[wagninger]

Could you please shoot a photo of your speaker rig? It sounds really cool. I’d like to see it.

Here you go

 

[bigshot]

Ah! Thanks. I didn’t realize you were talking about a nearfield setup. That is a nice workstation. I can see why you don’t listen there most of the time though. A comfortable couch is an important part of a sound system!

 

[wagninger]

Ah! Thanks. I didn’t realize you were talking about a nearfield setup. That is a nice workstation. I can see why you don’t listen there most of the time though. A comfortable couch is an important part of a sound system!

I used to have a midfield setup as well, but kids man... I got moved into the smaller room

 

[gregorio]

Can be, but my average headphone is more expensive than my speaker setup (including measurement microphone and room treatment)

You seem to have done it the right way, modest speakers, properly setup with some appropriate room treatment, well done. Most audiophiles will spend a lot more on the amp and speakers but very little on setup and treatment. End result would most likely be a speaker system that cost far more that yours but in most respects probably performs worse!

G

 

[wagninger]

You seem to have done it the right way, modest speakers, properly setup with some appropriate room treatment, well done. Most audiophiles will spend a lot more on the amp and speakers but very little on setup and treatment. End result would most likely be a speaker system that cost far more that yours but in most respects probably performs worse!

G

Thanks, and speaking from experience: even the showpiece systems, like the B&W speakers with equally expensive amps and source gear in hifi shops, are in completely untreated rooms. Only when you ask where they hide the good stuff, you’ll be shown a completely treated room and a more bang-for-the-buck system that sounds great

 

[Ghoostknight]

im not a sound engineer and not big into theory here but as a somewhat subjectivist i explain why speakers (specially flat studio monitors) are the way to go like this

1. it can be easly measured FLAT so there is always a very good reference point between systems
2. if the sound engineer has somewhat normal ears and he mixes on a flat system it will sound natural on other (flat) systems and for most other ears, and if other ears differ than these people are already used to their "different sound perception", so it will also sound neutral to them in most cases.
3. if playbacked on a not flat system it will just sound as neutral to the specific listener since he is used to his non flat system

these points fall completely apart if engineer1 mixes on headphone1 and listener1 listens on headphone2,
also our ear canals react completely different so even if engineer1 and listener1 uses headphone1
it still doesnt sound right since our ear canals + a specific headphone makes "one unit" so to say, so in theory there are probably not two persons on the world that have the same combination
this can be greatly avoided with speakers since sound coming out of the distance "always" sound neutral to us since our ear canal reacts/differs the sound just as usual, this is not the case with headphones since each pair of headphones react differently with your specific ear canal

and one point i have to agree with that was mentioned earlier is that bass sounds vastly different and if i would imagine myself using headphones to mix i would also overdue bass and it would blast with speakers
you can probably "workaround" this soemwhat if you exactly know the bass differences between headphones and speakers

the only way i see to mix reliable on headphones is if you actually just not measured/corrected the specific headphones for example to the harman curve but to your specific ears so you get as close as possible to flat measured speakers and then there is still the bass issue (and other issues like imaging)


--

i myself listen to room corrected studio monitors just as my normal playback device, i have a little house curve applied (+1,5db under 100hz and -2db at 10-20khz)
and i actually think studio monitors is the way to go if you can correct them to your taste, no need in trying hundreds of crooked frequency responses in "hifi-speakers" if you can tailor the same just to your liking from a good reference point

the only benefit i see in hifi speakers is that these are mostly corrected in such a way that they sound on LOW volume better than studio monitors.... i experienced this myself, studio monitors just sound really good if you are playing back in the 75-85db region (where also engineer listen to and therefor its the region that sound most natural)

 

[Ghoostknight]

but i have to say i was not a headphone fan UNTIL i switched to a Aune X7s heaphone amp (i had a FIIO E10k TC before) with my "cheap" DT880 250Ohms, the amp swap made a huge difference imo (while many say its not the case) maybe its the class A design of the X7s idk tbh

but this amp swap made me really start liking/digging headphone use, i still prefer my speaker setup but headphone is since then a good alternative for nightly audio
(i also use a tweaked harman curve) and i start considering buying more expensive headphones somewhat soon

i can somewhat see why sound engineer would prefer (or atleast side-check, well side-checking is probably always a good idea if you wanna get a idea of translation to other systems/setups) with headphones, for example checking vocals in specific
so its probably not a good idea to say headphones are generally worse compared to speakers, it depends on the use case

tho i still think to check a "whole" track speakers is the way to go and i get why pretty much all studios use speakers in the first place

in the end speakers are the most natural sound source since it also mimics "real sounds" (well stereo maybe made this a bit worse compared to mono) but headphones are a very good alternative, specially for quite listening (for others )

 

[hakunamakaka]

but i have to say i was not a headphone fan UNTIL i switched to a Aune X7s heaphone amp (i had a FIIO E10k TC before) with my "cheap" DT880 250Ohms, the amp swap made a huge difference imo (while many say its not the case) maybe its the class A design of the X7s idk tbh

but this amp swap made me really start liking/digging headphone use, i still prefer my speaker setup but headphone is since then a good alternative for nightly audio
(i also use a tweaked harman curve) and i start considering buying more expensive headphones somewhat soon

i can somewhat see why sound engineer would prefer (or atleast side-check, well side-checking is probably always a good idea if you wanna get a idea of translation to other systems/setups) with headphones, for example checking vocals in specific
so its probably not a good idea to say headphones are generally worse compared to speakers, it depends on the use case

tho i still think to check a "whole" track speakers is the way to go and i get why pretty much all studios use speakers in the first place

in the end speakers are the most natural sound source since it also mimics "real sounds" (well stereo maybe made this a bit worse compared to mono) but headphones are a very good alternative, specially for quite listening (for others )

Aune X7s is very overlooked amp. While Topping "breaks" the records in SINAD charts, Aune has produced budged class A amp which actually sounds good.

 

[redrol]

Agreed, I have an Aune B1S class A amp it IS my best and most musical and holographic amp, above toppings and such. Really quite incredible mojo.

 

[Ghoostknight]

Aune X7s is very overlooked amp. While Topping "breaks" the records in SINAD charts, Aune has produced budged class A amp which actually sounds good.

i did not try low impedance headphones with it, im wondering if the higher output impedance in combination with high impedance headphones is the reason it sounds so good, i think topping has mostly 1 ohm output impedance while the X7s has something like 10 if i remember right
or its really the class A design, where i think its the cheapest class A headphone amp around

but i agree, it does something magical, specially compared to my old FIIO E10k TC which sounds really "flat/boring" in comparison and i got the X7s 2021 used for 140€, best buy of 2022 and still wondering why the previous owner wanted to get rid of it
im also really happy with the Aune X8 XVIII i got new before that, it sounds also better than a topping D10(gen1) or FIIO E10K, specially noticeable in the highs/treble, im also wondering why Aune is such a underdog but im quite happy i found them in late 2022

 

[redrol]

I had to look around but apparenly the B1S has an OI of 1ohm.

 

[Ghoostknight]

I had to look around but apparenly the B1S has an OI of 1ohm.

hmm interesting, what impedance headphones you use?

 

[tdogzthmn]

I'm sure this has been addressed 100x.... But i am struggling here being new on these forums with this topic now.

I have always preferred properly placed studio monitors to the "best" headphones for listening.... (using the same pre-amps/amps/DAC/pathway).... Dont get me wrong i love my headphones, but nothing compares to my Neuman monitors!

Am i missing something or are studio monitors the way to to go?

I've found each category to have its strengths and weaknesses as other have pointed out. Started out with headphones due to necessity/budget - it was much more cost effective to try out different types of headphones to learn about personal preference and develop better critical listening skills. Now I'm at a point where I have the space to get more into speakers I have grown an appreciation for what speakers do well. It's likely that if you are someone that has a speaker system you're also able to have some nice headphones as well, so no need to be either or.

In recent years I have found myself doing more music listening with speakers than headphones. The visceral impact of speakers and their sound staging generally seems superior in my experience. A pair of 8" woofers reproducing kick drums is never going to have the same feeling as it would on a headphone. On the other hand a headphone might allow you to hear more detail and nuance in a mix simply because the driver are so close to the ear and without room coloration.

As long as someone is enjoying their music listening experience its all good.

 

[Brandon7s]

Speakers are 1000% better than headphones without HRTF for me, but using Impulcifer has actually made me prefer my headphones more than my speakers these days. It provides the best of both worlds: the natural FR, tonality, imagining, and spatial-cues that make speakers so great, combined with the portability, isolation, and general convenience of headphones. Plus, you can MUCH more easily correct issues caused by room acoustics after capturing the IRs than you would ever be able to achieve with real-world acoustic treatment. The only thing its missing is head-tracking, but I guess you could get a Smyth Realizer if you really want that feature.

 

[redrol]

hmm interesting, what impedance headphones you use?

My lowest impedance IEM is about 7 OHM. Softears RSV.