all canalphones. The balanced armature driver used in IEMs is the issue. I don't really think it has much effect on the airyness though. That's more an issue with any sealed listening piece. I'd say the UE-10 sounds suprisingly airy considering their sealed nature. As far as extension goes, the treble on the UE-10 extends quite nicely, though it is not the focus of the presentation.

 

[chrisfromalbany]

Quote:

Originally Posted by akira281 For people considering purchasing one of these, beside the large price difference, what are the sonic differences? Does the extreme dropoff at 16kHz on the UE-10 affect its sense of airiness and extension?

i guess better yet have you heard the difference from 14-16Hz. Even their sound don't sound that much higher. (not sure if that is good engish or not) You can go up 1KHz and seems like you have gone up one note maybe.

 

[wolfB]

I think the biggest advantage of the sf5pro is, that you get rather balanced sound spectrum. I don't think the bass is emphased and the highs rolled off. Though, the comparison to ue-10 reveals, that when forced, they tend to rather leave extended things out instead of discolor or harsh the sound. As for the 16khz drop I'd agree with Jasper. I'd prefer the honest reproduction of recorded image information from a good IEM over the artifical airyness of most conventional open cans or ear buds. The sf5 can reproduce a lot of image information, while the ue-10 go a few steps further by adding space, pulse and life, if its in the recording.

 

[root]

I think one should not compare the frequency response of a full can with the frequency response of an IEM. There is a plethora of vacillating foctors which render frequency response graphs at least not useful IMO. There are constantly shifting differences in linearity of frequency response. Frequency response can be used merely as a hint as regards IEM's. I've found out Lindrone's idea about it:
Quote:

Originally Posted by Lindrone But does the argument against frequency response charts for canalphones hold for custom molded models? Yeah, it certainly does. Even though you can more or less make the opening of the bores for custom molded earphones end up at the same location in terms of your ears (usually just enough to get to the "bend" of your ear canal), it doesn't speak for how much distance the sound has to travel before it reaches that point, nor does it speak for how much distance sound has to travel after that point. The size of the ear and the shape, distance of each individual's ear canal are still different, even if you end up trying to get the most consistent point to "release" the sound, you still can't predict how that sound is going to be like "exactly". I believe you can get it to a pretty consistent, close point, but exact replicate of that sound for each ear is impossible. I don't believe these type of minute differences is that bad when it comes down to day to day, practical usage. However, when you're benchmarking such a small difference, I believe there is a big problem with whatever method you choose to go along with. You can manipulate the results of these type of benchmarks by optimizing for certain type of test results... not unlike how graphic card vendors for computers tweaks their drivers to score high on certain popular benchmarks. Note that this is a challenge not only with canalphones, but with any sound reproduction equipment in general. There's arguments about measuring performance of speakers, headphones... for just about as many variety of reasons as canalphones. Just that canalphones can be easily affected by even the smallest of change (exhibited by how sound signature changes just by switching tips). That's why, generally, I don't give a crap about frequency response charts... there's too much to read into it that doesn't mean anything... It only gives you a hint of what technical performance the headphone might be able to perform, but tells you absolutely nothing about the way it really sounds.

 

[akira281]

I had owned the Ety ER4S for a number of years until it broke recently. I tried the Super.fi's when they came out. My impressions of them where mixed.

On the one hand I found the 5Pros much warmer and fuller than the Ety's with an incredible, though not particularly well defined bass (compared to the ER4S). The overall presentation I heard was very different from every headphone I own including the Senn HD580 and Grado 325 which led me to question their balance and accuracy.

Most notably I found that the mids, particularly voices, were somewhat colored (though pleasantly so) and recessed. My concern grew when I started to feel that the bass was at times excessive, in part due to the tendency to increase the volume to compensate the mids.

The output volume was also a concern. Fed directly out of my Tapwave Zodiac, for instance, I was only able to move the dial a fraction from zero before the sound was too loud. Unfortunately the supplied attenuator seems to cut the output too much and tends to suck some of the life out them. Also, electronic noise heard from different amps was a minor annoyance.

YET, after listening to the Super.fi's for a while I found it difficult to listen to the Ety's, which now sound somewhat harsh. I still think the 5Pros have a very seductive sound with a large soundstage and killer bass. I am wondering, though, if the UE-10's would solve these above issues.

 

[LFF]

I would have to agree with Jasper994 comments. I can't really say how actual production units of the super.fi sound but judging from my pre-production unit, they have a similar flavor to the UE-10's but fall way below mark of the 10's. The UE-10's offer a very, IMHO, uncolored sound. They are very neutral and EVERYTHING sounds great with them. They will not produce killer bass, but what bass they reproduce is very accurate and lifelike. For proof of this, just listen to Janos Starker through the 10's - Simply amazing. Voices, particulary females like Jacintha or Ella Fitzgerald sound detailed and you hear thier lips opening before they sing. Louis Armstrong comes across as being alive and well, definately singing and scatting inside your very own room. It's an experience I cherish and one I relish in everytime I listen to my UE-10's. Let's not even get into choirs.

In my opinion the 16k rolloff makes very little difference. I think it makes little difference because of the extreme isolation you get with custom IEM's. It definately sounds much better than those other buds which claim to have frequency responses from 12Hz-22kHz. As far as IEM's go, the UE-10 is king. The Pro's and Eb's are not shabby but the UE-10 creams them in every way possible - comfort, fit, sound quality, etc. While the price difference is huge, the quality of sound and the quality service provided by the people over at Ultimate Ears makes each and every penny count. The purchase of my UE-10's are a purchase I do not regret for one moment. Are there better headphones? - yes. Are there better IEM's. I seriously doubt it.

 

[root]

Quote:

Originally Posted by LFF Are there better IEM's. I seriously doubt it.

I'll say it in the spirit of head-fi: try Sensaphonics then (or ES2- although I don't have these).

 

[bhd812]

Quote:

Originally Posted by root I'll say it in the spirit of head-fi: try Sensaphonics then (or ES2- although I don't have these).

Rooto WHats with the Sensaphonics ProPhonics T2i? I dont see them on the site at all?

 

[root]

They may not be manufactured in the U.S. I got mine from ACS U.K. There are differences between T2i and T2PRO (especially as regards construction).

 

[JohnRich]

Quote:

Originally Posted by root They may not be manufactured in the U.S. I got mine from ACS U.K. There are differences between T2i and T2PRO (especially as regards construction).

You have both? do they sound different? and how does the construction differ?

My T2XS (the old name for the T2PRO) are broken pending repair. Am using their T15 with musicians ER25 earmolds as an interim measure. I was expecting them to be somewhat similar to the Ety ER6 but they aren't at all. They sound very much like the T2XS but perhaps slightly less extended at the extremes of bass and treble.

 

[root]

Quote:

Originally Posted by JohnRich You have both? do they sound different? and how does the construction differ? My T2XS (the old name for the T2PRO) are broken pending repair. Am using their T15 with musicians ER25 earmolds as an interim measure. I was expecting them to be somewhat similar to the Ety ER6 but they aren't at all. They sound very much like the T2XS but perhaps slightly less extended at the extremes of bass and treble.

Yes, I have both of these. To tell you the truth, it's still hard to say for me if they differ that much in terms of sonic qualities. I thought I'd have some time breaking in T2PRO's, but almost none of this had happened. Both models I have are fairly new and recently I have been spending my time solely with T2i's. Once I have them in my ears it's just pure audio nirvana and it's hard for me to part with the sound even so as to put another pair on

. So, it boils down that I still don't know exactly. On the first listen, however, they sound very similar.

On to some construction differences. T2i's are dedicated to consumer-oriented audio market. First of all, the silicone is black, there is a black, soft cable (longer than in T2PRO's), but I guess the default color of the T2i's cable is white (mine were fully customized). You can also choose other colors of the silicones. The cable is placed differently in the shell, so that now you can choose if you want to wear these behind your ears (like T2PRO's) or just like regular earbuds. The cable doesn't have the memory wires. At the first glance at these you can tell that they are perfectly finished off. Every tiniest detail is taken into account and the moulds themselves are perfectly cast.

If I ever get enough strength to overcome listening solely to T2i's I will update more. It's just that T2i's happen to be on the top while T2PRO's are at the bottom of the box

.

Wow, you are the first person, I think, who has T15's. I heard these are very good and the price is also very tempting. It's the proprietary invention of ACS and they are supposed to be better than any other single-driver IEM's currently available. What's your take on this? They seem very promising.

Good luck with your T2XS.

 

[digihead]

LFF - I'd be interested to hear your thoughts on the UE10pro bass when you receive your Hornet. 5g ipod > Hornet > UE10pro can produce the BASS...

 

[aroundsound]

Root or JohnRich (or anyone else for that matter) thoughts if you don't mind on the T2i. I have the ER 4P (in for repair at the moment) that I use with custom moulds. I also have a SM V1 amp which is great. As they are in for repair and I live in the UK and am without the etys for some time I began to wonder about getting a second pair of IEM's.

I am thinking about the UE 5Pro but am concerned that they may be too much of a contrast with the ety's. Then, as you do, my mind began to wonder what the UE 10 would be like - then I read this thread and have become curious about the T2i that is mentioned above. I've tried doing searches in various places for reviews but so far have found only 1. I have the info regarding ACS website but your thoughts on the sound, how they compare (in your view) to the other IEM's I am considering and any background to them would be much appreciated. Thanks.