[Nerull]

Hey guys, I need advice from people I guess; so I figured why not the Head-Fi forums?

On a more serious tone, I figured that even with financial aid and the like, I cannot afford to go to college without accumulating massive amounts of debt. My goal was to be a mathematician / physicist emphasizing on particle physics and theoretical physics.
I just can't do it though. My dad refuses to pay for it (but gladly suggested a loan, even though he makes well over $100,000 per year) and I'd be in debt for quite some time after I graduate, if I even ever pay it off. My mom also can't afford it (I live with her, and she just bought a house and has bills to pay anyway). I just don't know what to do.

Is it possible to succeed without college? I mean I love math and electronics and physics, but without a degree, I'm nothing to the industries. I love calculus I, II, III, and IV and work on differential equations and the like all the time; I feel I can really contribute to that area of study. I just feel so hopeless, as the aid the school gave me didn't even come close to paying for tuition and fees; and the loans I would take out would place me over $50000 in debt over 6 years for a Bachelor's Degree in my area(s). Why wouldn't the government help me out? I aspire to become something extraodinary, but am hampered by financial restraints.

Does someone have any ideas? I don't mean to sound whiney or anything like that, but I've run into nothing.

Thanks guys,

~Tom

 

[skyline889]

I don't understand why you think the government owes you a college education? $50,000 is not bad at all for a college loan, I know a lot of people that are worse off than you. If private is too expensive for you, just attend a state school. Sorry to sound harsh, but it's just the truth, you also can't expect the college you choose to cover all your expenses, there are other students attending there that need financial aid as well.

 

[go_vtec]

Looks like you are in tough luck, parents making 6 figure income so you will be mostly not qualify for the grants for lower income family. If you really want to pursue college degree, you can still go ahead get your degree through other form of assistance... say scholarship, work-study, part time 2-year collge than transfer to 4 year university. Some of more practical approach may be joining Army or Navy reserve. My parents didn't helped me much either and I got through all my college through my own support (scholarship, part time job, teaching assistance and research assistance).

Frankly if you are interested in technical field (auto mechanic, technitian, ...), but if you want to be mathematician or physicist... you will need a degree in B.S. and a post-graduate degree (M.S. or Ph.D). I'm sorry to hear about your current situation, but some of my former students went to Air Force reserve to pay for their college. Something you should consider including reading all the fine prints too.

 

[granodemostasa]

I see you are in WI? right? the U of W is pretty good. in any case, considering how hard it is to succeed without that first big step, i think it's well worth the debt you'd go into.

There are some people who do succeed, several that i know either did it through family, or had something they stuck onto (example, a DIYer who builds for a living for along time may have more electrical engineering experience and know how than someone who went to college and learned it).

From others i get the impression that it takes alot of dedication and focus to succeed without a higher education. If i may, both of my parents are immigrants without a college education. nevertheless, they both worked at one firm for more than 20 years and gained alot of experience...resultingly, they have a nice house and we live in a neighborhood that's out of range for most college graduates.

 

[Blitzula]

Go to city college first and then to a state colllege. That was my path.

I did what I had to do without support-worked full time (delivered pizzas) and spread the education over seven years instead of four.

I only had $5K in loans (all of which I accumulated my last year of school, and mainly used to buy suits for interviews), grants and such paid for the rest. Today I'm a C.P.A. and earn a reasonable income.

I realize college is more expensive today than it was in 2004 when I graduated, but you can still do it and not drown in debt. But you have to be disciplined and willing to sacrifice.

Good luck....

 

[Squeek]

You, like many others in the same predicament, have no choice but to allow yourself to be enveloped in debt.

Thankfully, your should be able to pay it off relatively quickly upon graduation as you will presumably command a nice salary out of school. A few work terms would help soften the blow as well.

 

[mikeg]

If you have the scholastic ability to complete college in four (not six) years, and if you don't go for it, you'll probably regret such a decision for the rest of your days. Owing $50K that can be paid off over many years isn't something that should scare you into giving up a college education. How about applying to either less well known colleges that may give you more financial aid, or applying to state colleges where tuition is lower. Where there's a will, there's a way. Realize, however, that to really succeed in science and math, you'll need more advanced degrees than merely a four year baccalaureate. If you try everywhere to get aid, and if you have no family support or savings, then I'll bet that you'll find financial aid. But, the only way that you'll succeed is if you have a real ambition to persue your academic goals.

 

[lumanogin]

have u even applied for fafsa? don't just assume you won't be able to afford it even with aide. you'd be surprised how much they give out.

go for a good state school. and if you have to do it all in loans, go ahead. i'm sitting here on my last year of college, with 5 years of loans to pay off after i'm done with school. however i'm off to med school next year, and will be taking more huge loans. long road, but when i'm done..it'll be worth it when i can buy all the cans i want.

 

[Born2bwire]

You should only have to pay for your undergrad degree. Anybody doing graduate school should be able to obtain assistantships and get a free ride.

Look at public universities and talk with their financial aid office. You could go to a community college and get some of the basic core classes finished, and then transfer into a university. That could help save you some money. Subsidized loans do not accrue any interest while you are in school so they are always attractive. There's a cap to the subsidized loans though, I think maybe it's $5K a year for an undergrad. Work during the summers to build up savings for the year and see if you can't get on a work study while in session. And finally, ROTC is another alternative. I would look into the Air Force, they seem to have an appreciation for technical and scientific degrees. One of the guys in my research group is a captain in the Air Force (getting his oak leaves next year) and the USAAF is paying him officer's pay while he is on assistantship for getting his PhD. While there are some catches to the arrangement (like having to graduate within a certain amount of time), getting salary and a graduate education is a pretty good deal in my book.

Suffice to say, there are plenty of organizations that are willing to invest in you for you to get an education. If you are willing, try to take as much advantage of it as possible. I have done my best to try and pay my way through college. My parents have helped some, but I when I could do it myself I did. I have about $15K in loans from my bachelor's. All but $600 of that is subsidized and I consolidated it last year at 4.8%. So when I finally graduate from graduate school, there's no real worries about the accrued debt. If your parents can't help you with your education directly, see if they can help you with other expenses. Like a car, insurance, or just buying you new clothes. Tuition and books are always the obvious expenditures, but the cost of living adds up even more. So the first real lesson is to learn to be frugal.

 

[go_vtec]

Another thing to consider is actually getting a loan in a decent rate and pay up ASAP. Although $50K debt in education loan sounds a lot, but it actually isn't too bad. Most of my students in Computer Engineering and Electrical Engineering make around $45K to $60K a year. Typical income for math/physic majors may be little lower but it is fairly competitive if you are a good in what you do.

Granted, the 50K loan is not a chump change, but you can still pay back 10K to 15K a year to close the loan in mere 3-5 years. Trust me, lots of people get more debt buying expensive cars, electronics and waste on other luxury items. At least you will be investing towards your future.

 

[AndyRx7]

Tough situation, but there are a lot of others in your situation that manage to get through university. I've known several people that have worked several jobs while going to school full time, and it's doable (for some) but not easy. The hard thing is that 'succeeding extradinarily' is pretty difficult when you have no time for homework because you're working.

From the sounds of it though, you really like math and such, a lot more than most. I honestly can't think of many people in undergrad, even that like their subject, that would do it just for fun. If you truly feel that way, you might be making a big mistake by not getting there by any means possible.

What kind of grades do you have - could you get an entrance scholarship of some kind? Remember that if you manage to get high grades, you might be able to get significant scholarship income. Also, you shouldn't worry too much about grad school afterwards (if you want to be a mathematician or a physicist) because if you're good you should be able to fund it fully and accumulate no further debt.

Personally I say the risk is worth taking - sure you'll be in debt but honestly a lot of students are, and if you're careful you should be able to manage it. If you get summer jobs every year, and/or do co-op, and live frugally, you should be OK.

 

[antiant]

yes, you can be successfull without college, success comes in many forms, college degress/education are not sure fire ways that you'll be successful although it is stressed as such in this society...the decision is based on you though, ultimately and what you really want out of your life, if you haven't already, start questioning what it is you want and how you will do it, do some research...college fees are ridiculous, it's kind of sad, especially kids who really want to go to college yet cannot afford it, but at any rate you could do the part-time thing as mentioned and take a class or two, yeah it might be slow, but eventually you'll get there with motivation and determination if that's what you really want to do...personally i think colleges are nothing but degree factories, a 'business' of sorts, but i'll refrain from commenting further as i could go on and on about this, hope my response helped out somewhat though...and YOU DO HAVE A CHOICE...not everyone is automatically in debt when they go into college, think and think wisely

 

[dhp]

I suspect a combination of work study/loans/financial grants and other outside scholarships would pull you through in a state school

 

[Nerull]

Thanks a bunch guys. I guess I just wanted advice on what would happen with the debt situation. If there's a will, there's a way. I guess it'll just be the way things go. If you're wondering, I'll be attending UW-Eau Claire and then transferring to Madison or another school for my graduate education.

I don't think that the government should pay for my college, but for goodness sake. My German foreign exchange student friends barely even pay 1/5 of the amount I'll end up paying. I'm by no means anti-USA, but something needs to be done for education in this country and helping out with the middle class like my mother (because our FAFSA returned with crap; $2000 in loans and that's it). It's better than nothing (as they're subsidized), but it's just ridiculous that our country, possibly one of the (if not the) most civilized places on earth, is lax on education. I just find it disappointing, I guess.

Enough negativity though, I really will probably go to college (seeing as you guys say it's not bad if I get a decent job afterwards). That's the response I was looking for. I would probably regret such things in my latter years, so I'll take a risk and do it.

Thanks a bunch guys again, I really appreciate the advice.

~Tom

 

[Firam]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nerull I don't think that the government should pay for my college, but for goodness sake. My German foreign exchange student friends barely even pay 1/5 of the amount I'll end up paying. I'm by no means anti-USA, but something needs to be done for education in this country and helping out with the middle class like my mother (because our FAFSA returned with crap; $2000 in loans and that's it). It's better than nothing (as they're subsidized), but it's just ridiculous that our country, possibly one of the (if not the) most civilized places on earth, is lax on education. I just find it disappointing, I guess.

I try not to inject too many political statments in my post but that is a terrible attitude to have. You are going to cry to mommy goverment on how you have been wronged because they didn't offer you free money. The truth is that you aren't being Anti-American you are acting Pro-American, because Americans wants handout. They don't care where the money comes from they just want it in their pockets. I don't want to have to pay so you can go to college, that isn't my problem.

So quit your complaining, start filling out scholorships, and get a job. Start at a community college, work up to a state college, and if you are lucky get accepted into an private college for your post-grad work.