[mac336]

Anyone have any suggestions on a DAC that is as good or close to bifrost for under $400.  would be using DAC with HD-650 and HE-500. 

 

[mac336]

bump

 

[cpu8088]

i originally considered bifrost and noticed it could not accept 24/176 native files.
 
now using firestone ILTW and havent looked back.
 
 

 

[IEMCrazy]

Quote:

Anyone have any suggestions on a DAC that is as good or close to bifrost for under $400.  would be using DAC with HD-650 and HE-500. 

 
Bifrost is only $350 if you don't need USB (I.E. if you have an optical or SPDIF output on your computer or playback device...)  I'm assuming that's not an option for you since you'd have mentioned that, but I thought I'd mention it anyway.  Not many laptops have SPDIF out and for some reason laptops seem to have become the most common thing around here, but most desktops have SPDIF, so you may have it already and don't know it!
 
 

 

[mac336]

Sorry for ignorance, but what exactly does this mean?
Quote:

i originally considered bifrost and noticed it could not accept 24/176 native files.
 
now using firestone ILTW and havent looked back.
 
 

 

 

[IEMCrazy]

 
Quote:

Sorry for ignorance, but what exactly does this mean? Quote:

i originally considered bifrost and noticed it could not accept 24/176 native files.
 
now using firestone ILTW and havent looked back.
 
 

 
The Bifrost's USB implementation does not support playback of recordings from high-resolution sources that happen to be in the 24-bit/176khz format.  It supports 24/192 just fine, but not 24-176 which happens to be the sample rate used for many DVD-A (DVD-Audio) format high-res recordings. 
 
I believe it supports that sample rate over the S/PDIF inputs (optical, coaxial) but not over USB.  For most people that isn't an issue, it's sort of a rare-ish data format for most sources, including most online stores selling digital high-res audio.  But for people who are supporting a collection of DVD-A rips, or older downloads that used that sample rate, it's a show-stopper.  24/96 and 24/192 are the more common high-res formats, and plain old CD-Audio, MP3, AAC, (and FLAC from CD-Audio) are in 16/44.1.  If you've never purchased high-res music before, I wouldn't worry about it now, it's a semi-dead format.
 
The last line was a recommendation for the Firestone ILTW DAC as an answer to your original question: A DAC that isn't Bifrost

 
 

 

[philspins]

I haven't heard the Bifrost but I just recently got a Grant Fidelity TubeDAC-11 for $325 and I'm liking it quite a lot!!  The USB interface is limited to 24/96 but the S/PDIF connections go up to 29/192.  Don't know how it handles 24/176.
 
Another option.

 

[judmarc]

I wouldn't worry about it now, it's [24/176] a semi-dead format.
 
Umm, except for Reference Recordings' hi-res, some of the best available, and the Rolling Stones ABKCO catalog at HDTracks (available at 24/88.2 also, but the higher res is reputed to sound better according to at least one reviewer).
 
I personally get around this by using my player software (see sig) to upsample everything to 24/192 before sending it out via USB to the Bifrost.  The sample rate converter in the software is one of the best available, and my results have been excellent - better than leaving everything at native rate, better than optical out of my MacBook Pro, which is limited to 24/96 anyway.
 
And re the OP, well, the best DAC I personally know of comparable to the Bifrost, is, uhh, the Bifrost.
 
Any reason you specifically don't want the Bifrost?

 

[cpu8088]

IEMCrazy
 
u are my spokesman
 
 
 
 

 

[mac336]

I was just looking to see if there were any DACs as good as bifrost, but cheaper.  looking like bifrost is as good as a DAC there is for the $350-400 range
Quote:

I wouldn't worry about it now, it's [24/176] a semi-dead format.
 
Umm, except for Reference Recordings' hi-res, some of the best available, and the Rolling Stones ABKCO catalog at HDTracks (available at 24/88.2 also, but the higher res is reputed to sound better according to at least one reviewer).
 
I personally get around this by using my player software (see sig) to upsample everything to 24/192 before sending it out via USB to the Bifrost.  The sample rate converter in the software is one of the best available, and my results have been excellent - better than leaving everything at native rate, better than optical out of my MacBook Pro, which is limited to 24/96 anyway.
 
And re the OP, well, the best DAC I personally know of comparable to the Bifrost, is, uhh, the Bifrost.
 
Any reason you specifically don't want the Bifrost?

 

 

[estreeter]

Quote:

I haven't heard the Bifrost but I just recently got a Grant Fidelity TubeDAC-11 for $325 and I'm liking it quite a lot!!  The USB interface is limited to 24/96 but the S/PDIF connections go up to 29/192.  Don't know how it handles 24/176.
 
Another option.

Who cares if it handles 24/176 ?
 
http://people.xiph.org/~xiphmont/demo/neil-young.html#toc_intro
 
I dont have the science to refute or verify any of the above, but this gives me pause for thought:
 
 
192kHz digital music files offer no benefits. They're not quite neutral either; practical fidelity is slightly worse. The ultrasonics are a liability during playback.
Neither audio transducers nor power amplifiers are free of distortion, and distortion tends to increase rapidly at the lowest and highest frequencies. If the same transducer reproduces ultrasonics along with audible content, any nonlinearity will shift some of the ultrasonic content down into the audible range as an uncontrolled spray of intermodulation distortion products covering the entire audible spectrum. Nonlinearity in a power amplifier will produce the same effect. The effect is very slight, but listening tests have confirmed that both effects can be audible.
 
I know - this needs to be taken to Sound Science - just pointing out that its unlikely that the OP has bat-like hearing. 
 

 

[dyl1dyl]

I managed to A-B the Bifrost with the Nuforce-HDP with an Asgard/Lyr>He500/LCD-2. The Bifrost was definietly better but the Nuforce wasn't far off, just a little dry and thin. it is pretty good value though considering it packs a pretty decent headphone amp too. Furthermore, if all you need is usb, just get the Nuforce HD, thats 349 and sounds the same as the HDP

 

[philspins]

Quote:

Quote:

I haven't heard the Bifrost but I just recently got a Grant Fidelity TubeDAC-11 for $325 and I'm liking it quite a lot!!  The USB interface is limited to 24/96 but the S/PDIF connections go up to 29/192.  Don't know how it handles 24/176.
 
Another option.

Who cares if it handles 24/176 ?
 
http://people.xiph.org/~xiphmont/demo/neil-young.html#toc_intro
 
I dont have the science to refute or verify any of the above, but this gives me pause for thought:
 
 
192kHz digital music files offer no benefits. They're not quite neutral either; practical fidelity is slightly worse. The ultrasonics are a liability during playback.
Neither audio transducers nor power amplifiers are free of distortion, and distortion tends to increase rapidly at the lowest and highest frequencies. If the same transducer reproduces ultrasonics along with audible content, any nonlinearity will shift some of the ultrasonic content down into the audible range as an uncontrolled spray of intermodulation distortion products covering the entire audible spectrum. Nonlinearity in a power amplifier will produce the same effect. The effect is very slight, but listening tests have confirmed that both effects can be audible.
 
I know - this needs to be taken to Sound Science - just pointing out that its unlikely that the OP has bat-like hearing. 
 

I just added in the part about 24/176 because there was discussion above regarding that format.  I'm using it at 24/96 via the USB connection and couldn't be happier .
 

 

[estreeter]

Quote:

I just added in the part about 24/176 because there was discussion above regarding that format.  I'm using it at 24/96 via the USB connection and couldn't be happier .
 

No probs - I was probably a little OTT in the tone of my response - I just see a lot of naysayers who are prepared to write gear off if it doesn't handle everything up to 384 kHZ.